More bashing of mumsnet

[Ikeasucks]

Why are orgs and businesses just capitulating to this bullying? mobile.twitter.com/MForstater/status/1265201870437519360

So MN does delete transphobic content then

Phew, glad that's cleared up!

TRAs and the GMB can stand down! Mumsnet doesn't allow actual transphobia to stand.

And elsie if you don't believe that trans people can have AGP as part of their trans identity then you are contradicting the self- reported lived experience of many trans women, one of whom has written recently about it. Why do you think you know better than them about their experience of what it is to be trans?

When the pandemic disproportionately affects women because of their occupations, poverty level, caring responsibilities etc, it's appalling that this union would abandon a site for women by women Aren't the death rates double for men? I think it affects men quite badly.

So maybe everyone should respect other people's views.

Absolutely. Fine with that. But people are allowed to disagree, as long as it's civil. It wouldn't be much of a talkboard if we didn't!

@popehilarious I’m sure they can, it’s referring to all trans people as having a mental illness or a fetish that I’m objecting to.

Aren't the death rates double for men? I think it affects men quite badly.

Yes, it affects men and women in different ways. Women bear the bulk of the burden of care. Men are more likely to need hospital treatment or die from coronavirus.

Both things make it quite clear that clear sex based data is critical. And that sex based legal protections are important.

@1forsorrow Yes, men are more likely to die from it but women are more likely to suffer the impact of lockdown and the financial impliucations as they dominate the workforce in many of the sectors most hard hit. Women in most countries get it slightly more than men (last time I checked) but the men are less likel;y to recover. More of Less on R4 suggested in part it may be having only one X chromosome, as immune systems are linked to X.

But with the issues a Union wouild be advising people about, women are particularly hard hit.

@Elsiebear90

peach gave an example which you’ve conveniently ignored

Peach said ‘there was a thread the other day...’. That’s not evidence that’s conjecture.

What exactly do you think "trans" identity is, Elsie? Genuine question. And why are people so reluctant to consider there could be some mental health issues involved in some cases?

Elsie it would really help if you could link to the specific text you're regretting you otherwise we're talking in circles. Was this on a thread talking about ICD codes for diagnosing gender dysphoria?

*referring to, not regretting!

there was a thread created yesterday purely to bash and express disgust that it has been reported that France elected its first trans mayor.

To be fair, I read that thread (it seems to be deleted now anyway) and when I read it there was maybe one other poster who was agreeing in anyway with the OP. Many posters were pointing out that 'first lesbian' mayors etc have also be reported in their times. Maybe it changed considerably after I saw it.

I've seen plenty examples of transphobia on mumsnet - they are deleted pretty promptly by moderators however and I've never thought to collect evidence but I will photograph future examples I see before they are deleted.

I imagine there are many things I view as transphobic and you don't.

That doesn't mean your point of view is right though! In fact think it is completely wrong.

e.g. I think trans women are trans women, not women. And I don't think it is in the least transphobic to say so. If you disagree, that's up to you.

Theres a fishing expedition going on in FWR right now for those who dont believe theres a campaign to get MN shutdown...

There are also racist posts on MN that are swiftly deleted by MNHQ, does that make MN racist too?

I think there needs to be a definition of what transphobia is. If I don't believe in a Christian's god, I'm not Christianphobic. I don't want to have to lie and say I believe in something I don't, that only exists in individual's imagination ie. That they are the opposite sex. They can believe it and live happily, but happily shouldn't mean demanding everyone else has to join in with their fantasy. So the phobia aspect has to be being aggressive and disgusted for example, not just declining to join in.

There is a lot tied up, not least politically, with whether or not gender dysphoria is, or should be, a mental health issue. Not least in areas like health insurance where making it a medical issue helps trans people access healthcare. This has been discussed at length but I can't recall elsie's input.

I've seen plenty examples of transphobia on mumsnet - they are deleted pretty promptly by moderators however and I've never thought to collect evidence but I will photograph future examples I see before they are deleted.

If they are deleted "pretty promptly" what is the issue with Mumsnet as a platform? People say things, and if they break the rules they are deleted. And they're not always posted in good faith by people expressing their personal views, either.

they are deleted pretty promptly by moderators however and I've never thought to collect evidence but I will photograph future examples I see before they are deleted.

why though?
To prove that a site that doesn't allow transphobic content to remain deletes transphobic content?

You'd be better off researching the history of the posters who post such things. I imagine you'll find a lot of new registrations who don't ever post anything besides that initial dogwhistle, because so much of it is purely to get screenshots for twitter.

If one relied solely on MN, I doubt one would even begin to realise that you can be feminist and trans-inclusive

Ever stopped to consider that the deletions and banning might be justified? That it's not a big plot to 'get' anyone by new arrivals, but reports by longstanding MNers who don't want to see what they see as bigotry here? And when MNHQ delete/ban it's because they agree? Remember, they can see who is reporting, whether they're new, whether they have form for vexatious reports, or whether they're normal MNers

I think the problem here is that women here believe things they shouldn't, according to some authoritarian people of both sexes (as there are only two) who've bought into trans ideology. So do many other people in the world. That it is Mumsnet that is the only target, rather than Twitter and Facebook who allow much worse, demonstrates the rank misogyny.

I think some threads on mumsnet can certainly provide a climate where transphobic remarks are ripe to be expressed by those who hold them.

Generally however I think the mods do a reasonable job of deleting individual transphobic remarks - but of course there will be a period of time where that content is up, and available to read by anyone.

I sometimes see entire threads pulled where there is robust discussion going on, and I think that is regrettable, but I don't find it too surprising given that they can be peppered with individual transphobic comments and I assume it becomes too hard to intensely scrutinise content the ongoing discussion and they have to make the call.

Yes, and it's always screenshots, never actual links where you can actually go and see everyone disagreeing with some of the trolly shite that gets posted by "new" posters