To think New Zealand has thrown out human rights?

[LilacTree1]

Nodding through these powers

www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12331547&fbclid=IwAR1ZDq19eKTqCU8qp3fSl_rLikEHlk2fSc9NdHXnXAW1NbOMBayws6rqMO4

eaglejulesk

Born and raised there and the entire family is there so yes I would say I am "invested".

Where were you born and raised?

but probably neither could give a shit that some people in the UK are furious at them and some regard them as role models.

This - we couldn't care less what the UK thinks.

Where were you born and raised?

Where do you think?

Where do you think?

No idea. Why don't you give me a hint?

If you're a Kiwi, no doubt you'll fully understand why an expat Kiwi would be so ongoingly "invested" in NZ.

Well said MH1111. One thing trusting the Government and its leader, an entirely different thing trusting the police. What was it some of them said here when the new Covid laws were implemented, something along the lines of 'it's like kids being let loose in a sweet shop'. Indeed. Many good police workers but equally you will find you fair share of racists, homophobes, misogynists, domestic abusers and bullies. All of whom now have free reign to enter the homes of New Zealanders. No thanks.

I spoke to my friend on 22nd March and they hadn’t closed schools, pubs or restaurants at that point. Not sure if they did at a later date.

Lockdown was announced on March 23rd, and started at 11.59 pm on March 25th.

@CHIRIBAYA - FFS - grow up!

No-one I know is even remotely concerned, and I'm there

There was some Twitter chatter but after the changes were made most of it seemed to die off.

A salient point might be that the legislation was enacted because the police needed a continuance of powers granted under the expired state of emergency, but the state of emergency returning is a real possibility if there's a second wave with the loosening of lockdown. We are not in such a different position than we were a few days ago and there needs to be temporary cover to reflect the tenuousness of the current situation.

Policy is made on the basis of what is best for the country, which can be bad for individuals

e.g. paying higher rate tax for decades was never in my personal interest - like a ball & chain around my ankle - but I had to accept it was better for the country

Lockdown may mean some businesses going bust and people losing their jobs
Relaxing lockdown may mean more people in some jobs like teaching die, maybe even a very few children

However, both of these stages are judged necessary for the country as a whole,
even if disastrous for individuals

Toffee “ NI number, NHS records, HMRC,”

Apart from the obvious, what records do they have?

I think if I was living in No I would be fine with it all for now , obviously as time progresses if they think as a nation things should start getting relaxed and government aren't I'm sure there would be public uproar , but for now at least they are starting to get back to normal

@Namenic Boris didn't rule out having different restrictions in different areas in the future

i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/121511076/coronavirus-nz-podcast-winston-peters-says-china-didnt-want-nz-to-go-into-lockdown

My concerns about Chinese political interference - at least in one aspect of pandemic management - appear to have been correct.

NZ is something of a nation of pragmatists. So if we can see a valid reason and need, we're likely to accept something - if the person proposing it seems, and has proven themselves to be, trustworthy. JA has done that. That doesn't mean that a keen eye won't be kept on things, on the look out for abuses.

And it's not quite as easy in NZ as it seems to be in the UK (or the US, for that matter), to avoid scrutiny and extremely hard and pointy questions from the press, and the public, and simply bully and bluster and never actually answer the damned question.

Friends and family in NZ are amazingly happy. We've even since thought of moving out there because they handled this so so well

Here has been just blah.

Good luck with moving to NZ. Have you checked out the detailed information of doing it? We investigated it after three months there, and, given our age, were not rich enough. The financial qualification hurdle is really huge. Plus, there were family matters we couldn't walk away from.

TBh I think it’s far too early to know who has and hasn’t handled this in “the right way.We don’t know what is going to happen when countries start to come out of lockdown. It’s highly possible that those with early death rates may escalate once they come out of lockdown because they’re more exposed. And lockdown can’t happen indefinitely. Even closing the borders until a vaccine is found isn’t realistic. What happens if a vaccine isn’t found?

Also countries in Africa aren’t reporting their death rates because they have no idea. Many people die over there anyway and are simply buried with no idea as to what they died of. Premature death in countries with high malnutrition are sadly common. It’s estimated that in Nigeria for instance the death tole is about 500 times that which is being reported.

This is a long game, for all of us.Even the WHO said yesterday that this is going to be around forever, and nobody actually knows yet whether early lockdown was best or not.

I am very jealous of my NZ family who were able to reunite with friends in person...think we are a very long way from that.

@eaglejulesk And selfishly, I want to be able to go home and visit my very sick dad before it's too late, so the idea that the borders will be closed for a minimum of 18 months or until a vaccine is found, is terrifying.

Surely the borders are closed to those coming in, not leaving.

I have the small matter of two kids to worry about. If I take them they potentially miss a lot of school now there are quarantines bit ends of the journey and likewise if I leave them, who knows when I will see them. I think you know a bit about my situation and leaving them isn't ideal.

both ends..

I think that the way NZ has dealt with this is amazing and if I was a Kiwi I think I'd be feeling pretty proud of having such a responsive, and responsible, government.

I'm also hugely impressed with Jacinta Ardern and think she's proving to be a remarkable PM. How different from the waffling, shambolic mess that is supposedly running the UK.

@Hoggleludo, I have a friend who is amazingly well-travelled. Not long ago, I asked her where she would choose to live, other than the UK, and her answer was NZ.

I was a bit surprised tbh, because she's something of a culture vulture and I thought she'd miss the threatres, galleries, concert halls etc but she said that NZ was far more cultured than she ever imagined and that even quite small towns have galleries and often arts festivals as well.

@LakieLady New Zealand is extremely cultured. I grew up visiting art galleries every week in my smaller home town and later when older and moved to bigger cities there is everything that you would find in the UK - galleries, museums, orchestras - you name it we have it. Wellington the capital is my favourite city in this world- it's just fantastic there. A great boutique coffee and food scene too. Also many independent and local fashionistas with good quality and well designed clothing.

Yes , to whoever suggested borrowing their PM if only ......

NZer here, living in the South Island. Pretty much everyone I know is hugely supportive of the government's actions in managing the virus. Schools are reopening tomorrow and things are edging towards some sort of normal. Yes, there are are media niggles around human rights and the police, but these are viewed as the grumbling of a right wing media and an ineffective unintelligent leader of the opposition looking to score points ahead of the September General Election.

Saying this, NZ is not an egalitarian paradise and there are ongoing issues around colonialism, assimilation and white privileged. Sure Maori people receive some benefits in terms of treaty settlements and educational support, and to a lesser extent Pacifica people, but this in no way makes amends for the harm done to these cultures by the system imposed as part of colonialism. The issues are really complicated and in many cases there is high emotion on both sides, but nobody wants any community to be vulnerable to the virus and so there is a sense of doing this together got everybody's health. Sure, we have no clue how the economic effects are going to play out given our isolation and the value of tourism. But reading through this kind of discussion i do get a sense that people in other countries are just hanging out to see us falling flat on our face after our success to date at managing the virus, given all the woful comments from people who don't live here about our economy, our isolation and reliance on tourism from China.

Somebody made a comment that kiwis are parochial and don't travel much, with few holding passports. That is absolutely not true. Kiwis love to travel - most young people spend decent periods overseas and older people are very adventurous in their travels. I know of a large choir in the town where I live made up of older people and all of them travelling to NYC a couple of years ago to perform - no one batted an eyelid. Lots of kiwis are getting very twitchy about not being able to travel overseas for a while and I know a load of people who are planning big NZ road trips this year to support our tourism and whilst things are quiet.

Who knows if and when a second wave will come, but in the meantime there is great faith in out government and great will to protect the vulnerable.