To expect my almost 13 yo to make his own breakfast?

[Nicknamegoeshere]

Just that really.

I share care with my not-nice ex who is citing that I am a "neglecting" parent for expecting this. At his house, his (unemployed) much younger gf does this every day for both boys. He is claiming I am making eldest "go hungry."

I am 38 weeks pregnant with my fiancé and I'm desperately trying to get my boys (youngest is 10) to become more independent.

My eldest asked me at 10.45 today to get his breakfast because "he never has to at his dad's."

Neither son does anything around the home and I feel like their servant.

AIBU?

Your ds is just repeating what his dad says. You know that. You just say "the baby is your half sister. The dad is my partner" repeat quietly.

You can't compete with sports cars. You cannot even try.
You can just tell ds he always has a home with you.
He may not choose it right now.

It s certainly way more complex than a teenager expecting you to make his breakfast.

You bringing a new baby into a volatile situation..protect yourself and baby.
Maybd if DS chooses to stay away with dad that s the safest right now.

@Nicknamegoeshere You need to see your GP for your own mental health so you have the emotional strength to deal with this. Phone the GP this week and talk it through with them. Failing that, phone your midwife.

The counselling for your DS - was that arranged by you? Is it private or NHS? If arranged by you, I would update them regularly about how your DS is behaving so they are aware. I would also explain about the upcoming court case.

Equally are his school aware of his abusive behaviour towards you?

I would document everything, dates/times, who was present and what was said.

I also recommend asking for Early Help to get involved - I have had similar cases in school referred for Early Help support.

Ex has told son if he stays with him ft he'll get mainenance from me which can go straight into his Trust Fund and not be spent on the baby.

Are you documenting all this?

If not start a diary with any behaviour which uses your son against you, is financially abusive (including this example), emotionally abusive (including from your son especially if influenced by father).

This is text book coercive control and yes you do meet thresholds on this. Its just difficult to get someone to take seriously and hard to find a solicitor with specialist knowledge on this.

No matter what though start the diary now. It's about building up a long term and sustained deliberate use of the system (courts) against you as much as anything else that's happened now or in the future.

Emails, texts, photos. Anything like that. If social services are involved it needs raising with them too for them to see where things are coming from.

There are changes in the law in progress which may help you in the future with this on going issue. I don't know when they will be passed but since your situation is ongoing it might help you down the line.

@ShawshanksRedemption I spoke to my GP who told me to speak to my mw (the one I had at the time). She was concerned because I was struggling to eat and I was referred to the perinatal MH Team. They discussed my case but said they wouldn't see me as my stresses were not related to my pregnancy.

Yes, I have been keeping a detailed diary.

My son receives his private counselling paid for by my ex. It is around £150 a session which there is no way I could afford. I have spoken to his counsellor on several occasions but of course what my son says in those sessions is entirely confidential. I have made his counsellor aware of the current situation.

Schools know but aren't offering any support while kids are not in. They remain entirely neutral and on the fence of course.

I have sought advice from Early Help but again they have said not much at all they can do until boys are back in school. This will be at least September for eldest.

I have contacted the police many, many times about behaviour of ex and coercive control. I have told them I feel scared. They have repeatedly said it is a civil and not a legal matter so won't get involved.

Not sure what else I can do?

@RedToothBrush Yes (see above). I've asked and asked so many agencies for help but they just seem to pass the buck.

You can take his phone away as a punishment, for a start. If he wants to contact his dad of course he can borrow your phone/your OH's phone/your landline if you have one (best option - might almost be worth getting one for that reason alone!).

You note down length of call, and 'charge' it to his phone when the punishment is over and he gets it back.

Your parents can of course keep in touch with him by contacting him when he's with you. Are they local?

I can't believe he has you all so terrified of him that you have to hide the baby clothes. HE'S TWELVE YEARS OLD. He's not your boss.

You have to draw a line under this and change your future - and his. Stop indulging him. Can you see that your own behaviour is irrational with regards to your eldest?

Break it all down step by step. Talk it through in minute detail with your OH, why you allow your child to rule you, how he has got himself into that position - or you have allowed him to step into it - and work out, step by painful step, how to stop it.

You need to be his parent. That means you make the rules and he follows them.

I know this isn't going to be easy for you, and your baby is due any day, but if you don't do this now, you're going to be too tired to do it when your baby is born and you are sleep deprived and exhausted. If you think it's hard now, it'll be worse then.

Your don't want your dd growing up with a repeat of your ex in the house treating her how your ex treated you; he will and you know he will.

So you have to toughen up now and strongly. You have to fight, you have to be forceful and sure. Your whole family's future (together and individually) is perched precariously on the top of this shit-pile, just waiting to sink into it. Build a bloody strong pillar to secure it, and do it now. You have a few days. Get on with it, it's nearly too late and you'll kick yourself forever if you don't.

This is going to require you to be superhuman.. If you get on with your parents and they're good people then discuss it with them, ask for their help to plan and keep you on the path. Keep your OH involved too. Involve anyone who could help you tease out a plan in record time and then help you carry it out and keep you at it.

"the baby's not related to me"
"well, as you and she have the same mother that's clearly untrue; you are half-siblings. I'm sorry you don't like it but it's a fact and nothing will change it. Live with it."
"My dad says she's not related to me"
"that's your dad for you, isn't it?"

You don't have to get angry, or upset. Practise slow breathing, start now, and every time during the day that you think about your son and how on earth you're going to manage him, take slow deep breaths.

Keep calm and answer calmly and factually. I remember my dad used to laugh when we came out with nonsense as children; he would ask - between choked laughs - why we thought whatever it was, and then ask how that worked when such and such was known to be true..... and so on. I wonder if saying something like "oh away with your nonsense" laughingly would shock him into silence, and maybe even some introspection.

Try not taking him too seriously. 12 year olds, children in general, can come out with such nonsense, and sometimes if they're taken seriously then they take it seriously themselves, then they're stuck in a position where this belief or this behaviour or this emotion becomes too important to let go. So they hang onto it and it becomes more and more important, when if you'd had a little smile about it when it first emerged it can be instantly forgotten.

@Ninkanink

I reiterate my previous statement. Rewarding abuse with affection is absurd. Grow up.

Totally reasonable to do make their own breakfast. My step kids have been doing their own cereal since about 6 ish. They are 9 and 11 now and can also do toast and porridge (in the microwave) and obviously fresh things like yoghurt and fruits. The 9 year old sometimes needs a little help with porridge and toast as our toaster doesn’t pop the toast up very high so it can be hard to get out but the 11yo is capable of helping.

I still don't understand why you don't just let him stay with his dad. He's nearly 13 of course his wishes will count in the eyes of the court. You have got to put your other son, baby and partner first. Yes,I expect your eldest feels pushed out but you are too scared to parent him and that's not fair on anyone including your eldest.
I'm not sure why you think giving him consequences would count against you or why you let your ex control when you see your parents but that's a choice you've obviously already made.
I do feel sorry for you but this behaviour didn't happen over night and I am not sure why you didn't staff changing things when you left your ex. He probably would have responded better at 6.. It sounds,like you've given up. Just let him live with dad.

I was cooking my own breakfast from 4/5 plus when I remembered made my own school lunch. Baffling that he doesn't do his own breakfast put your foot down with the step mum if she wants to cook she shouldn't make you feel bad for it.

I’d think of a lot of different lines to have as lighthearted comebacks .’why do you think men die younger darling? One reason is they divorce or their wife dies and these entitled excuses for adults don’t even know how to feed them self. I’d be surprised if some know how to wipe their own bottom. Anyway as your mother who loves you I won’t let that happen to you sweetheart.’

@Whataloadofshite I am plenty grown up, thank you.

You, on the other hand, are still being ridiculously simplistic, with a very juvenile all or nothing, black and white mindset.

It absolutely is not rewarding bad behaviour. Bad behaviour should have consequences and it is obvious that this child is woefully in need of stricter boundaries and clear, consistent discipline. However that does not negate his need for other, kinder considerations as well. It is not right of you to cast a child who has himself been abused as an abuser simply because he is acting out and his mother is too frightened of and worn down by his father to challenge him. That is on his mother to an extent and almost entirely on his father who is the real abuser here.

@Nicknamegoeshere if you have a suspicion that your ex is autistic, have you explored the notion that your child might also be on the spectrum? It might help you to tailor your approach more effectively to him and put you in mind of some strategies for managing his behaviour.

You seem to be very stuck in this idea that someone from an outside agency can and should swoop in and help you with this. That is not going to happen. You are looking for a show of strength from outside of yourself because you feel unable to challenge your ex’s narrative (and I understand the fear) but this is unrealistic. It is up to you to change your mindset and your behaviour, with the support of your parents and your OH.

Have you currently or have you ever had support from a domestic abuse service? Have children's services been involved?

I'm an ex DV worker, with children specifically, and I had a case that was very similar to yours (definitely not you, exact details are different).

Like your son, the eldest son was being groomed by dad to grow up a misogynist. Dad was raising him to believe that because he was rich, good looking, and most importantly, male he was better than others, especially women.

It's a very odd experience being sat opposite a 10 year old knowing they're humouring you because you're female and therefore lesser than them.

There was a 50/50 care arrangement in this situation because Children's Services didn't want to support mum with the abuse. In this case the school was pretty good, including supporting out of hours, but there was only so much I and they could do when CS was going to court and recommending the contract arrangement continued.

The only saving grace I could see in the situation was the boy was due to go to boarding school in the next year so he'd be further from his father's influence day to day.

You have my sympathies. It was awful all around.

I asked about who you had contacted as it is more documented evidence going forward. But when you get nowhere, go back and ask again for help as the situation still persists. Ask them that if they can’t help, who can? Be persistent.

Go back to your GP and explain you reached a dead end with MW as nothing to do with pregnancy and ask again for support regarding your DS. The suggestion of approaching a DV charity for support is a good one. You deserve that support, your son deserves support.

I imagine that you are a compliant person, brought up to respect people in a position of power and not question it too much if at all. I wonder if your self esteem is so low that you accept the narrative given to you, and that’s all you deserve?

There's truth in the phrase "fake it 'til you make it"; it is amazing how helpful it is pretending that you are something you're not, eg, sure of your decisions.

Work out your plan of how you're going to change things, then pretend you're sure of it. Pretend, pretend pretend at first. Tell yourself that you are the strong firm loving parent he so desperately needs, and pretend that you believe it. When he comes out with another piece of cruelty or bad behaviour or whatever, stop, deep breaths until you are calmer and PRETEND LIKE BILLY-OH!!! Do the firm loving parent thing, then deep breaths again.

He'll learn quite quickly that his current strategies are not working (it'll probably feel like forever to you but it really won't be). Once you're on the right parenting road it gets easier and easier to stay on it and sometime you'll suddenly realise that you are doing it for real.

Please try. Please

To answer re seeing my parents... Obviously not possible atm due to lockdown rules. They live about a ten minute walk away.

When my OH walked past with my youngest about two weeks ago they waved and said hi - all correctly socially distanced. Eldest immediately called his dad upon their return.

Next thing we know there is a policeman at my door asking to speak to me, saying he had a report that I had been visiting my parents.

I hadn't even left the bloody house all day!!!

This is just the tip of the iceberg re false allegations.

@Rosebel We have only had problems with son sInce we told him about the pregnancy.

His father then tried to keep them under the guise of the coronavirus and told son the baby, and my mum, would both die if they came home. Ex emailed to say I wouldn't be seeing them "for the forseeable future." This happened to be on Mother's Day when they were due back to me.

Here is one of son's original messages to me:

I don’t want to come back as I’m worried about you and the baby and I don’t want anyone getting ill because of me.

I got an urgent court application and judge upheld 50/50.

Then it started being about the baby. Text to son from ex:

They should not be involving (youngest) in reading to the baby. Totally wrong. He needs to grow up. He will soon realise when it is born and he is totally ignored.

@Nicknamegoeshere

As I said previously, why didn’t you post this on the relationship boards? You have already posted your other thread there..?

I agree, I wouldn’t hide the baby clothes and would take the his phone off him. However, you also need to contact your MP and push and push with the other agencies, as you are being failed.

Like I said previously, his comments about your unborn child ARE very concerning. Please contact WA.

Keep all the texts. If you can't get a copy of them, make a note of when they were received, who by, basic gist of what was said.

All these incidents need to be noted/diarised.

Who is your boss? Your son? Your ex? NO they're not. You are an independent woman who had the strength to leave a seriously dangerous man, who had already managed to survive throughout her relationship with him, who has gone on to make a good relationship with someone kinder and who is more deserving of you. You are knackered and lost hope, but even so, there is still hope - it is just there at your fingertips otherwise you wouldn't have posted in the first placed. Grab it, there is still time.

Oh, another thought.

Do you have a voice in your head saying 'should'? You should do better, you should know better, you should do this that and the other, you should you should you should?

I had that once. It was a combination of my mum and my dh (not so d back then). My neuro-psych suggested I change those 'shoulds' to 'coulds' and then eventually to drop them altogether. Ask myself 'why should I? who is telling me that?', analyse how reasonable they are or I am in entertaining them and allowing them to influence me; that I was doing OK as it was and I didn't need them they didn't help. It made an enormous difference.

I can remember those dark days and in comparison I now live in the sun! Not perfect, but bright and colourful and hopeful.

@REignbow Thank you. I've contacted WA on many occasions. Their advice is to seek legal support (which I am doing).

@Aclh13 I've never met my ex's gf. They have been together about four years but from what I can understand she doesn't really leave the house much.

Your ex sounds like a dick. Most mornings my DS (6) gets up to do himself a juice and cereal as he gets up at 6am. I then follow up with some toast, but he's started to do that with supervision himself too.

At 13, my DD (now 18) could cook her own dinners if she needed to, so spaghetti and a sauce she would make from scratch. I think your ex has low expectations of your DS if he thinks he's unable to make his own breakfast. Sure he's more than capable at that age.

OP as I see it there are two BIG positives here in the last few comments you’ve made:

Your son’s comments regarding your baby are not how he actually feels, that is quite clear. He is has been lied to and is frightened for himself/you/the baby, on several probably conflicting levels, but in real terms he is only parroting his father’s words. That is not nearly as concerning as it could be. He shows in his text that he cares about you and the baby. That’s a good thing.

Secondly, your ex knows full well that he is losing control - he knows that you and your OH are a stronger team now, he knows that a new baby in the family will cement things further between your new unit including your son’s, and that he is likely in the future to lose his grip over you. That’s why he has stepped up his abuse and his efforts to poison your son’s thinking. YOU are in the stronger position. All that needs doing is flipping a switch in your head to stop you still treating him as your boss/a godlike figure of authority/the arbiter of truth and reality, even if only in others’ views (because they don’t actually view him as that - that’s your perception). You already KNOW he’s none of those things, of course, but you have got years’ worth of fear and cowering and terror which causes anxieties as to what could possibly happen, and an emotional reaction to what actually does happen, that isn’t actually warranted.

Ok so the police came out and checked if you have been visiting your parents. So what? No big deal. I know you said there have been other false allegations, and of course it’s hellish and a hassle that you can do without and every time you are drawn back in to the worry and stress, anger and frustration. But beyond that you need to stop giving the results of his tactics more credence than they merit. The police do not care that you might have visited your parents. They won’t remember it tomorrow. Nobody cares. It is not a big deal. Stop allowing him to rule your emotions with petty things like that.