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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU - partner wants me to stop speaking Italian with my mum

515 replies

countrywalks1 · 12/05/2020 10:25

AIBU? Me and my partner have been staying at my mum's flat because of covid issues. She told me after 2 days here that she feels it's rude that I speak Italian with mum in front of her as she doesn't know what's going on and doesn't understand the language. I replied saying I understand it must be frustrating not to know, especially as she's the kind of person who likes to know everything, and the pandemic is really tough on her as she's homesick and hasn't been home properly for months, so I can understand why as she says she feels excluded.

However, my counterpoint was that I usually (about 60%) talk with mum in Italian. Culturally, I would say I'm half British and half Italian - I've mostly grown up in the UK but was born and most of my extended family are and live in Italy. I speak Italian fluently, but if I don't speak it regularly it gets a bit worse as I get out of practice with tenses and conjugations etc.

So I speak Italian with my mum because: 1) for me it's the language we've always communicated; 2) it makes me feel more connected with my Italian culture; 3) it pleases me to practice it; 4) I'm pretty sure my mum prefers talking to me in Italian than in English as she doesn't really get to speak it with anyone after my granddad (her dad) passed away a few years ago as did my very bilingually fluent brother. It's complicated I know!!!!

So told this to my partner, she says she appreciates the reasoning but still unnecessary to speak it when she's there as it feels she's excluded. I told her I understand why but I struggle to understand why she couldn't move past it as I've been in the same situation with friends speaking a language I don't understand where I just talk English when I can, or ask what's going on. The other thing is that usually my mum will save talking to me in Italian for mum things like telling me off or telling me to do something. I emphasised that we're never using it to talk about her or be nasty, and we kind of slip into it naturally.

Still she says she feels excluded, which at this point I understand. She was also in my opinion a bit nasty and in anger said we moved over here to the UK and chose to stay so we shouldn't really be talking Italian anymore anyway, we should be British. This I put down to anger that I wasn't understanding her point of view. In her defence she did also say I could speak it if I taught her Italian, although I struggle that the emphasis is on me to teach her when we have been together for 8 years and even gone over to visit my Italian relatives in Italy and been to weddings etc - without ever having tried to learn. Albeit we've been doing vocational education together throughout this time so many other important things to learn.

So last night I worked really hard to make sure I spoke only in English with everyone, so when mum asked me something in Italian I actively made sure to reply in English.

I just need to know AIBU in feeling disappointed? I understand my partner's frustration, and I can try to cut down on the Italian for a little while because of the circumstances - it's tough being homesick and then not even being able to understand the conversation where you are. It's just the request that I cut down on speaking Italian with my mum when she's also there - as I told her, I expect that I will always see mum with her (we're planning on getting married). I also feel that she's asking me to hide away (in the context of communicating with mum) a little part of my own culture. Therefore, AIBU to not let this lie?

OP posts:
Abbccc · 13/05/2020 14:36

By all means speak to your mother in Italian some of the time but if you asked you GF to be there during lockdown it doesn't hurt to include her in some of the conversation.
But they do! The OP only speaks Italian with his/her mum about half the time anyway!

KTheGrey · 13/05/2020 14:38

Ideal opportunity to learn Italian while the online courses and apps are free Grin

Mittens030869 · 13/05/2020 14:43

Meh - i was leaning towards agreeing with your partner until the "you came over here you should be British".

I flipping hate that attitude. It's a part of the British psyche that harks back to the British Empire. Or Norman Tebit and the 'cricket test', which team do you support when England play Pakistan/West Indies?

Dontforgetyourbrolly · 13/05/2020 14:44

Offer to teach her italian .
I'm half Italian and last boyfriends have always expressed disappointment that I dont speak it with the Italian side of my family, this is because they want to practice their English!
My sil is Filipino and speaks tagalog with my eldest niece , and it really is only for telling her off eg. Tidy up those things, do your homework etc etc

DGRossetti · 13/05/2020 14:50

Offer to teach her italian

After 8 years ?

Brefugee · 13/05/2020 15:17

I wonder what the etiquette is (if any) when you do understand the language that people are speaking in front of (or behind) you, and it's obvious the participants aren't aware ?

It depends. If they're having a convo about stuff that doesn't involve anyone else, isn't rude about the people around them etc etc i just ignore. If they're generally making a funny comment, which people would laugh at if they were speaking the local language, i laugh and make some comment too, just so they know not to start discussing secret stuff or being rude about me.

If they are being rude about me or someone else that i think should know - I'll give that very polite cough and say something innocuous and unrelated but definitely letting them know i understand them.

It depends on my mood.

SonnyRobes · 13/05/2020 15:36

I'm multilingual and I haven't read all the comments but here's my opinion.
If you and your mother both speak English then it's rude to speak Italian to your mother when your partner is there. It's a bit like if you went to your partner's parents' house and your partner and her mother whispered to each other all the time so you couldn't hear what they were saying. Even if they usually whisper, it would make you feel excluded and a bit paranoid too.
Also, it's going to be very difficult for your mum and your partner to bond if you create a situation where you're only speaking to one of them at a time. You speaking to your mother in English allows your partner to chime in and build a conversation between the three of you so they can get closer.
It's up to you whether you speak English or Italian but it's definitely rude to exclude your partner. I'd recommend speaking in broken Italio-English so that your partner learns some Italian and feels included.

Abbccc · 13/05/2020 16:59

Sonny don't you think the partner is rude to request what language the OP's mum speaks to her own child in her own house?

OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 13/05/2020 17:03

It's ruder to have guests you invited and make them feel excluded

TheMotherofAllDilemmas · 13/05/2020 17:18

When the guest has been with you for six weeks, the guest needs to assume the family cannot be expected to put their language away for the foreseeable future to accommodate their guest’s need. She should be doing more effort on respecting the culture and learning the language.

My exILS are all bilingual and I am multilingual myself, before I was familiar with their language, they were happy to speak my language when we were doing stuff together but I wasn’t expecting them to switch language completely to accommodate me.

My partner is English and monolingual, we visited my family (who can communicate fluently in two languages, but can only understand a bit of English but speak hardly none). We were happy to translate and make the effort to integrate him, but after 2 weeks I was exhausted and fed up of having to translate everything all the time, it just takes a lot of effort to do it for days on end and conversations are not the same. I wouldn’t mind however to speak in any language during a party/short visit, but weeks and weeks on end? No, it is too much effort, the guest here needs to be more considerate and allow her hosts to be their normal selves, in their own language, regularly.

mrpumblechook · 13/05/2020 17:24

When the guest has been with you for six weeks, the guest needs to assume the family cannot be expected to put their language away for the foreseeable future to accommodate their guest’s need. She should be doing more effort on respecting the culture and learning the language.

She presumably didn't plan to stay there for six weeks and therefore could not have learned Italian in anticipation. It's not something that takes a few hours. Obviously if they decide to stay there for years she should learn. More likely she is planning to get out as soon as possible so that she doesn't feel excluded anymore.

mrpumblechook · 13/05/2020 17:28

My partner is English and monolingual, we visited my family (who can communicate fluently in two languages, but can only understand a bit of English but speak hardly none). We were happy to translate and make the effort to integrate him, but after 2 weeks I was exhausted and fed up of having to translate everything all the time, it just takes a lot of effort to do it for days on end and conversations are not the same.

Not relevant in this case as the MIL lives here and speaks perfect English.

PinkDramaLlama · 13/05/2020 17:32

I sat in a business meeting once with some Germans who were speaking to each other some of the time in German. It did not occur to them that any of our team could speak German - so we got a great insight into what they were really thinking. It was very funny. I nearly said something to them, but decided not to as it was too helpful for our side of the negotiation.

TheMotherofAllDilemmas · 13/05/2020 17:32

It is still not the same.

countrywalks1 · 13/05/2020 17:35

Thanks everyone for the responses!! I haven't had time to read them all but just an info update, both mum and I are bilingual.

I think people are right that it's rude, I suspect as the standard method of language in mum's house has always been a mix of Italian and English, I've never noticed that we converse more in the former than latter. However, mum is quite rude generally (eg she's the kind of person who spends her life on her phone) so I guess I've been wrong in assuming her talking in Italian around other people when she could speak English was more cultural rather than poor mannered?

Spoken to my partner about this, and she agrees that I've never seen things which other people think of as rude in the same way (eg I have lower standards!) and I agree with that! In her defence to some earlier posters she's always said she wants our kids to be bilingual and for me to teach them.

Anyhow, I've decided to let it lie, as at the end of the day I don't want my partner to not feel welcome at the family home. Thank you everyone again for the insight!

OP posts:
OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 13/05/2020 17:40

That's wayyyyy too reasonable update for MN, OP😂

TempestHayes · 13/05/2020 18:30

I still feel 'you're here and you should be British now and never speak Italian' is massively racist and creepy.

I'd probably never speak English around her again for fun, but I like being stubborn.

TheMotherofAllDilemmas · 13/05/2020 18:39

I still feel 'you're here and you should be British now and never speak Italian' is massively racist and creepy.

Agree, not the best way to get along with her Italian family.

ArgumentativeAardvaark · 13/05/2020 18:53

Ha brilliant, OP posts to say she (he?) has found a reasonable compromise and still there are people trying to goad her (him?) into dumping the partner!

Glad you found the views helpful and have sorted things out OP!

CorianderLord · 13/05/2020 19:02

I don't think it's rude of you but I would agree to speak in English if she tries to learn Italian

OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 13/05/2020 19:31

I don't think it's rude of you but I would agree to speak in English if she tries to learn Italian

Hmm 🙄 As if that's how life and relationships work

VerityB1 · 13/05/2020 19:51

How lucky for you to be fluent in 2 languages and the benefits to any children you might have will be huge.

It must be lovely for you and your mum to chat along in Italian but equally I can see, your DP, this being done in front of her, is likely to feel excluded ... esp if she is a bit of a control freak, which you need to think about seriously.

Can your DP not learn Italian as well. Can she phone your mum and your mum teach her? It's an amazing opportunity.

bellinisurge · 13/05/2020 19:58

She should learn Italian. Duolingo might help.
It would be helpful if you and your Mum encourage her.
Learn a song or two in Italian.

OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 13/05/2020 20:09

Has anyone actually ever learned language with duolingo to a conversational standard?😂
I checked my language on it and my DH checked his and we are both scratching our heads as to how do people actually learn to use the language through duolingo...

lyralalala · 13/05/2020 20:22

The only thing I learned on duolingo to a good standard was how to order apples and water in Spanish.

It is obsessed with apples and water.