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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Would you carry on letting grandparents see child after this?

511 replies

Slidetotheleft · 20/05/2020 07:19

DD's (5) father disappeared off the face of the earth 12 months ago. Has paid no maintenance since then. Currently owes over 3k and counting.

DDs grandparents (his parents) know where he is but refuse to tell me. Their argument is that he is trying to rebuild his business/life and cannot do that with the maintenance people on his back. He hasn't even sent DD a birthday card or anything at xmas. The maintenance people cannot find him, his parents know where he is but refuse to tell me and if DD asks them they say they don't know (not sure how long they can carry that on for).

They are currently still seeing DD twice a month (not during lockdown). And speak to her once a week on the phone.

My question is WIBU to say actually whilst you cannot be honest with me or DD I don't want her in your care. I DO NOT want to do this, DD enjoys their company and they love seeing her.

But it really really gets to me that they are happy to see her go without the support she deserves and to actually lie to her face when she asks where her daddy is.

What would you do?

OP posts:
WhatCFeryIsThis · 20/05/2020 18:11

@Myohmy111 she feels loved, sure. She's five. She's not 'loved' by them though, I can't for a second pretend to believe that those are the actions of people who love her. I would be badgering my son every day to do the right thing before I spent one second looking into a child's eyes and saying I don't know where her father is. Even if he was going to reappear as Bill Gates and she would never want for anything again financially, nothing would ever eradicate that period of abandonment for her.

@dontdisturbmenow you're being deliberately obtuse and there's no point continuing to engage with you. The grandparents can and should do better, end of.

Taddda · 20/05/2020 18:11

Have I missed an update here? Is the Dad in prison for murder? On Drugs?....HmmConfused....

YinMnBlue · 20/05/2020 18:15

Hang on.,.,

According to the OP’ S update the CMS DO know where he is, or they at least have a bank account that is current, but are refusing to pursue it Because Covid.

Also by the sounds of his finances, debt collection etc, it doesn’t sound as if he has any money to pursue.

In which case why is he hiding Confused I doubt it is the money that is driving his disappearance.

OP your Dd obviously shouldn’t be involved in the money, or any talk of it. So the only issue that directly affects her relationship with her GPS is that when she asks where he is, they lie to her. I think this is frightening for a small child, a Daddy lost and even his own parents don’t know where he is. Deal with this situation with the GPS. Say they need to give her a version of the truth and whether she will see him again. And that lying stores up trouble and mistrust for the future. I would ask them straight: is he in prison or otherwise in trouble.

However, it sounds as if he might have gone bankrupt and is now living an off the radar cash based life, supported by his gf. Which would also explain his reluctance to talk to CMS or you about it.

Fedhimtotigers · 20/05/2020 18:15

No. But those saying love beats all. To what extent?
They are assisting in depriving the child. They have enabled the abusive father.
They are lying to the child's face.

To me they are not good people. I would want to protect my child from them.

Craiglang · 20/05/2020 18:20

I absolutely agree with the previous posters who have said it's up to her dad to maintain the relationship between his DD and her GP, not yours. If they're 100% on his side and think protecting him from his responsibilities is more important than their DGD, they have made their choice incredibly clear to you.

YinMnBlue · 20/05/2020 18:20

WVFery So would I. However many people who love their children dearly tell the lies to avoid difficult truths believing it is in their best interests. If he is in prison they may think it best to peddle bollocks. And may not have thought about the the effect on the child in all the ramifications.

WhatCFeryIsThis · 20/05/2020 18:29

@YinMnBlue I completely understand that there will be unfortunate times when it is better to lie to a child than to break their heart. I would hate to be in that position. Your suggestion that he may be bankrupt seems plausible. It just makes me even sadder to think that if he's already reached 'financial rock bottom', that he can't see the benefits in maintaining contact with his daughter. And that his parents don't seem to think it's necessary for him to do so Confused

flamegame · 20/05/2020 18:29

If he’s hiding due to debts and has so little the CMS are worried about leaving him short, it’s unlikely to change soon.

I can’t understand the lack of contact by your ex his parents are condoning, it doesn’t sound like he’s worth much in maintenance.

If the gp were decent they’d be finding some maintenance money, doesn’t sound as though you’d get much even if they found him.

I wouldn’t stop it, your dd won’t understand and it’ll be another loss. They suck, and I wish they were better.

StuntNun · 20/05/2020 18:31

I wouldn't stop your DD from seeing her GP but I wouldn't collide with their lies. It's one thing when she realises they have been lying about her dad but it would be much worse for her if she feels you've been lying to her as well. I'd also tell the GP that you can't manage financially any longer so you've hired someone to track down your ex so that you can get the child maintenance he is legally obliged to pay. Other people manage to set up a business while supporting a family, why can't he?

Spillinteas · 20/05/2020 18:32

Have I missed an update here? Is the Dad in prison for murder? On Drugs?

No Fedhimtothetigers is just making stuff up to support a fictional character Confused

U2HasTheEdge · 20/05/2020 18:33

We had a massive bust up with my husband's parents and stopped the children seeing their Gps for a while. It was the worst thing we ever done and all it achieved was causing hurt for my children who did not deserve it.

It was a shitty situation and we felt justified in that moment, because how could they be good GPs when they had been crap to us? We were wrong, and thankfully it did not take us long to realise it and allow contact again. However, in that time the children suffered due to the actions of adults, they were never at harm from their GPs and it doesn't sound like your daughter is either.

You don't have to like what they are doing OP, it is shitty, but the main problem is your child's father. He is the one who has run off and they are in a crap situation, that from the outside looks really simple to resolve, but maybe not so much when emotions are involved. It doesn't excuse what they are doing, but it is your ex who is harming your daughter.

Don't heap more hurt on her because I think you will regret it if you do in the long run, and your child might not be too happy that you ended contact either.

I completely understand your feelings, it is a horrible position to be in. What matters here though is your daughter and what she wants, and her GPs are an important part of her life. Losing your dad is bad enough, losing more family members just piles on additional hurt that she doesn't need, and will likely lead to a lot of guilt for you too.

StealthMama · 20/05/2020 18:33

Yeah I'd ditch them too. Their relationship with her is her fathers responsibility not yours. Would they like to cover his maintenance bill whilst he is too busy to contribute to her upbringing?? Then we might have a discussion.

But otherwise they are not nice people in facilitating him shirking his responsibilities.

What if he never sorts himself out, when she's old enough to ask herself and they lie to her? No chance, they can sod off.

dontdisturbmenow · 20/05/2020 18:35

@WhatCFeryIsThis, thankfully the courts oy care what is best for the child rather than caring for the power games played by their parents. I'm not obtuse, I just feel sorry for this little girl who'se list her dad and my lose her caring grand parents just because her mum doesn't like not getting what she wants.

Not sure where the info about CMS knowing where he is and him being bankrupt comes from but if this is true, than even more Shane on OP for considering taking her daughter's grandparents from her.

Spillinteas · 20/05/2020 18:36

I'd also tell the GP that you can't manage financially any longer so you've hired someone to track down your ex so that you can get the child maintenance he is legally obliged to pay. Other people manage to set up a business while supporting a family, why can't he?

Absolutely

Figgygal · 20/05/2020 18:41

No I wouldn’t let them see her as it’s all about them they clearly don’t care about her welfare and are enabling his non payment towards his own daughter
Fuck then quite frankly

BreastedBoobilyToTheStairs · 20/05/2020 18:47

Not read the update? CMS has identified his bank account and refused to act on their findings.

Yes I did. CMS identified a new bank account a month ago and aren't taking action now because of Covid.

Had the grandparents shared his address months ago Op might have actually had some maintenance by now. At least it would have potentially quickened things up and they would have had clean hands. By deliberately not sharing the information in order to protect him from the 'maintenance people' as Op said in the Op they're making their priorities pretty clear. Whether it actually has had an impact or not, they think it does and are choosing to be blockers.

EmJay19 · 20/05/2020 18:52

Tricky one
Could share your dilemma with them, explaining you’re not feeling completely comfortable with the relationship continuing as it’s based on deceit / dishonesty etc and that by continuing feels like you’re condoning their part in this which you are not...
Not read all responses so might have been said already...
good luck x

TiddlestheCat · 20/05/2020 19:16

I can't help feeling slightly amused between the spat between Carole Baskin and Fedhimtothetigers. I think that the latter has touched a personal nerve with that username!

Myohmy111 · 20/05/2020 19:22

‘So a 5 year old wants to see daddy who is on drugs. But he loves her and she loves him and desperately wants to see him. That's fine yea?’

Of course not. It’s about what is in the child’s best interests. I agree the grandparents” behaviour is far from ideal. They are clearly torn between loyalty towards their own son and their grandchild. It’s simplistic to deduce, however, that just because they won’t disclose information about their son,s whereabouts that they don’t love their grandchild. Life is not so black and white. And they seem to be blamed for their son’s poor behaviour.
OP, do they provide for her in any other way? Such as giving her gifts?

TiddlestheCat · 20/05/2020 19:24

@Spillinteas

Ooo yes, I like the approach of facilitating contact through their son

Yeah like that’s ever going to happen. He’s fucked off and not seen her for 12 months. Do you think he gives a shit if his parents see her?

Yes, but at least he will likely get it in the neck from them/will suffer from some of the fallout. And the grandparents may start to hold him more accountable and reflect on their own behaviour. At this stage they should be given a bit of a jolt and taken to task over their deceit. The situation could be reassessed after they've been given a kick up the bum!

lynzpynz · 20/05/2020 19:32

They have chosen their responsibility-evading sons desire to escape his responsibility over the needs of their innocent abandoned grandchilds needs to be financially supported.

They actively know where he is and are refusing to cooperate in getting him held accountable? I wouldn't want my daughter exposed to anyone who enabled her to be deprived of her deserved parental support. She's deprived because of him, but they are facilitating this situation. I'd be giving them an ultimatum of A) seeing her or B) cooperating with CMS to disclose where he is. Their response will tell you all you need to know as to where their sympathy and loyalty really lies.

Alsohuman · 20/05/2020 19:34

I'd be giving them an ultimatum of A) seeing her or B) cooperating with CMS to disclose where he is. Their response will tell you all you need to know as to where their sympathy and loyalty really lies

CMS already knows where he is. Their sympathy and loyalty lies in both directions. I imagine they’re being torn in halves in the midst of all this.

quarantinevibes · 20/05/2020 19:38

Not a chance in hell. I’m shocked anyone would actually cover for such a selfish prat Hmm if they think what he’s done is fine, they clearly don’t care about you or your dd

lynzpynz · 20/05/2020 19:40

@Alsohuman I disagree - their loyalty isn't split, it lies with their son. They've actively chosen his wants over their grandchilds welfare by refusing to disclose where he is. CMS might now know, no thanks to them.

Their sympathy may be split between them, but how people can be sympathetic to anyone who has walked out on their child and is now refusing to pay maintenance unless chased down and forced to is beyond me. Innocent child would be picked every single time by me.

Incrediblytired · 20/05/2020 19:50

I was 3 (nearly 4) when my dad left and vanished and never sent cards. His parents had died before I was born and i did have maternal grandparents who lived until I was about 6/7.

I have always felt complete abandonment and rejection by him but by god I would have loved grandparents. Growing up in a single parent family is fine but it can be a bit lonely and from my perspective I would have valued a bigger family.

They sound like arseholes but if this is their only shit decision and they are otherwise decent enough and good to your daughter then I would consider letting her keep the relationship.