Apparently I'm racist

[Charlieandthechocolatecake]

I should have name changed but I'd like to think I'm made of tougher stuff.

I asked to be added to a WhatsApp chat advertised on MN for people with no friend.

All was well until I asked 'why' people believed they had no friends. I was very honest in my answer.

I'm mixed race (pretty much equal parts black, white and Asian) and I'm from Croydon. I now have a black DP and 2 sons with him.

In the chat I said that I believe the reason I have no friends is because of my race. I grew up around a lot of mixed race people and I was honest when I said most of them had a superiority complex. I was often told by people that looked like me that we had the best of both worlds, we were more beautiful (I definitely am not!) and that we could pick and choose what we wanted to identify as.

Anyway, these opinions have always had an affect on me. I don't agree with them at all even though I can see why they believe it's true. As I've got older I've avoided many people with a similar race to my own. I've always struggled with my own identity and although those opinions came from people when I was in my early to late teens, I'm worried about meeting those same kind of people again. I feel like whenever I have, they use me as some kind of confidant to air their views.

Anyway, I said on the chat that I think people will judge me because of the same way I judge others the same colour as me. Hence, why I have no friends. I was being honest. I know it's something I need to work on but it's hard. I'm not racist. Prejudice probably.

The chat was going so well until then. I was called a racist and I was told I was disgusting. I apologised and left the chat.

I don't know what I want from this.

@pumpkinbump thank you, I get that not everybody shares the same views but it's nice to hear a voice of reason x

It sounds like you’re going off previous negative experience, you’ve not suddenly decided to distance yourself because you don’t like how they look. Your experiences and opinions aren’t less valid because people throw the R word around.

Racism to me is to take a negative view of someone based purely on the colour of their skin.

IME, the “best of both worlds” thing is generally said by the white parent, who was usually the mother (when I was growing up) and kids and teens repeat this until they have a chance to self define and mature past their parents guidance and silly “praise”.

There definitely is issues with colourism within society and the black community and these can be tough when you’re younger but I don’t think allowing this to alter your behaviour is helpful as an adult- maybe if you haven’t explored it, therapy regarding your childhood/identity could be helpful? These are complicated issues to explore.

I’m mixed, grew up in inner London- had a few issues but nothing particularly noteworthy regarding my race that made me have a harder time than anyone else, everyone had their “thing” they got stick for. I had the most issues with black women/girls and today count black women among my closest friends. So I don’t totally share your experience but I am aware of the themes you mention.

Also, I wouldn’t be so honest bringing up racial issues before you have a chance to get to know people properly- it makes them highly uncomfortable, you need to build a certain level of intimacy or trust before you reveal this type of thing and the people that are attracted to this type of disclosure, you’d do well to avoid.

Not that you were in the wrong, but I would have just picked a surface level topic that describes your experience and then gone deeper as you found someone to get closer to.

No, OP
You are not racist. It’s hard being mixed race. I’m mixed Asian myself and also have dual nationality. That constant feeling of never belonging anywhere or to any ethnic identity then the forced silver lining view of other mixed race people about “best of everything”. It’s not the “best” that you get, you get to feel excluded no matter where you live or you who associate with.
Until there are more mixed race people, our voices will be drowned out by the mono-race people who prefer that the world have these sharp lines between ethnicity. They honestly don’t want to hear from those of us on the borderlands between everyone. It challenges their perceptions and beliefs about race, privilege, etc.

On a side note, you sound somewhat introverted and so it might be more your personality as to why you don’t have many friends. Im that way and it wasn’t until I took this personality test and read that my personality type prefers to have few friends of high quality- and it meant like 2-3 friends- did I feel understood. So, try the test. It is free on 16 personalities on the web. It might help you untangle what about not having a lot of friends is due to your personality instead of your birth features.

OP you will make new friends, but I think you should concentrate on character and not their race or if they look like you. Are you able to get counselling for some of the things you have experienced or been through. I'm Black and happy to make friends with anyone, although most non-BAME people don't mean to be racist, a lot of it is microagression, unconscious bias and therefore insidious. Those type people (which can actually include some BAME people), I stay away from at the first hint of colorism, or superiorty hinting.

I am mixed race and think your views are incredibly odd. People are people, the same cross section of kind, hostile, arrogant, generous etc in every race, religion and culture. Why do you think people like me have a Superiority complex? It’s really odd and yes, bigoted to classify any characteristics by race.

I am mixed race but live in a very white area so I don’t know about the lived experience of Croydon and similar areas.
However reading your opening post I wouldn’t necessarily describe you as racist but you are being stereotypical and potentially missing out on loads of friendships with decent people because you are bias by bad experiences.
I guess if you were white and said the same it could be seen as racist, you need to take people as you find them, mixed race people
aren’t one homogenous group with the same opinions!

I grew up around a lot of mixed race people and I was honest when I said most of them had a superiority complex. I was often told by people that looked like me that we had the best of both worlds, we were more beautiful (I definitely am not!) and that we could pick and choose what we wanted to identify as.

Anyway, these opinions have always had an affect on me. I don't agree with them at all even though I can see why they believe it's true. As I've got older I've avoided many people with a similar race to my own. I've always struggled with my own identity and although those opinions came from people when I was in my early to late teens, I'm worried about meeting those same kind of people again. I feel like whenever I have, they use me as some kind of confidant to air their views

I take everybody on face value regardless of race

I was judged so much based on the colour of my skin whilst other females lapped it up. You only need to go on Instagram to see why they're so fetishised.

I have quoted some of your posts, and you are quite derogatory to people purely because of their race? Surely that is exactly what racist means?

I don't think that's racist. You were speaking about your own experience as a mixed race person.

@Charlieandthechocolatecake Thank you for answering rather than joining in with the shredding of me that was taking place last night.

I can't remember if I said this last night or not, but this isn't the sort of discussion I have very often. I'm not an expert in the terminology, and I'm sure I wouldn't understand the nuances of experiences of people of different skin colours/ethnicities/heritage. The people in the group probably thought, like me, that pre judging somebody due to their skin colour was a racist thing to do. I would definitely feel that if someone assumed I had traits without knowing me, based on my skin colour, that that was a racist judgement. That's just what I think. I'm not having a go at you or trying to change the way you think.

If I were you, I'd just find a different group of people, who think more like you do/understand how you think. There's support for you on this thread (or else I wouldn't have got pulled to pieces by people accusing me of 'having an agenda') and there'll be people there in real life too.

I went to a group once called 'Action for Happiness', expecting happy people to be there, finding ways to share happiness. It was a bunch of depressed people who wished they were happy! Meeting a a group that does something you enjoy might be a better idea, rather than a group whose 'thing in common' is not having many friends. A group where the focus is to learn/do something enjoyable. That way even if it takes a while to make friends, and it often does, you'll be getting something out of it in the meantime.

Your experience of the group you went to sounds very unpleasant. Mixing with people who 'get you' rather than wondering why people who don't 'get you' judge you negatively is a big wellbeing driver, in my experience. I hope you find 'your' people.

Anyway, I said on the chat that I think people will judge me because of the same way I judge others the same colour as me

So this isnt racist?

I think I get what you're saying about mixed race people, OP. I'm not aware of a 'superiority complex' amongst mixed race people I know, but what @MitziK said sounds like she knows what she's on about. I'm trying to understand it by comparing it to my attitude to Christians. I was brought up as properly church-going but I had so many bad experiences with people who called themselves Christians, the worst being attempted grooming in a Bible class, I ended up distrusting them all. I'm 58 & I still really have to watch myself with 'churchy' people. I do my best not to judge - and I do know a few Christians who are nice - but I can't deny it's a thing, it's a feature of who I am because it's in my history. So I think I get you a bit. You're just being warts-and-all honest and that's hard to handle in 'polite society'.

@Happymum12345 are you white? I am and the whole “Oo, me I’m colourblind” is a privilege only people from the majority ethnic group can enjoy.
@Charlieandthechocolatecake work on your small talk There’s a lot to unpick in your OP- I don’t think you’re racist but what you’re describing is a bit complicated for a group chat.

Not everyone has a problem with people who are as frank as you sound, OP. I like people who tell it like it is for them. One of the reasons I ended up distrusting Christians is because so many were mean and dishonest. I wouldn't shun you in a WhatsApp group, I'd want to know more, fwiw.

Seconded, EdWest. I also prefer people who say what they mean, mean what they say, and are authentic. Expecting everybody to think the same and criticising them when they don't doesn't get anybody anywhere. Things just get negative. Accepting openness and difference is a better way to gain understanding of those different from you.

I'd much rather talk with a person who disagreed with me and was honest about it, than with somebody who was pretending to agree with me.

Virtue signalling idiots. You were sharing your experiences and shouldn't be vilified for it!

Okay, I don't understand if I was white and said, most black people I have met are sneaky and dishonest, therefore I do not wish to be friends with black people. Would that make me racist?

But just because you don't agree with others of mixed race (and they can't all think like that) it doesn't mean you can't mix with black people, Asian people or white people. I know birds of a feather flock together and all that, but still...

I did have to work harder to keep an open mind when considering bring friends with black people,

I genuinely cannot believe that people think like that. To me if someone is mean or unkind, I don't see their race as anything to do with it

It's funny about the positives. My husband is mixed race, black father and white mother. He reckons you get the worst of both worlds, I think if he could choose he'd be happy to be darker or lighter as he'd fit in more. Maybe that's just him, maybe it's his age, he always says being a mixed race child in the 40s wasn't fun.

@PumpkinP

I think this is odd tbh, I am mixed race and don’t know anyone who is mixed race that acts the way you described. I was bullied badly in school by some black girls who seemed to have issues with mixed race girls but that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t want to be friends with someone who was black now and I now have black friends who are nothing like the ones I knew in school.

Same here Pumpkin. OP.I don't think.you were racist at all. I think you were generalising and about mixed race people and their attitudes. Apart from that many people have a fundamental misunderstanding of what racism is and often use the term inappropriately. Ignore them and find another group.

@MitziK that's one of the questions I hated.
Where are you from!?
South Norwood
WHERE are you from!?
My mum's this and my dad's that.
Are you easy?
I learned 'fuck off' at an early age

In fairness, that is essential language for anybody growing up in Croydon - in French lessons, you were taught 'Ca va? Ca va bien merci, et toi?', in German 'Wie Gehts?', and in Croydon 'Fuck off'.

I asked about your sense of humour because I was interested in the programmes/styles of things you find funny, not because I was seeking to offend you or put you on the spot - if you were anticipating it was an attack, maybe that's part of the difficulty in making friends sometimes? I know 'Scuse me! I wanna ask you a question' is an opening gambit from many twats people in the street, but this is online, not outside Allders.

There are whole worlds of prejudice, class, colorism and whatnots to unpack in relation to mixed heritage and identity - and, from all angles, it does seem to completely 'other' the people concerned; to talk about prejudice and racism gets the 'you have privilege' response at the same time as the shit rained down from the 'I'm not racialist, but these half....' (and you can guess where that shit is going) brigade.

I have no idea what the actual truth is for each person. Suppose everybody has their own.

However, if I said I don't like white people because of the racist dickheads I encountered at school and afterwards, I'd be lambasted. If I were to take the piss out of White People, I'd look fucking ridiculous, being one myself. I stick to being generally misanthropic. It's easier that way.