Am I the only person who doesn't know any trans people?

[LaureBerthaud]

Non goady question.

I don't know any, work with any or come across any trans people. Now it could be that they've done such a good job of transitioning that I don't notice, but where are they?

I know at least 5 or 6, and know of quite a few more. A glorious mixture of quiet, mousey types, and flamboyant, loud individuals. Some pass, some don't. All my friends. I don't have much sympathy with the MN general view of trans people and am probably what you'd call 'a hand maiden.'

I must admit I'm disturbed by this comment.

She then told our wash manager and I was the only one not surprised.
She had also told us that she left her husband because he beat her up but it turned out that she hadn't told him that she was trans when they got married. He beat her up when he found out !

It seems almost...justifying this horrid attack? As if its OK because she hadn't revealed it? Really hoping that I'm reading it wrong. What a disgusting tone to take when talking about domestic violence.

I also know someone who goes in a pub where I sometimes go. I knew him years ago as a man so will use 'he' as I'm not sure what he is presenting as. He comes in with his wife of 20 or so years wearing, for example, a pink calf length skirt and bobbles in his long hair, a little make up but no serious attempt to make his face look female. The people who frequent that pub are very accepting - live and let live.

I know 2. The female to male transperson is lovely, just wants to keep their head down and live their best life. The male to female one is a complete dramallama who throws an absolute fit if the wrong pronouns are used but whose gender identity changes constantly and without warning. They're a fucking nightmare to be honest.

No from me. But I do have a very small friend/acquaintance group.

Not rare at all in tech, I've been in environments where there's been more TW than women

I'm used to male aggression at work but I find it very stressful no longer being able to retreat to the ladies to get a break.

As far as I’m aware, I vaguely know one. I saw him at various stages of transitioning. If I just met him I would have no idea.

Does it matter OP?

I know a woman who is very tall and has large hands. I originally assumed she was trans but she talks about her childhood and was definitely a girl. So you can be sure someone is and they're not.

I’ve met some out and about, some I couldn’t even tell (looked way more feminine than me) some amazing drag queens too!

Can someone tell me why so many women are threatened by trans people? They’re probably not gonna take your life or your man and the chances of a bloke pretending to be woman and assaulting you are minimal it’s TRANs people who are the most vulnerable due to transphobia (check the stats) and people like JKrowling who imo is an entitled paranoid hot mess damaged from dosmectic violence!

There’s a trans woman working on the tills in a local supermarket- she’s the only one I know of, to my knowledge.

One of my oldest and dearest friends is a transsexual. She is a lovely person who cares deeply for other people. She has had ample therapy, and like most transsexuals, acknowledges that her sex is male and has nothing in common with people who claim that TWAW.

A friend of a friend is a trans-identifying male who claims he has changed his sex. He is very, very angry that the world doesn't see him the way he wants to be seen. He takes great delight in entering women's single-sex spaces (real and virtual) and making women uncomfortable because they are "bigots."

@Pinklynx

Smallsteps genuine question, not goady I want to understand, what does this really mean and why is it important to you? I ask this because I don't conform to gender stereotypes and never have. And I think that's probably easier as a woman than as a man. But what's the difference between that and having no gender?

What does this really mean?

I’m guessing you mean what does it mean that I have no gender? It means I just don’t buy into gender stereotypes. I’m not a woman because I have long hair. Or paint my nails. Or wear dresses. Those are all things that are included in the gender stereotype associated with woman. I’m still a woman even if I do none of those things. I’m a woman because my body is female and I’m an adult. Regardless of clothing or hair length. I disagree with oppressive gender stereotypes. I don’t believe in gender just as I don’t believe in a higher power. I don’t have a faith in any God and I don’t have a faith in any gender.

It’s important to me because gender identity (a man made concept) is being used to erode the rights of women so I feel it’s important to be accurate when discussing sex and gender and not just accept that you have a particular or any gender because you are being told you meet the “criteria” for it.

What’s the difference between not conforming to gender stereotypes and having no gender?

Well it depends on whether you believe in and agree with gender stereotypes or not. You can believe in them, agree with them, but not conform to them. Or you could just think they’re a load of fluff. I think they’re a load of fluff and don’t exist so why on earth would I think I have a gender?

My old school friend's 19-year-old is trans. He is quite 'big' in the music scene, but is not officially out as trans yet. I know the teenage years were a terribly painful time for the family and my friend and her husband got divorced during it.

There are some obviously trans people who work in shops/ retail services that I use in our (small) town that I'd recognise and say hello to.

There's a transwoman who transitioned in the time I've known her and goes to the same hobby-based group I do (before Covid!). She makes me very uncomfortable because I think she has AGP - she makes comments about menstruation and once asked me and a 17 year old girl for tampons in the ladies' loos (but a thread I posted about that was deleted by MN, so I won't revisit that ).

My geeky, computer-sciency, gaming DS is sharing a flat with a transwoman next year - apparently she has just changed gender in the last 12 months, so when DS met her she was another geeky, computer-sciency boy like him. I haven't met her yet.
I think they're just friends and DS has often told me he's straight (and I've met his girlfriends) so I think it's probably true.

@Chrysanthemum5 I know many don’t, which is why I think it’s so important not to use passing as a metric of trans validity. But it’s not as rare as you think. I remember a thread on here a few weeks ago when Nikkie de Jäger came out as trans and many people were really surprised. I myself had had no idea despite working with and knowing a few trans people, and being a long term fan of Nikkie.

Similarly, one of my trans friends would not, I think, be assumed to be trans by anyone. Not only does she look very stereotypically feminine (not in her dress sense, particularly, but her features, height, fat distribution etc) she has a very feminine voice and mannerisms. A few people have expressed real surprise to me when they have found out she is trans.

That doesn’t, however, make her any less worthy of acceptance and respect than my trans friends who don’t pass as effectively. The whole concept of passing is problematic and should be ditched, really.

That should say ‘any more worthy’, apologies.

@MiniatureHero I agree I think passing is problematic and causes huge distress for individuals with gender dysphasia or individuals like my family member who has a sexual development disorder and just wants to live life in a way that makes them happy. And that's the issue to me- previously women knew there were individual men using women's toilets, dressing as women etc but these were a small number and they accepted they were not women but being treated as women helped them. So women because we are socialised to be kind just let these males use facilities etc. And things were generally fine.

But that's not what's happening now and women are sick of it.

I've only talked about trans women as trans men generally just get on with life

I know one 20 year old mtf who is still intact but takes hormones. Defines themselves as a lesbian and has lots and lots of sex with different woke young girls.

Yes, very much so. I live in an area known for being pretty lefty and have always been in left wing liberal circles.
I've got a number of trans friends, including one of my best friends as well as having trans people in my family and in a number of different social groups I'm in.
In one particular group, I think almost every person identifies as trans, non binary or other variation.
There is this massive assumption among trans activists that gender critical people are somehow completely insulated from knowing any trans people. It's really not the case.
It's the other way around.
Many of us have massive issues with gender ideology and think that the trans movement has a serious misogyny problem. We dont have any issue with trans people in our lives. On the contrary, we're deeply concerned that the extreme ideology being pushed by extremists in the movement is going to hurt the trans people we care about too.

I know 3 all adults in their 30s/40s. 1 female to Male and the other 2 Male to female. I know at least one has had surgery. i dont know the others well enough to know and dont really care.

@Bigearringsbigsmile

I know one 20 year old mtf who is still intact but takes hormones. Defines themselves as a lesbian and has lots and lots of sex with different woke young girls.

Assuming they are consenting to this why does it matter? They could be having sex with men who are unsuitable for any number of reasons. I did.

@Butterfly3105

I’ve met some out and about, some I couldn’t even tell (looked way more feminine than me) some amazing drag queens too!

Can someone tell me why so many women are threatened by trans people? They’re probably not gonna take your life or your man and the chances of a bloke pretending to be woman and assaulting you are minimal it’s TRANs people who are the most vulnerable due to transphobia (check the stats) and people like JKrowling who imo is an entitled paranoid hot mess damaged from dosmectic violence!

I think a lot of it is down to not wanting to share our women only spaces, grants, shortlists and sporting competitions with adult males.

In real life, most of the TW I've met have been normal people who are horrified by the TWAW/biology is bigoted crowd. They understand that women need their own spaces and competitions.

Yes, someone I love a great deal.

I usually avoid trans threads MN is awful on the topic and some of the ignorance displayed is really quite heartbreaking

[quote BabyLlamaZen]@smallsteps88 out of curiosity, what does that mean though? Does anyone really identify as a woman?

I know 2 in their 30s (transman and transwomen) and heaps of teenagers.[/quote]
Does anyone really identify as a woman?

Well, yes! There are lots of men who do. I don’t think I’ve encountered any women who say “I identify as a woman”. They just are women. Which is my entire point.

I'm acquainted with a couple TW. Know of a few gender fluid people, who are happily married. Have a female relative who is non-binary and homosexual, though has never declared herself as non-binary, but definitely fits the profile.

I know one 20 year old mtf who is still intact but takes hormones. Defines themselves as a lesbian and has lots and lots of sex with different woke young girls.

It’s pretty unfair to refer to the women your acquaintance is sleeping with as ‘woke young girls’. Apart from minimising the choices of these women by writing them off as just trying to be woke, your acquaintance is only 20 and therefore also young. Unless the ‘woke young girls’ are actually children and this person is a pedophile (in which case you should report her), there’s nothing controversial about young adults having consensual sex.

This is a good example of covert transphobia; implying something is off or underhand when a trans person does it, when it’s actually considered pretty normal behaviour for non trans people.