AIBU to wonder what conspiracy theories you think may hold some weight?

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Generally speaking I hate conspiracy theories, but is there anything out there that’s passed off as a conspiracy theory that you think holds some weight? I personally have some questions about the assassination of JFK.

@nancybotwinbloom a plane hits a building designed to be blast proof and causes significant damage. There are eye witnesses and cctv showing the plane hitting. And plenty of plane debris. However your 'science-y' husband has decided that the hole wasn't big enough. Is that right?

Does your son not think that the people planning the accident might not of thought of those points?

@SheWranglesRugRats

Does your son not think that the people planning the accident might not of thought of those points?

I’ve not a clue. As I’ve quite clearly stated (more than once) I’m not au fait with conspiracy theories or the science behind aviation impacts. Just repeating what he’s mentioned.

The wrong people (actual culprit) of 9/11 was blamed because of diplomatic reasons and the oil trade

Jeffrey Epstein was murdered in jail to stop him naming powerful accomplices

I used to think princess Diana was murdered but having read a lot more about it, I don't think so. Although I do believe there were people seriously considering it and some of the strange things about the case could be explained eg other cars being nearby and vanishing because she was being watched and followed by parties who didn't want to be known

They also found millions of other intact items from the remains of both the planes and the contents of the buildings. Why would finding the passports of people who were very definitely on board those flights be all that unfathomable? Are you also one of the people who claims a missile and not a plane hit the Pentagon, based on nothing other than the shape of the hole it made, and completely discounting the eye witness testimony of the hundreds of unconnected and independent witnesses who actually watched a plane fly into it?

@XDownwiththissortofthingX, I don't disagree with this generally and I have no doubt that 9/11 happened as it unfolded on our screens, no conspiracy there, however, to find those passports two days in did make me . They were still in the rescue / recovery phase, concentrating on trying to find survivors. The debris of the planes would have been buried under tons and tons of rubble, the planes were the epicentre of the fires and anything combustible would have been lucky to survive. The millions of things they found and sorted were over a period of months, not two days. If true, it was an incredibly fortunate find.

I think one of the problems with the Pentagon is, people are too used to that type of cartoon based plane shaped hole that they think they should have seen it on the sided of the building. They forget (or didn't know) the walls were 600mm thick re-inforced concrete and plane wings are made of aluminium, and would have disintegrated due to the physics of the crash.

@FudgeBrownie2019 thank you

@FarTooSkinny I never mentioned my husband?

He says that a plane impacting the ground/a building at the speed the Pentagon flight was going on the direction the flight was heading would have caused more damage, more debris and more of a wide impact crater; the tail and engines of the plane would have caused more damage, too, at a different point because as the nose hit the building the tail would have hit a higher point.

Very doubtful the tail would make any dent, a bit of aluminium with a hinge in it is not going to impact reinforced concrete.

Honestly, the 9/11 "truthers" make my head ache.

My favourite is that the buildings collapsed because they had explosives in them. Apparently there were some renovations happening and actually this was when all the explosives were installed, because they fell just like a controlled demolition.

The sheer number of people who would have had to have been involved with that, not to mention the time it would have taken, and the risk of having thousands of people working in a building rigged with explosives for months before they were ready to set it off? Anyone who believes such nonsense, please contact me, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

the tail and engines of the plane would have caused more damage, too, at a different point because as the nose hit the building the tail would have hit a higher point.

I take it your son isn't studying structural engineering or physics?

What does "sciency" mean, though? That could cover anything from "PhD in structural engineering and recognised as an expert in their field" to "person who likes to drone on in the pub because they watch YouTube videos and fancy themselves an expert."

I did Physics and Chemistry A Level and my MSc was in an unrelated science field, so I'm "sciency". But I would never consider myself qualified to comment on engineering-related things. Being "sciency" really doesn't mean anything.

Britney Spears is being held prisoner by her dad, and also that her real singing voice is more like Christina Aguilera, but in order to be different she had to develop the nasal type of tones that we are familiar with.

I’ll be completely honest and admit I’m not the scientist that DS is

And what kind of "scientist" is he then? Because from reading what he said, he doesn't sound particularly knowledgeable on the matter. Does he have any expertise in structural engineering or aircrash investigation? Reading "endlessly" on a topic doesn't make you an expert or a scientist.

@Didkdt

Covid 19 is starting to feel a little less evolutionarily and slightly more man made Jeffrey Epstein might be described as a sloppy attempt at a cover up. Professor Kelly but that may be because I was getting into Spooks at the time, and Blair was involved There was a thread on here a while ago on when exactly did you think Mandela died it was spooky. I think Bin Laden is dead and I don't think Hitler's ego would have allowed him to go into hiding I occasionally wonder if Proncess Anastasia survived and the UK Royal family did turn their back on her There's the conspicuous about the Queen and the missing aboriginal children in Australia

How?

The doubts about the Pentagon 9/11 explosion aren't too surprising as on the day it was initially being reported on the local news as "a small explosion, most likely a car bomb". The cctv footage from local hotels, and a gas station was confiscated, also on the day it happened. CCTV footage was finally released in 2006 after several FOI requests, but it's very blurry, and doesn't clearly show an aeroplane.

@nancybotwinbloom sorry I quoted the wrong name. And I meant son not husband.

It clearly is a conspiracy, the illuminati making me quote the wrong person

@FudgeBrownie2019

Your sciency advisor may not realise that whilst aircraft structures are very strong when exposed to the forces they are designed to cope with on a day to day basis inflight they are really pretty poor at coping with non-normal stuff such as impacting the ground...

Nervous fliers look away now..

If you've ever had the misfortune to look at and/or handle the wreckage of an aircraft that has suffered a high speed impact with the ground you'll find about the only major chunks which survive in an obvious, quickly recognisable form tend to be things like major landing gear components and engines, pretty much everything else gets shredded into small pieces that won't carry a lot of kinetic energy.

As others have said the tail of the 757 that hit the ground adjacent to the Pentagon would be a few pieces of thin gauge aluminium or similar metal..it's not going to slice through a reinforced building...

@notimagain this is an eminently sensible and well reasoned post. However facts and logic are not welcome in the world of the conspiracy theorist. Wild speculation and massive improbabilities are the way to go

Trouble is, the media foments most conspiracy theories by putting out "facts" with a side dish of speculation which gets fixated on a "lore" in the early stages of a major incident.

9/11 is something I've looked into and I certainly have questions - Bin Laden being named immediately and having links to the CIA? Not adequately explained for sure.

Building 7 reported as having collapsed by a BBC anchor with it still standing on the "live feed" being shown behind her? Also not adequately explained.

As for the physics etc - not qualified to comment .......

Bad shit happens. It can be exploited and manipulated by the unscrupulous for any number of agendas. Whether it happens by design or accident is very difficult to prove or discern these days. Digital manipulation means we really can't trust our own senses sometimes......deepfakes anyone?

The debris of the planes would have been buried under tons and tons of rubble, the planes were the epicentre of the fires and anything combustible would have been lucky to survive. The millions of things they found and sorted were over a period of months, not two days. If true, (the passports were) an incredibly fortunate find

There's not much of the 9/11 conspiracy theories I've got time for, but I can see the point here

It makes me wonder if the killers somehow managed to leave their passports behind in the airport, planning for them to be found in the hope of getting the "glory" for what they'd done once they were named?

Also I believe some of the alleged terrorists named in the press were found alive, well and pretty pissed off in the days after the attack.

Actually, scratch my post at 19.15 ... I don't know who originally said passports were found in the Pentagon rubble, but I found this: govinfo.library.unt.edu/911/staff_statements/staff_statement_1.pdf

"Four of the hijackers’ passports have survived in whole or in part. Two were recovered from the crash site of United Airlines Flight 93 in Pennsylvania. One belonged to a hijacker on American Airlines Flight 11. A passerby picked it up and gave it to an NYPD detective shortly before the World Trade Center towers collapsed. A fourth passport was recovered from luggage that did not make it from a Portland flight to Boston onto the connecting flight, which was American Airlines Flight 11. In addition to these four, some digital copies of the hijackers’ passports were recovered in post-9/11 operations"

@FarTooSkinny

facts and logic are not welcome in the world of the conspiracy theorist. Wild speculation and massive improbabilities are the way to go

Yep...agreed. By virtue of my day job and circumstance a few weeks post 9/11 I ended up sharing beers and having several long conversations with a few colleagues of one of the crew members killed that day ...As a result the whole "9/11 was a conspiracy" industry hits a bit of a nerve... I've no intention of going any further down that rabbit hole...

@OldQueen1969

Building 7 reported as having collapsed by a BBC anchor with it still standing on the "live feed" being shown behind her? Also not adequately explained.

This is classic conspiracy bollocks. The BBC didn't do this. And why would the BBC be in on it anyway? Do you think those 'at the top' said - "hang on, we must tell the BBC our plans so they can then tell the world about it before it happens" - what complete and utter shit

@notimagain I'm with you in this. I find it extremely distasteful when the know nothings spout bollocks about not just 9/11 but the others events where people were murdered by terrorist activity.