My boss essentially warned me for racial insensitivity - aibu?

[Sakalibre]

Firstly, my maternal grandparents were born in Morroco and my paternal grandparents were born in India.

I'm in my 2nd year of a grad scheme (financial services).

Last week, we were given a presentation which addressed systematic racism in relation to the BLM movement.

I am the only female in my team of 15 and the only person under 30 so have a unique perspective.

At the end of the presentation, I very sensitively and tactfully stated I personally do not like being viewed as a victim purely based on the colour of my skin. I tried to say this in a constructive way that some non-white people could take offence to some of the things that had been stated in the presentation. I emphasised this was just an opinion

Anyway, I had a 1 to 1 meeting with my line manager following this presentation and I was given what can only be described as a very stern telling off. I tried to explain my position but he was having none of it. In the end, I actually apologised to him. Which I regret now.

Over the weekend I've given it all a lot of thought. Why should my feelings be discounted? Why shut down the conversation?

WIBU? Should I go over this again with my boss tomorrow?

[quote cinammonbuns]@P0lO I would urge you to actually read the thread before writing such a stupid comment.[/quote]
I have thank you. I stand by what I said. The OP was very clear. You have a totally different perspective, that's fine, just like it's fine for me to think you should have been more thorough with your reading comprehension and your answers. If you answers were questioned so much, as they were, doesn't it make you question if your contributions were well considered, appropriate or make sense?

Complete bollocks, success has far more to do with social class than the colour of your skin. YANBU

Except the colour of your skin will put you in your own class, and if you're white you can move classes more easily.

I'm going to say this from a white perspective, but as far as I can tell, Asians in general are associated with hard work and school success, whereas Black of African origins are more associated with crime and low school success. Like many people associate Muslims with terrorism.

In that sense, and again, not speaking from experience, so I'm happy to be told otherwise, it seems to me that how different groups experience racism will be different.

Op, you could have said that you didn’t feel like a ‘victim’ and didn’t want to be pigeon holed as such, but you realise that there are those who have felt that their race prevented them progressing. This would mean that some of your colleagues would not have the excuse to deny racism .You could have said that you were happy that these issues were being discussed and left it at that.
Tbh , It’s very difficult to determine who is in the ‘wrong’ without being privy to the conversation and being aware of the tone used by the parties involved.
Maybe you felt that he was being patronising and he may have felt that you were being deliberately obtuse and ‘ruining ‘ his ‘ virtual signalling’ moment.

Well what word would you have preferred they use? Survivor, as is sometimes used for women who have experienced domestic abuse?

There has to be a word that means "the opposite of the perpetrator" when describing who has experienced unfairness.

He was being unreasonable to tell you off about it, but YABU for disliking the word. Just because you personally don't feel victimised, doesn't mean it's not a legitimate term when talking about systemic discrimination.

emptydreamer: I am assumed to be my own children's nanny pretty much in every "middle-class" activity group we are attending. I am Eastern European, with a very thick accent, the children are native English speakers. I don't think that those assumptions are made with some inherent malice. It is just a stereotype which is probably true in many cases. It'd be really bizarre if some middle aged white man tried to shush me and insisted that I need to feel like a victim in these situations

I’m sorry that “nanny assumption” happens to you, even if you do appear to handle it well.

@Sakalibre this article by Trevor Phillips (sorry, pay-walled, dunno if someone can come up with a share token) might resonate with you:
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/culture-warriors-want-control-not-equality-56knrgklh

Phillips takes issue with (among other things) the idea that you have to conform to a certain picture of how people from ethnic minorities should behave before you're allowed to complain about racism. (He should know: having been chair of the racial equalities commission, he's currently being "cancelled" by those on the left of the Labour Party because apparently he doesn't hold the right views about race!)

And may I just say- nannying is an honourable trade!

Agree @Lweji- different minorities are viewed differently

It's not about it being an insult hmm Labelling someone as a "victim" casts them in a passive role, simply done to.

You've just demonstrated my point.
A victim should be the person it happens to, out of choice. Nobody chooses to be a victim of racism or sexism, no matter how hard they fight it.

It's the old: if you're a victim of a mugging, it casts no shame on you, but being a victim of, say, domestic violence does.

I suppose it's one of those things, but it only happens when the perpetrator is from the dominant group, have you noticed?

I’m wondering who prepared the presentation if they didn’t realise that casting non white people automatically as victims is in itself racist...

I think the answer you got is coming from a very nice mix of virtue signalling, sexism, issues with ‘young people who know nothing’ and... racism.
I’m not sure if you can actually address that with your boss. Depending on who has prepared the presentation (I’m assuming HR), I would contact them and raise the points you have made, incl been told that your experience isnt relevant (which is racist - how on Earth ca someone say to a person who is not white how to feel about casting a non white person as a victim???).

Bear in mind that you might be facing a huge issue, deep systemic racism within the company which you will struggle to highlight/raise if it’s running deep.

A victim should be the person it happens to, not by their choice
Sorry.

@Sakalibre

BTW what was wrong with me saying where my grandparents were from? It was my way of pointing out I'm not white.

There is nothing wrong with your first post. I think some people didn't read it properly so didn't grasp what you meant. It was obvious why you included your grandparents origin.

In all honesty, I think anyone watching a presentation should be entitled to give feedback about what they thought of the presentation without getting a stern telling off from their boss.

OP, I think you should definitely follow this up.

@Sakalibre

Write a reasoned response on paper to the manager; copy to HR and to union!

I'm really sorry this happened to you.

You quite reasonably thought this was a genuine attempt to address unconscious bias, corporate racism etc.

But it was probably more of a box-ticking attempt to mitigate risk to the company from claims of institutional racism.

If you want to work for a genuinely altruistic organisation, you'll probably need to look at the sort of place that doesn't have a graduate training scheme.

In the meantime, I would definitely keep a diary. Assuming no white people were reprimanded for expressing their views, it smells like racism to me.

@Lweji

It's not about it being an insult hmm Labelling someone as a "victim" casts them in a passive role, simply done to.

You've just demonstrated my point.
A victim should be the person it happens to, out of choice. Nobody chooses to be a victim of racism or sexism, no matter how hard they fight it.

It's the old: if you're a victim of a mugging, it casts no shame on you, but being a victim of, say, domestic violence does.

I suppose it's one of those things, but it only happens when the perpetrator is from the dominant group, have you noticed?

I'm not sure exactly what you mean here, but the point is that the perpetrator is the dominant group

"You are the victim, we have the power, you will get rights if we decide to give them to you"

Did you say this in front of everyone? Imo companies don't like any criticism in front of people. Maybe raising it quietly with your line manager would do, but not to openly criticise them in front of your colleagues

Firstly, my maternal grandparents were born in Morroco and my paternal grandparents were born in India.

How interesting that you cannot spell Morocco correctly, yet you claim that your maternal grandparents were born there.

"You are the victim, we have the power, you will get rights if we decide to give them to you"

I take your point and agree that it could be presented that way.
That is what I've been asking the OP.
How was it portrayed. She only mentioned the word and that it was mentioned several times.
My question was how it was used.

@Lweji- interesting perspective re the use of the word ‘victim’
I would be interested to know whether OP’s boss actually used the word ‘victim’ or if op felt that she was regarded as a victim by dint of her race

Write a reasoned response on paper to the manager; copy to HR and to union!

Totally agree with this ^

Your manager is a bully and an arsehole and I think you need to show him you can see his intimidation for what it is. I got this kind of shit from male bosses ALL the time in my 20s, and thankfully a lot less now I’m middle-aged. Some men will never miss an opportunity to exercise power over a young woman. YANBU at ALL - and well done for speaking up.

Are you Priti Patel, OP?

YANBU

I hate this stuff. It seems there is now orthodoxy on a range of opinions, particularly around identity, that no-one is allowed to divert from. You are entitled to your view. Especially as a person of colour on issues of racism.

People need to stop being afraid of there being a variety of views and instead embrace discussion.

You say you were ”told to shut the fuck up”

Really - at work?

How interesting that you cannot spell Morocco correctly, yet you claim that your maternal grandparents were born there.

Don’t even know where to start with this. Some of the replies on here are batshit!