To think that people who 'want to switch off' from BLM are the ones who have chips on their shoulders?

[Moomin8]

I use a cloth nappy group on FB. A few days ago someone accidentally (I think, I didn't see it) made an offensive remark.

The next day one of the admins, very sensibly set up a thread for people to post educational resources relating to the BLM movement which encourage us all to think about how we can be a part of the solution rather than the problem. The issue of course, is that a lot of people don't even know that they are contributing to systemic racism.

That was fine until someone posted a comment saying this wasn't nappy related and they just wanted a space for nappies etc. After that it turned into a bit of a bun fight and got quite nasty.

There were only a few people who seemed to have this view but it left me wondering, why would someone complain about something positive that we could all learn from. Cloth nappy communities include people from BAME backgrounds (obviously) and why would you not want to take action against something that could hurt other people?

Also, good rule of thumb; anyone who wants to learn about race, societal structure, bigotry, BAME empowerment etc, GO TO A DECENT, ESTABLISHED, NON-FRINGE SOURCE and read. Don’t listen to a big bunch of white folk competitively explaining racism to each other in diaper group for woke cookies. They don’t know shit. They’re just performing:

FYI, one of the people posting on the thread was a black woman, another was Asian. They were giving their experiences and posting what they felt to be relevant links.

And most of us were reading them and not preaching.

Until 2 people came along and said this shouldn't be here.

I don't get it. Your whole thread is about how you don't understand that "other people" don't understand. Yet you demonstrate a huge lack of comprehension yourself.

I also agree that you sound quite young. It's not a critique but with age comes the understanding of other POV.

Don’t listen to a big bunch of white folk competitively explaining racism to each other in diaper group for woke cookies. They don’t know shit. They’re just performing:

Well, that's not what was happening as I have just explained.

@ConstanceSalinger it's not that I don't accept that other people see the world differently. It's more that I can't see why people object to social reform being talked about.

Saying that all babies wee and poo is a bit like saying all lives matter

Not really. One is factual and the other is either someone being racist or very very naive.

@Moomin8

FYI, one of the people posting on the thread was a black woman, another was Asian. They were giving their experiences and posting what they felt to be relevant links.

And most of us were reading them and not preaching.

Until 2 people came along and said this shouldn't be here.

So two BAME people talking, a bunch of other people talking, a bunch of people milling around in the middle and two people objecting? Most of them probably terrified of saying something wrong.

Then you rushed over here to tell us all about it and virtue signal some more.

What positive value do you think any of this has? What good does this achieve? Your motives are obvious. It’s sickening.

@AriettyJones - if my posts or even thread are as offensive as you say then please do report them to MNHQ and they will get taken down.

No I want to tell you WHY it’s so offensive.

This is so out of hand.

It's more that I can't see why people object to social reform being talked about

No one does, on here, on there, anywhere. They objected to it being discussed on a FB page about cloth nappies. You have missed the point of your own thread for 9 pages now.

anyone who wants to learn about race, societal structure, bigotry, BAME empowerment etc, GO TO A DECENT, ESTABLISHED, NON-FRINGE SOURCE and read.

Ok. Do you have any suggestions for these things?

For example, how do you identify what is a 'non fringe' source?

I can see why people are frustrated, it's become a bit of a circus show in the media atm. I disagree with the vitriol to the police, the criminal damage being caused, I think the violent protesters who participated need to have they're furloughed money stopped because of being violent and throwing rocks at police horses makes you a knob,

However that being said, BLM needs safe spaces and people need to be educated. If they don't want to be educated in a nappy group (which I think is fair enough) then scroll past.

What I hate about the whole thing is the hypocrisy, you have people championing the blm movement who turn around and go to primark who's ethics and treatment of the people making they're clothes are dubious. These are ethnic minority's, often women and under age children working for below minimum wage in sweat shops because they have no other choice.

I don't support the movement, but I think that black lives matter and support the change that needs to happen. But I think at this point the black lives matter movement is becoming a violent mob, maybe it is a minority but for me it has too many negative actions for me to support the organisation.

Once again for those who will flame me, I believe black lives matter, and changes need to be made. But I don't think violence and criminal activity is the way to get there

@Moomin8

For example, how do you identify what is a 'non fringe' source?

If you don’t know the answers, why are you so damn sure that everyone needs to be “educated” in a Marxist/anarchist extremist ideology in a nappy group?

Sticking up for someone else's human rights is not "politicising" every space. Your rights apparently matter, why shouldn't anyone else's?

Human rights are definitely political, just ask people in hong kong!

Did you know not all people even agree on what human rights are. Some people (billions) in some places (vast swathes of the globe) think that democracy and human rights for women, children, gays, atheists, foreigners etc are offensive imperialistic western ideas that YOU have no right to impose on them.

I’m not sure that it was ‘Marxist ideology’ tbh. It was links to Instagram accounts and articles.

Like this;

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.scarymommy.com/black-child-friends/%3famp

Is this virtue signalling, ‘sickening’ and ‘offensive’?

What qualifies as Marxist? Arrietty, you sound very angry. There have been loads of threads like this.

I think in general, this kind of political post on a group with nothing to do with the topic is irritating- no matter how noble the cause, it’s a bit like going to a clothes shop to find the shop assistants want to spend ten minutes surveying you about how much you know about BLM before they’ll let you get to the clothes. It’s just annoying and not really appropriate.

HOWEVER in the context of a racist incident on the actual page, it’s very different. It is reasonable of the moderator to provide some kind of a response, otherwise they are basically enabling racism. So in this instance I wouldn’t mind.

For heavens sake nobody supports anarchy

What is wrong with not wanting your children to grow up denying that racism exists and saying ‘oh that doesn’t happen any more’

I’m not clicking any weird links with names like “scary mommy”. I have no faith in your judgement, thanks.

You’re the one who said;

”very sensibly set up a thread for people to post educational resources relating to the BLM movement”

So if the content you’re referencing isn’t actually BLM at all, but more sensible, mainstream, anti-racism educational resources (still not sure with that name), then the FIRST thing you have to do is learn the difference. Learn what the BLM organisers are actually espousing, and why that makes them Marxist, extreme, fringe etc.

Maybe then you won’t make such a complete fool of yourself. Start there.

But I don't think violence and criminal activity is the way to get there

I definitely don't support violence.

I had been under the impression that BLM was about addressing systemic racism such as that found within institutions like the police. Which has been a problem for many years. (Which is why I mentioned Stephen Lawrence).

Apparently though i was wrong about this, given the vitriol.

The link is basically a white parent talking about how her black son gets treated differently than white kids in their neighbourhood and how his behaviour is held to higher standards than theirs.

It was actually sent to me by a black friend who has a lot of experience working in these areas so it's not my judgement you don't trust, it's hers.

Maybe then you won’t make such a complete fool of yourself. Start there.

I think whatever you're angry about you don't need to direct it at me.

Apparently though i was wrong about this

Indeed.

given the vitriol.

Vitriol? Not really. Heated and assertive responses? Well that's what you get when you accuse people of being racist or offensive for not supporting a cause that you do, but which they know far more about what it stands for than you do.

Good posts @ArriettyJones

I haven't accused anyone of being racist, thanks.