To think New Zealand has thrown out human rights?

[LilacTree1]

Nodding through these powers

www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12331547&fbclid=IwAR1ZDq19eKTqCU8qp3fSl_rLikEHlk2fSc9NdHXnXAW1NbOMBayws6rqMO4

“ On top of the revelations yesterday out pouce were trialing facial recognition technology without authorisation it is incredibly worrying.“

This is a worldwide problem. The sad thing is, I don’t think many people care.

I ha e, as ever, highlighted my concerns to the local
MP and Sadiq Khan. We are sleepwalking into becoming China.

“ The uk actually has v restrictive rules regarding infectious TB. But people don’t complain.”

They are specific to the problem of infectious disease. Lockdown is not. It’s the mass restriction of healthy people to stop the spread of a disease when the government did nothing to stop it.

I am curious OP.

What do you suggest NZ should have done differently and on what basis? Not in a fighty way, I am genuinely interested.

Namenic
95,000 people arrived at UK airports over the past two months. Almost half weren't British citizens. Who knows where any of them (British or not) went on to.

Still no checks or quarantine at all at UK airports.

During a pandemic it's as relevant saying London is an international travel hub as it is saying Cornwall is a major tourist hub. For now Cornwall isn't a major tourist hub. Likewise for now London doesn't need to be an international travel hub. In fact it needs the opposite.

Holy shit. Lefty has lost their fucking minds.

I’m not an expert on NZ. But they were sensible about closing borders. Surely they could have opted for a Swedish approach?

Stand corrected - I think there are some laws allowing medics to detain people in hospital, but looks like there is a time limit.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2005/may/09/publichealth.uknews

NZ did it the right way and locked down early. Boris left it too late for people now arriving in the UK to be quarantined. People wont do it and do you think all those arrivals will be monitored for 2 weeks to make sure they are staying inside. Police in Auckland hotels were making sure people stayed in.

With the mass gatherings planned in the UK and people going about normal travel on buses and trains, the UK has no hope. People are fed up.
Have a lovely picnic this weekend but it could be your last...and there will only be 2 people at your funeral.

Booking a flight to NZ...but it might be safer to have a winter there than a summer at risk here!

I'm a Kiwi living in NZ, formerly English (left the UK 27 years ago).

I'm hugely proud of the way the whole country has come together to prevent COVID-19 getting a foothold here. We had the luxury of time and distance, and the ability to learn by other countries' experiences. We have been able to learn from their mistakes and their successes.

I think JA and the government has done a completely fantastic job at keeping us safe - the "go hard and go early" total lockdown has really worked for us - and well over 80% of Kiwis feel the same way.

Public backing for NZ Covid-19 response rises to 87% – new poll

I trust our government to do the right thing in terms of the legislation. It's good to see there's a sunset clause, that's a very sensible addition. The government has been extremely transparent in their dealings during the COVID crisis, and right at the start they set up the Epidemic Response Committee consisting of MPs from all sides, with the Opposition in a majority. Their job is to oversee and question the government's decisions and actions during this time.

I think we're doing pretty well so far. Our numbers are very low (no new cases in the past three days, for example), and today we were able to move from level 3 to level 2 after 7 weeks in lockdown/partial lockdown.

The thing that we're really concerned about is the dreaded second wave. That's why we are moving slowly in terms of the number of people who are allowed to gather in one place for various activities, as evidence shows that social gatherings like weddings, funerals, and parties are a major cause of COVID infection clusters. The legislation allows police to intervene and close down large events if it's deemed necessary. I'm fine with that. I don't want our hard work ruined by selfish people thinking they can flout the rules and put us all at risk.

“ Have a lovely picnic this weekend but it could be your last...and there will only be 2 people at your funeral. ”

My neighbour’s dad died this week, I think it’s ten at the funeral but I’m not completely sure.

If people are worried about facial recognition technology now being put in place.....think about all the pics and info you put on Facebook, Instagram, Google ads....the government already know all about you and your shopping preferences.....get off Social Media or tighten your privacy settings. Profiling the public has been going on for years. WHy do you think FB was created lol

If you take into account deaths per million and population per sq km into the statistics you might be surprised to know Sweden is actually the worse country .

Per million, Sweden ranks only nom6 in the league table of shame

My point is that UK isn’t much more of a travel hub than Singapore and Hong Kong. In addition, it has fewer points of entry than Germany and Slovakia.

UK made no effort to do border control - personally I think a mistake. However, now we are in this situation, what is the best way forward?

There are the herd immunity proponents - which can be reasonable, but risks lots of deaths.

Or the isolate, test, trace. But this is high economic cost and some don’t think there is much point now UK is in such a big mess.

Personally I think the most effective way to do isolate, test, trace would be to geographically split up UK with roadblocks and start lifting restrictions in areas with low infections. People have objected on the basis of this being too restrictive, but I think this is the only effective way to implement the policy.

I suppose it boils down to what the public want... which is probably split - a bit like brexit.

Devonport “ If people are worried about facial recognition technology now being put in place.....think about all the pics and info you put on Facebook, Instagram....”

I don’t do any of that.

Also the herd immunity may it be possible if the immunity generated by corona is not long-lasting. So additional risk ther

It's not just Facebook or any other SM. If you're using Google (Android phones), Apple, or Windows.
NI number, NHS records, HMRC, DVLA.

They already have our information (if they want it).

NZ is leading the way re dealing with Covid.

So you believe closing the borders would have been enough to halt the transmission?

Again, I am not an expert on NZ (nor am I an expert on NSW where I am in this area), however I understood the NZ (and that in parts of Oz) was to close the borders, get a handle on the virus with everyone locked down as much as possible and once a handle/track and trace method was in place start loosening restrictions.

This is in fact what has/is happening. In NSW, we are cautiously re-opening (my kids have been at school part time this week) with the plan to pounce on any new cases as they show up. We can be tested (and are positively encouraged to be) with the slightest sniffle and sentinel testing is in the works.

NZ may have actually managed to eliminate the virus by doing this, though I don't think that is actually an option for us in Oz.

I just don't see how we could have done it differently? I am a hard faced bitch and probably would have been willing to sacrifice the elderly for my kid's economic future (if given the choice), but as I understand it letting this bastard run wild will mean a lot of death across more age groups - including myself, my husband and my kids (who if I am honest are the only people I actually care about) AND would have cost more financially in the long run.

Many of us are complying not out of fear of sanction or even fear of the virus but out of an understanding of the situation. A luxury we are able to have because I think the information provided to us by our Government(s) has been quite good overall (with some notable exceptions).

I am even now considering downloading the app proposed as the Legislation has been properly passed by parliament and it is appropriate and within power. I don't trust the Government exactly, but I trust the Constitution and I trust the High Court and I trust the Separation of Powers, because I understand them and they have worked well so far.

Let's hope Boris passes a similar by the weekend when the mass gatherings will be taking place and spreading it all.

Stay in! Watch netflix! Save you own life! :)

Right on this thread there is perfect evidence of the difference between idealised or privileged versions of NZ and different realities. Flagrant racism from some posters saying, 'i know what those maori are really like' and claiming they've been wanting to sit on their arse and take money for years.

Then a poster like Harakeke - who from the name is either maori or identifying with the maori heritage of their nation - giving a very different viewpoint.

Yes people love the current leader but it is pretty dangerous when ANY leader is extremely popular because laws and practices that would normally be questioned, examined, criticised etc can very easily be red carpeted through on an ahh but she's lovely, she wouldn't do anything to hurt us buggers conveyor belt.

And yes NZ has handled it well but they're also an island at the arse end of nowhere in terms of international travel and stopovers who already have really strict airport control that xrays everything you own in case you bring in fruit or nuts or seeds etc because they're really protective of their ecosystem.. I literally got questioned for 20 minutes at auckland airport because they saw boots in my suitcase on the xray and wanted to know where I'd worn them. I had to give a smiling elaborate reassurance that I lived in a town and had never worn them in the countryside and no they couldn't possibly have come in contact with cow or sheep excrement (I actually live in a village but they were new bloody boots and I'd only worn them on concrete and didn't want to muddy the waters). So in a really good position not to import diseases and to react quickly when they realise there is a potentially global pandemic.

I only spent a month or two in NZ staying with a friend and meeting locals and doing a bit of traveling to other parts rather than being a tourist traveling to 'spots' only itms and yes it's a beautiful countryside but it's not some idyllic paradise. There is still deep resentment and racism towards the maori and a sense that they're freeloading and entitled and overindulged and pandered to because of 'ages ago' history (as a poster has demonstrated on this thread) not that the Maori community has no challenges or people who present challenging behaviour.

People are also, in the experience I had, incredibly patriotic and sure they live in the best country in the world and are much like Americans in terms of numbers who have actually been abroad and levels of exposure to nuanced world views.

Don't get me wrong in my travelling years kiwis were some of my favourite fellow travellers and great fun and open minded and humorous but visiting NZ myself made me realise that those were the rare minority who determinedly made it off of nz and went travelling for their '2 year trip' and not unusually didn't go back.

Sorry for the derail. I mostly felt uncomfortable about the way that Harakeke's view was brushed over.

Anyone who believes that the current States of New Zealand and Australia were not founded on invasion, genocide and theft is kidding themselves. Same as most countries really. Humans treat other humans appallingly over and over and over again.

Of course they were, people just don't want to admit the comfort and privilege they enjoy are built on past (and present) inequality. Because if you admit it, then you either need to admit to yourself that you don't care that much (hence why you are not doing anything yourself) OR you have to actually get up and try and do something about it.

Nzer here, our household and all of my friends are really happy with how things have been run. I'm not concerned about the legislation under our current government. I'm happy for my freedom to be restricted in order to keep people safe. We live in the city though and it's not all sheep and farms like people might think !

They haven't changed the length of a parliament so this lot can be voted out at the next election if they don't like it.
So this is a spurious thread.

@LiesHumansTellThemselves why do you think the same result could not have been achieved in Australia? I'm genuinely curious, not goading, because I'm really peeved Australia didn't take action sooner (and stronger, and more equitably), but I recognise I might be missing something obvious!

Oh I think it could have been, but we appear to be going for suppression rather than elimination.

A decision I don't 100% agree with, but I don't know enough about the deeper details to say that would have been correct approach.

People are hurting under lockdown, I hope we have made the right decision with the gradual reopening/suppression option and not simply thrown away the value in the all of the pain. Only time will tell.

For us, we are doing only what is necessary, which for me includes the kids attending school. DH and I will both continue to work from home for as long as possible and we will continue with takeaway/delivery/shopping as infrequently as possible as well. Every person not out there is a break in the chain.

Who knows, maybe we will get lucky!

@LiesHumansTellThemselves I think (and I have seen modelling to support this idea) the extended lockdown with more deaths and suppression is going to be more economically harmful than NZ's short sharp shock approach was. (not to mention the humanitarian harm). That's why I'm so irritated :(.