Inappropriate Father-Daughter relationship? *TRIGGER*

[SandMason]

Hi all. I’d really appreciate your views on my childhood relationship with my father. I feel something was not right but I don’t know how to understand it or what to call it. I’ve used impersonal language because writing ‘I’ and ‘me’ in this context makes me queasy. Here is some of what I remember:

• Daughter and her younger sister being naked a lot, around the house, for no particular reason, aged up to 5 at least
• Father naked a lot, around the house, likewise no reason
• Home video of daughters playing naked, aged 4 and 1, filmed by father
• Father and daughter age 5 showering together, and daughter asking him to ‘turn his willy inside out’ (retract foreskin). Daughter rushing to get younger sister to see this ‘magic trick’. Him doing it.
• Daughter, naked, in parents’ bed alone with father ‘tickling’ her lower abdomen right above pubic bone, drawing swirls with his finger. Aged under 5
• Holidays abroad including trips to naked beaches with parents’ friends, male and female, all naked. Up to age 6(?)
• Every Saturday visit with Father after parents split (daughter age 9+ up to mid-teen) involving swimming/sauna, Father getting changed (naked) with daughters whenever possible. Father mocking daughter’s attempts to change discreetly as prudish
• Father making comments about daughter’s developing breasts being ‘lovely’
• Teenage daughters sunbathing topless on family holidays, allowed and encouraged by father
• Father and wife taking daughters (age 13 and 10) to mixed Turkish baths in Turkey, daughters go topless. Father paying for them to have ‘Turkish massages’ by middle aged men in full view of everyone, ‘masseurs’ running hands up daughters’ legs and inner thighs under towel. Father and wife watching
• Father commenting frequently to daughter how ‘sexy’ women are (e.g. celebrities)
• Father and girlfriend having sex loudly in room next to teenage daughter, father going to bathroom naked afterwards
• Father entering bathroom while teenage daughter in bath to take a pee or brush teeth
• Father choosing for daughter’s A-Level school photography project a photo-story with sexual nudes
• Father asking adult daughter how the sex was in her marriage and whether she had stitches after childbirth
• Father hugging adult daughter after drunken argument (him drunk, not her) and pushing his hips against her as she tries to wriggle out of the hug

AIBU in thinking a lot of this is not okay? How would you feel if this was your daughter? Or if this was you? I’m still trying to get to grips with it after years telling myself it’s nothing out of the ordinary, despite having a creepy feeling around him. All comments welcome. Thanks for reading.

[ThickFast]

The naked I can understand. But not reading it in the context of all the other things you’ve mentioned. Context is everything and the rest is awful. The massages in public sounds awful, especially that no one stopped it. All of it, actually. You say that this is some of what you remember. So that implies that there is more too.

[amusedtodeath1]

This sounds so familiar, for context my sisters were abused by bíodad, I couldn't remember any abuse, years later I started putting it together, odd memories that didn't make sense but clearly important enough to be remembered. I now accept he did those things to me too, I blocked it out but the memories I have are the shock and confusion after the "event".

[ThickFast]

Sorry, my words didn’t come out right. By awful, I mean awful for you to have experienced.

[SandMason]

I don’t think it’s naturism because he’s a pretty overtly sexual person, the type who blatantly stares at women out the car window and finds any excuse to touch a young waitress, that sort of thing

[MrsKoala]

I think the retracting penis thing is bad, as is the loud sex, the commenting on lovely breasts of the daughters, asking about sex life and pushing groin into.

The massages could be either way as I’ve been to Turkish massages in Turkey and that’s pretty much what they are - so might be interpreted as cultural experiences.

The rest is fairly similar to my childhood. Very open nudity, photos not films of me playing naked on the beach (most little kids I knew did in the 70s). Doing fine art projects of nudes from 14 years old. Going to art galleries with a lot of nude painting/photography.

Most people I knew born in the liberal lefty hippy 70s area I lived had sex positive parents, a lot asked them about their sex lives when they were 16, allowed casual sex in the house and had loud sex themselves (smoked dope with them) etc . I don’t think they saw it as intrusive, or got any kind of sex thrill from it, more just wanting to be the opposite of what they had when growing up and imo went too far the other way.

I do not feel remotely uncomfortable with my upbringing or that my parents crossed a boundary at all. But if you do then maybe there was something more sinister to it.

[FizzyGreenWater]

Nothing to do with naturism at all from what you've said.

The very opposite in fact - perversion of nudity with children from a young age, using innocent nudity as a gateway to inappropriate touching, conversation - urgh.

He's simply a sex abuser.

[DrowsyDragon]

OP I am so sorry. My parents are pretty naked people so I’ve seen my dad naked all my life but he was never “interacting” with himself - that magic trick is so creepy and wrong.

My parents were also a bit thrown when I became body conscious as a teen, we had a couple of open the door I need to pee. Don’t be silly I wiped your bum as a baby. But they soon got over that. But the rest is so creepy and horrible. Especially frequently exposing you to discomfort and sexual behaviour. I am so sorry.

[Blanca87]

Your dad sounds like a sleezy cunt, I'm so sorry you have had to experience this. I hope you find peace and you are no contact with the repulsive, creep.

[ThickFast]

What is your relationship like with him now?

[NotQuiteUsual]

Coming from a family where nudity is the norm. No, that's not OK. Once a family member becomes uncomfortable, whatever age that is, that trumps everyone else's feelings on the matter. I'm so sorry op, that is a lot ot process.

[OrchidJewel]

Not ok sandmason. Hope therapy helps get your head around it. Have you broached it with your sister? Your parents split up, did your mother know he was like this?

[Parmavioletmum]

I would say this is abuse op and I'm sorry that you have been through this. It sounds like you are struggling to comprehend the enormity of this situation and what it all means. Do you have anyone IRL you can confide in? I think it may be worth speaking to your gp and seeking a counsellor who you can talk this through with, and what your options next are. You are not alone OP.

[SnakesOrLadders]

I’m sorry op yes agree with posters on here this was abuse.
I hope you are getting help in RL 💐

[cabbageking]

Your daughters are grown up now?

What do they say?

[SandMason]

Also it's that whole gaslighting behaviour where you know you've been violated but he's been sneaky and abhorrent and hasn't done anything grossly, blatantly abusive- it's just been insidious over your whole lifetime.

This is why it’s taken so long to click, it’s like my brain wants to explain it all away

[JustC]

Ob God OP, this made me queasy. I have no words. Hugs

[Juniper27]

Hi OP. I had a sadly similar experience, things only started coming together for me in therapy. I cut him off and haven’t seen him for 3 years. I reported to police but didn’t go anywhere. I hope you’re okay and have people around you to support you

[nancyjuice7]

Its all sexual abuse

Please don't let any children anywhere near him.

The scary thing is this what the child remembers. What on earth went on prior to the child remembering.

If you can report this please do, even if you think what happened isn't enough, if he has taken photographs or has been looking up child abuse online the police could find it and he could he sentenced. Most importantly put on sex offenders register and be managed by the police.

We have no idea what's in his phone or computer but I'm willing to bet there's a large amount of illegal stuff

[JKSN]

I agree with a PP that points one to three seem ok, although dad being naked 'a lot' is slightly concerning beyond normal changing clothes/getting undressed for bathing etc but all further examples I would consider inappropriate.

[Fuckityfucksake]

OP I'm sorry that happened to you.
I was SA as a child and some of the things that you've described have knocked me sick. Particularly the sickening magic trick and the stroking of the lower abdomen. It's vile! He is vile!
As another poster has stated above - adults participating in nudity and respectfully encouraging their dc to not feel embarrassed is ok so long as there is no forced interaction and boundaries are respected.

[Viviennemary]

I'd say that was criminal behaviour.

[SandMason]

To the PPs who have kindly asked about my wellbeing, I do have RL support, thankfully, and have been NC with him for over a year. The final straw was him telling me I look exactly like this actress in a tv show he watched - in which the actress gets repeatedly raped. He seemed to be delighting in telling me how much I look like her (I don’t but whatever)

[Boomclaps]

Oh op, that’s sick.
I’m glad you’ve got real life support. And I’m glad you’re starting to process it.
💓

[CrowdedHouseinQuarantine]

[SilentAlarm]

Reading this made me feel sick.

I hope you’re ok OP.