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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

FIL says he's offended. Is he right?

153 replies

dustyparadeground · 29/08/2020 16:16

So, UK husband with Italian wife. 41 years together. FIL and MIL in Italy have bought land and FIL and BIL built a large villa outside Rome. Basically it is 2 semi detached houses that Italian parents apparently often do called a "bifamiliare" one house for my BIL to live in and one for my wife and I to use when we go and possibly live in when we retire. Obviously very generous although there was no discussion about it, it was simply presented as a fait accompli. Which I have always thought a bit weird. So we visited last month and I happened to refer to it as "my house" and my FIL instantly said "wasn't I ashamed to call it my house? I should at least just say my wife's house" We were in public with a few others from extended family so subject was changed. However this has been bothering me for a couple of weeks now. Especially as we have ourselves sunk 50K into this project. I should just add he was certainly quite cogent and aware of what he was saying at the time. AIBU?

OP posts:
Bananacloud · 29/08/2020 16:18

He was very very rude!!!

Honeybobbin · 29/08/2020 16:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ConstantlySeekingHappiness · 29/08/2020 16:20

Well it’s not just your house is it.

I would find it rude if my husband referred to a house as ‘his’ in this way.

Pipandmum · 29/08/2020 16:20

I think there may be a cultural difference here. You should have said 'our house'. Maybe your fil was just being protective of his daughter. What does your wife say?

Irelate · 29/08/2020 16:21

It was extremely rude of FIL to say this, especially in public.
But boggles the mind that you referred to it as 'my' house.
Neither of you covered yourselves in glory, so all in all, I'd forget about it.

D4rwin · 29/08/2020 16:22

I don't think I follow. Why are you supposed to be ashamed to call it your house? Is it because someone else built it?

honeylulu · 29/08/2020 16:23

Maybe he would have been ok with "our house" I.e. you and wife's house. "My house" sounds a bit like "I'm the man, I make the money so it's MINE".

But obviously the flip side of that is that it's therefore not solely your wife's house either.

Who owns it legally though? You mention contributing to the build costs but are your/ your wife's names on the deeds?

TOFO1965 · 29/08/2020 16:23

He sounds a lot of fun... 50k?! You're a generous man! I feel for you here, and hope your wife is firmly on side.

Butchyrestingface · 29/08/2020 16:23

FIL instantly said "wasn't I ashamed to call it my house? I should at least just say my wife's house"

Get in there, Italian feminist papa-in-law. Grin

Seriously though, who owns this property? Surely if you and your wife have spunked £50k on it, you've got deeds, etc to prove ownership.

And how can asking you to part with £50k be presented as a fait accompli?

Cocomarine · 29/08/2020 16:23

YABU to say that something was both a fait accompli and something you spent £50K on 🤷🏻‍♀️

Isn’t the best person to answer this tour wife?
She will have knowledge of:

  • Italian culture
  • any nuances of language (whether this exchange was in English, Italian, or English with Italian nuances
  • her family’s culture
  • her father’s personality

With very little to go on - if £50K doesn’t represent the majority of the cost, or even if it does and your wife has contributed more of it - then yes, I’d be irritated by you claiming it as “my house.”

AvoidingRealHumans · 29/08/2020 16:25

I would let it go. As a pp says, could be a cultural thing but I wouldn't have referred to it as my house and he shouldn't have replied how he did.
Both in the wrong

MitziK · 29/08/2020 16:27

There's obviously an important nuance that you've accidentally missed in this. I'd accept that you have offended him unintentionally and it wouldn't hurt to apologise and say that you didn't mean to do so/you'll be careful to word it better in future.

And yes, you've put money in. I assume that there are documents to say this. And you've got somewhere better than you would with just the fifty grand. So I'd let the my/our/my wife's house thing slide in the interests of international familial diplomacy.

Original poster
dustyparadeground · 29/08/2020 16:29

I take the point that "casa mia" is a bit different from "casa nostra" but believe me this is no feminist!

OP posts:
RainbowDash101 · 29/08/2020 16:30

How much of the value does £50k cover? Have they gifted the house to you and your wife, or just your wife ? Or is it still owned by your in-laws?

Original poster
dustyparadeground · 29/08/2020 16:32

The money was put in after the land was bought and plans approved. My wife just asked if we could match my BIL's contribution which we just about could despite our mortgage in the UK.

OP posts:
Ponoka7 · 29/08/2020 16:33

It should have been referred to as 'our house' surely?

Cocomarine · 29/08/2020 16:34

What does your wife think about the comment?

Topseyt · 29/08/2020 16:35

@AvoidingRealHumans

I would let it go. As a pp says, could be a cultural thing but I wouldn't have referred to it as my house and he shouldn't have replied how he did. Both in the wrong
I wouldn't just let something like that go if I had sunk £50k of my own money into it.

OP, who actually legally owns the house. Have steps been taken to protect your share in it, i.e. to recognise and preserve your £50k investment at least.

He was very rude. I would be tempted to point that out at least.

D4rwin · 29/08/2020 16:38

I do remember the aunt of my Italian ex boyfriend referring to her ground floor flat as the "family flat", when in a similar vein she had invested in the building of a three storey block with three apartments though sort of one house as there was definitely an internal stair case. This was in a small Italian village. It was ear marked for her retirement. BUT having left Italy in her 20s due to the misogyny and lack of opportunity she felt there was she has no intention of retiring there especially as she leads a pretty busy city life. She intends to wait on HER aunt dying, middle flat, before discussing selling the property with her cousin who has the top flat. I say flats, but obviously they are quite typical Italian homes. I thought it was due to her lack of interest in the place. Maybe that sort of house is something that's "family" and not personal property?

BoomBoomsCousin · 29/08/2020 16:46

I take the point that "casa mia" is a bit different from "casa nostra" but believe me this is no feminist!

There’s more than the feminist angle on that. If he sees it as a sort of early inheritance he’s passing down to his daughter and presumably, eventually, grandchildren, it could quite simply be about you appearing to appropriate his money that, in his mind, he has passed on to his blood.

QuestionMarkNow · 29/08/2020 16:50

My first reaction is that law on martiage is different in Italy than in the UK.
In the UK if you get divorced, everything is put in the common pot so yes it is as much yours as it is hers.
But In france for example, you can have totally separated finances and when you divorce, if the house is on her name only, then it would hers only. Is it possible your FIL is expecting the same ting to happen because thats the orm in Italy?

Original poster
dustyparadeground · 29/08/2020 16:51

I have never seen any legal documents. I think that one house (one half of the whole villa) is owned by my (single) BIL and the other half by my wife. We are married (41 years) so I certainly feel like it's our house. But it would be kicking a wasp's nest to insist on seeing documents. TBH the back story here is a bad relationship with FIL

OP posts:
Original poster
dustyparadeground · 29/08/2020 16:52

QuestionMarkNow

Married in Finsbury Town Hall

OP posts:
QuestionMarkNow · 29/08/2020 16:54

It also looks like he has had a similar reaction than my onw (french) parents regarding inheritance etc...
In France inheritance is always the given to ONE of the partners and is never put in the common pot (So if my parents leave me some inheritance, it is mine and only mine under french law).
I suspect something similar is at play there.

Now, what I would like to understand is why have you not asked your DW about it and clarify that instead of coming on here where few people will have any idea of how intalian law and culture is? Confused

CuriousaboutSamphire · 29/08/2020 16:55

Then learn your lesson. Use careful language around your ILs, stop stepping on toes.

And speak to your wife. As in have a discussion with her that does not involve any hint that you feel insulted or ripped off but does explain that you meant no offence but are now bemused!

If it is legally her house in Italian law then you may need further discussion, depending on how your 41 year old marriage is going!