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Original poster

Babies stranded in Ukraine

202 replies

Scissor · 15/05/2020 19:05

Just watched the footage on C4. Really not comfortable with any of this. Staff, hospital etc all looking very gowned up, lots of cots in a big space all very clean and hygienic looking but newborn babies with no , and I mean zero, opportunities for attachment ??
This is looking very strange to me.

OP posts:
BarbeDeMaman · 16/05/2020 08:45

On the news article I watched a Spanish man had come to collect his baby. He said the babies were very well looked after. He was on his own because his wife had to work Shock they were "having a baby"! And she had to work. Now imagine she's a doctor or nurse and hugely in demand at the moment. They were still having a baby but that could be shelved because of surrogacy.

anothernamechangeagain · 16/05/2020 09:37

On the news article I watched a Spanish man had come to collect his baby. He said the babies were very well looked after. He was on his own because his wife had to work they were "having a baby"! And she had to work. Now imagine she's a doctor or nurse and hugely in demand at the moment. They were still having a baby but that could be shelved because of surrogacy.

I don't understand your point. Would you have had a problem with the mum collecting and the dad working? Or is it only mothers you have an issue with going to work?

Moomin12345 · 16/05/2020 09:39

I really don't get what the fuss is about. I'm sure the staff take good care of the babies. Apparently if fathers spend as much time with newborns as mothers, their oxytocin levels go up a lot. The magical bond between the mother and her baby is a myth, it's not there before you spend some quality bonding time with the baby. Anyone can do that and the baby won't ever know (or remember).

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 16/05/2020 09:59

Having a baby is not like taking delivery of a new piece of furniture. It's a pivotal moment for the baby, the mother (by which I mean the woman who gives birth to the baby, regardless of her genetic connection to the baby) and the father, if he's involved and around - and in the case of gestational surrogacy the intending parents too. Taking charge of another human life 24 hours a day seven days a week is the biggest responsibility most of us will ever have. Even in the days when most men didn't attend the birth they hotfooted it to the hospital or home as soon as they could to meet the new baby and to see the mother and check she was OK. In the case of a surrogacy, I would expect both intending' parents to be there at the start if humanly possible.

MitziK · 16/05/2020 11:09

I was perfectly capable of looking after it, caring for it, giving it a stable, loving home with great care and good prospects (I'm educated from an MC background and love babies). You know why I gave it up? I didn't want it

Fine. The baby you didn't want wasn't sold. You weren't subject to an agency hawking around your health and attractiveness to the highest bidders. You haven't made a business a fuckton of money and you a few quid because you're poor and couldn't see anything more valuable to sell than your womb.

You could have changed your mind at any point. You wouldn't have been told, tough luck, it's not yours anyway - perhaps the comparable reverse is them coming back to you, saying the adoptive parents have returned it and you have absolutely no choice but to take it forever. It was your decision from a position of power and authority over your own life and body. No rich blokes ordering you around because it's their property you're producing.

tldr · 16/05/2020 11:30

The magical bond between the mother and her baby is a myth, it's not there before you spend some quality bonding time with the baby.

It starts in the womb. It’s well documented.

LaurieMarlow · 16/05/2020 11:32

There is a world of difference between giving up a baby for adoption and producing them to order. Isn’t that obvious?

ducksback · 16/05/2020 11:34

Surrogacy is fucking disgusting. I hope that this light shone on it will raise some questions. Heartbreaking.

ducksback · 16/05/2020 11:38

Yes I acknowledge there needs to be legislation in place to stop vulnerable people being exploited but this outcry that it taking advantage of every woman who is part of it is pearl clutching ridiculousness from people whom it goes against their personal conservative values and therefore think everyone should be banned from doing it

Pearl clutching to be concerned about vulnerable, poor women being exploited and bought by rich men and women? Wow. There is nothing conservative about being anti surrogacy or anti porn - it is about proetecting the vulnerable from exploitation.

Sleepyquest · 16/05/2020 11:38

It's tragic and I'm disgusted and so very sad Sad but I have just had a baby with very few issues so maybe my judgement is clouded and if I struggled with fertility would I feel differently? I'm not sure but as it stands I think this situation is desperately sad

ducksback · 16/05/2020 11:39

Being infertile is not an excuse to buy a baby. It is human trafficking.

tldr · 16/05/2020 11:41

I was infertile. Still knew buying a baby was repugnant.

tldr · 16/05/2020 11:42

And in any case, law makers should make it so that even if people can’t tell it’s repugnant, the law prevents it anyhow.

ducksback · 16/05/2020 11:42

Exactly tldr

SerenDippitty · 16/05/2020 12:04

I was infertile. Still knew buying a baby was repugnant.

So was I and so did I.

LaurieMarlow · 16/05/2020 12:23

I feel desperately sorry for people who can’t have a child, but that doesn’t make buying one ok.

Methtones · 16/05/2020 12:28

I'm infertile. Will never buy a baby.

HavelockVetinari · 16/05/2020 12:46

I've had 7 rounds of IVF, about to do another. I still wouldn't buy a baby.

FudgeBrownie2019 · 16/05/2020 12:51

Using another woman's body to farm a child is inherently wrong however you want to look at it. I won't ever be persuaded otherwise.

The images in the press of those babies in that hotel room are awful; yes, they're warm and safe, yes they're having their basic needs met, but who are they bonding with, who are they loving, who are they being loved by? From the moment I was pregnant with my DC a bond began, I imagine it's probably the same for many other women.

insideoutsider · 16/05/2020 13:32

It looks from the ITV report that the babies genetically belong to parents around the world who have been waiting for years to have a baby, have followed the process and have now been prevented from attending the birth and collecting their babies due to lockdown. I don't think this is a case of them abandoning their babies to be be sold.

www.itv.com/news/2020-05-15/more-than-50-surrogate-babies-wait-to-be-picked-up-from-ukraine/

BeetrootRocks · 16/05/2020 13:46

Yes I think everyone on the thread understands the situation insideouter

RoseGoldEagle · 16/05/2020 13:53

I think it’s going a bit far to suggest these parents might not want the babies if months go by and they’re no longer newborns. They are genetically their babies, I’m sure they’re like the majority of parents and are completely desperate to get them home. It doesn’t sit well with me either, but then I’ve been able to have my own children and can’t imagine how desperate you may feel if you wanted them and couldn’t have them. Do people really object to surrogacy in this country where money isn’t involved? I was just thinking about this the other day- I’m pregnant with my third child (definitely my last), and I think if my sister or close friend needed a surrogate, I would do it for them. I wouldn’t feel it was my baby, as it would be genetically theirs, and I just can’t see the harm to the baby if they take it immediately after it’s born. Anyway, I get this isn’t the situation her and I hated seeing that video too. Poor babies.

Lostvoiced · 16/05/2020 13:55

Surrogacy makes me very uncomfortable.

I don't think you should be able to rent someone's womb. I think it's too easy to be exploited in that situation.

This makes me very sad. I'm sure the carers are doing all they can for the babies, but it doesn't seem right at all.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 16/05/2020 13:56

'Belong'? Babies aren't property. The intending parents have paid large sums to agencies who found the women prepared to act as gestational surrogates. These women have had to go through IVF, pregnancy and birth. We're seeing large numbers of babies stranded because of the pandemic. Some babies with health problems are abandoned even in normal times. Tell me how that doesn't make them commodities.

TinySleepThief · 16/05/2020 14:00

I think it’s going a bit far to suggest these parents might not want the babies if months go by and they’re no longer newborns,

I absolutely can see this being a problem. These babies will most likely develop all kinds of attachment issues as a result of having no one to form a bond with. The people who have brought them did so because they wanted a shiny newborn not a child with attachemnet issues as so often seen in children who have been adopted, if they didnt consider this an obstacle then they would have chosen this route.

These people brought a baby as if it was a product. Its entirely plausible that they won't won't 'damaged' products that these poor babies will be by the time they can fly over and collect the child.

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