To think DH has crossed a line

[StuckInPollyannaMode]

DH has been having a mid life crisis, for want of a better way to describe it, for nearly 2 years now. We’ve been together for 10 years and have 2 kids. He helps in the house, pulls his weight (mostly, when not working his v long hours) with the kids and makes me laugh like a drain. But he’s been struggling and it’s a bit like living with a dementor - he can’t see the joy in life at all, everything is difficult or awful or sighworthy. Nothing is positive or funny and he’s a complete workaholic- he’s talk about work til midnight most nights if I let him.

Our eldest has some challenges. Tonight she has played up. He ended up coming in and telling her that not only would he need to call the police because of her behaviour but that he wished we’d never had the children. He’s so dramatic about everything and can’t see that this is really unhelpful.

Last week he told me that he wished he was dead because the children were playing up so much.

I’ve begged him to go to counselling.

He won’t.

I’m slowly losing all respect for him. He huffs and puffs and it’s like having a third child. I’m constantly having to be super positive to offset his negativity.

The irony is we’ve had the nicest day we’ve had in ages.

The other day I actually found myself imagining what it would be like to be divorced. There’s got to be more to life than this. Not that it’s something I want, and the children would be devastated. But these small things keep happening and I can’t forget them. It’s building and I don’t know what to do, except repeat once again that it’s not acceptable. But I’m not his mother or his therapist.

AIBU to think he needs to get himself under control and stop saying things like that in front of the children?

Omg- that is dreadful

@StuckInPollyannaMode I am so sorry what you are going through. Explain that he needs to change the way he communicates with you and the children if he does not want the house to be permanently damaged.

Maybe set up a play routine that involves you as a family him included. For example ask the children to tidy a bit at 5:30 so you can have family time until they go to bed playing a board game, watching a movie etc just so that not all interactions are negative.

What caused him to bin the present?

How old are the kids OP? A divorce isnt the worst thing, especially in this day n age. Throwing presents in bin and saykng things like that to the kids isnt on.

But, has he always been like this? If not, then theres something going on which you both need to work through together. Leaving him, threating in divorce isnt going to helo the situation just push him over the edge more. If he has always been like thjs then maybe. Give him a good stern chat about how its effecting tje kids and say how you fsel

Do you think this is more damaging for the kids than having to go through a divorce?

I think it depends on the relationship tbh.
I know my children are better with their parents apart. But I worry about how much damage was done beforehand. Your post sound a little similar to my relationship but it ended up getting worse and it got quite nasty because I stopped threading on eggshells.
I remember an event similar to the birthday present one in your post, and I do think there are the things that children remember. I also think they remember who looked out for them.
I don’t think stress or depression are any excuse to tell your children that you wish they weren’t around. Can he imagine how hurtful that must have been. Surely that must be the trigger to get counselling?

I asked my ex to go for counselling quite a few times over the years. I even looked them up for him. I was told I was nagging. 2 years is a long time not to take action.

He put an 8 year old s presents in the bin
He wishes he is dead
He told 8 year he wished he never had dc

You need to call him out
At least let dd know his behaviour is out of order
But.
Sounds like my ex.
Long story short He needed anxiety meds and I needed to leave. Which I did with 3 dc.
It s no fun to live this way.
He is behaving dreadfully.

How is he lovely?
Was it all beautiful before?

If he was just being a bit grumpy in private, that's one thing. But telling your kids you wished you hadn't had them, that you will call the police, taking birthday presents and putting them in the bin- this is emotionally abusive stuff and they will remember it forever. Horrible, horrible behaviour. You don't do that to a little kid! I do think they would be better off not being around him, yes. Short visits (as he won't cope with 50/50 will he?) which will probably tail off as they age.

It's a shame, but honestly when you start taking your kids presents and throwing them in the bin, a line has been crossed. This must be such a miserable time for them. Living with an unpredictable angry parent is awful, I should know. I was happy when my parents split, but it would have been nicer earlier.

I think if it carries on it will. He's allowed to act like this because he knows you'll be there to pick up the pieces. If he only saw the children at weekends he'd be more likely to be civil or they'd vote with their feet.

Just because you disapprove of the way he acts towards the children doesn't mean that it's not damaging them and chipping away each time he shows them they're worthless to him.

I'm not saying he can't change but it's going to take some drastic measures before he deserves to be someone you want around you or your family.

Sorry OP just updated the thread and read properly.

2 years is a long time, not just 2 months like i originally read so i apologise! Give him a choice, counselling or he leaves for a separation to see if its bettwr without him. Has eldest DD behaviour been playing uo before that? Could his behaviour have a part in it?

As a pp said - you can't change him, you can only change yourself and your reaction to him. You will have to decide what your boundaries are, make it clear to him what they are, and make it clear what will happen if he crosses them.
For example - "I don't like it when you........ and I want you to stop. If you do..........again, this is what will happen.........."
And follow through.
It's not right that he speaks to you or the Dc this way, and you have to show the DC that it's not acceptable to you and you are doing something about it. Or they will grow up thinking this is how relationships go - Dads are miserable and shouty, and Mums put up with it.

Ask yourself has he always been like this? Have you been the one catering towards his needs.
Have you changed your behaviour to keep him happy over the years? Did you anticipate potential conflict and change what you were going to say or do to keep him happy?
Or is there something else going on for him?

I think he needs a shock to realise how bad things have got for you. If you sit him down and say you're seriously considering divorce unless he gets help, that he is emotionally harming his children. Then if he says 'I know, I know' then you get him to agree a time line for his next step. e.g. look for therapist online today, phone two or three of them tomorrow, etc.

If he doesn't make an attempt to deal with it, then you make plans to split.

Eldest has been having issues for 6 years linked to a medical issue. They both adore him. As do I.

If we can fix this that would be the best thing. But I can’t do it much longer.

Words will be had tomorrow. He’s just come up
To bed and I’ve told him I don’t wish to discuss it, I’m too sad and angry, and we will talk in the morning.

Really appreciate all the advice. Going to sign off and get my head down.

It's not divorce itself that damages children. It's how parents treat the children and how parents treat each other, whether they're together or divorced.

DH and I reached crisis point last year. I spent a few days getting my ducks in a row as they say, looked for rooms to rent nearby and then told DH he was to be the husband and father this family deserves or he had to move out. We discussed that if he was depressed he needed to see a counsellor but if he was just being an arsehole, it had to stop. It seems to have been the wake up call he needed but I was fully prepared for it to go either way.

Tell him to sort his shit out. If doesn’t take responsibility for himself and start acting like a proper parent you and the children will leave him.

Mean it.

He may be depressed, anxious or just an arsehole. It actually doesn’t matter which because the effect on your children will still be the same.

I’ve had similar conversations with my DP. He went and got counselling for anger issues which has helped. He is still an arse at times and then I remind him about what he discussed with his counsellor and why he needs to alter his behaviour. It is mostly successful. If he hadn’t done this I was leaving taking DD with me.

Do you think this is more damaging for the kids than having to go through a divorce?

Hell yes. He told your eldest he wished she (and her sibling) had never been born and he put her birthday presents in the bin. That's completely unacceptable. It's time you laid it on the line: either he gets professional help for his stress/depression and associated behaviour, or it's game over.

I had one of these. His depression was worsened by alcohol, but he would say similar to and about our kids. He once said that he thought we were bad parents because our girls dropped the occasional F-bomb (they were teens at the time). This while everyone who knew our girls sang their praises about their school work, their excellent manners, their kindness and work ethic!

Your H needs to take his Dementor glasses of permanently or he needs to go. This kind of thing is incredibly damaging.

2 YEARS?

Time to end the relationship. If separated, you can continue to encourage him to seek help for his MH.

Would you want your DC in a relationship like yours has been for 2 years?

At 8 & 6 telling the children he wished you'd never had them he would be packing a bag & locking down with his mother or whoever the fuck would let him.

What he said to your DC was emotionally abusive.

His behaviour is emotionally abusive. It may well be that it is as a result of stress/anxiety/depression but it is his responsibility to face up to that and seek help, with your support if that's what you want.

No matter what the 'justification' you and your children should not have to put up with this treatment.

I say that as someone whose XH behaved in a very similar way, and had been having doubts about my marriage for a long time. I tried so hard to be who he wanted, begged him to get anger management therapy and attend marriage counselling and he refused time and time again.

It was only when I broke down at a GP appointment after a particularly unpleasant incident involving DD, and she told me she would have to consider raising it as a child protection issue that I finally galvanised myself to leave him.

I have not walked on eggshells for nearly four years now...it's bloody marvellous.

How old is he my husband 35 I'm.30. I have a 10 year old and 5 year old and had a crap night as got given a new iphone 7 for 10 yr old and I whinge saying onit to much etc however shes been sorting it out tonight and kids cant win with my husband 2night go outside embarrassed to neighbours upstairs been lazy downstairs been lazy kids need go bed etc. Hes depressed but he annoyed 10 yr old tonight cause she shouted at him. Roll.on him bk at work tuesday. My marriage is on a thin thread but thing is with how.husband is to kids I'm.doubtful they would wanna see him.of wasnt 2gather. Thats a step over line presents in bin I wouldn't trust him with kids. How old is he

I agree that your other half is emotionally abusive. He is either so critically depressed that he doesn't see how damaging it is to wish a child was never born ( to their face) or is emotionally manipulating you by saying he wishes he was dead so you step up and do more house work. Or both. Good knows.

What I do know is that I lived with an emotionally abusive step dad as a teen and I am still in therapy for it now in my forties. The damage he done in 4 years will always be with me. That was things like wishing my dad had pulled out, mum has aborted me. And he wasn't even a biological parent.

Put your kids first and get rid of him

He really is that bad... your poor children ... no I don't think counselling will help them ....it may help him and they are likely to need it in the future as their dad told them they weren't wanted and put their birthday presents in the bin .... maybe think a what their teacher or someone would say/ think if they told them that ..,.
Maybe you are a boiled frog so can't see it ...but this is emotional abuse ..

but that he wished we’d never had the children.

I don't think I could ever forgive DH for saying something like this TO our kid/kids. What a horrible person he sounds. Eve if it has truth to it, saying it to children is just vile.

OP your H sounds exactly like my father. My dad threw away my toys, tried to cancel my 3yo sister's birthday party the morning of, and said things to us like he wished we weren't around etc.

I am 40 and I still remember this stuff. I have forgiven, moved on, but I still remember exactly what all that felt like. A few more reflections -

My dad never got better. He always said he would but never did. They divorced when my mum was 60. She has her own life now, but at a terrible cost, imo. She spent the best years of her life with him being emotionally abused and now, in her 70s, is alone.

Think about that. How old are you? How long are you willing that this should go on for?

My dad is not a bad person but he has serious issues. Without my mum to keep the peace, he has had terminal flare-ups with 1 of my sisters. She has a son he has never met - his own grandson. Probably never will.

Turns out you can say horrible stuff to an 8yo and she'll cry and want Daddy to hug her. Try it with a 35yo and she cuts you off, forever.

Even with those of us he does speak to, it's only really a Christmas card relationship. I love my dad and feel sorry for him but I would never let him spend time around my children as I won't have them treated like I was. I have 3 DC, he has met one of them a few times.

Also, right now you're the good guy for your DC. PP is right, they will remember that. But at some point they will also ask, why didn't she protect us?

I love my mum very much but honestly, if anyone ever tried to treat my children the way my dad spoke to me, they wouldn't know what had hit them. I look at my mum and think, why did you stand by? Why didn't you take action when we children were too vulnerable to help ourselves?

OP think on those things.

I’m making him sound dreadful and he’s not, he’s really not

Oh but he is hun.

Do you think this is more damaging for the kids than having to go through a divorce?

Very, very much so. My dad was a little like this (we walked on eggshells. It's left me with mental health problems of such severity that I've never really been able to work, and my sister has been badly effected too.

Imagine the impact on growing brains of not being able to relax anywhere, even in your own home. The effect is hard wired and permanent.

I begged my mum to leave my dad and she finally did when I was 18. I was able to repair my relationship with her, whereas if they'd stayed together they'd never have seen me to dust. If things carry on like this and you don't leave him, as soon as they can they may move far away.

As you've seen, the mum can't behave like herself either and has to put on a front one way or another, so until she left him she could never be as good a mum as she would've been. She never spoke up for us and was cold as she couldn't acknowledge the effect of anything we experienced on our emotions, whereas in fact she's one of the world's most caring people.

What effectively happens is the whole house revolves around one person and placating their emotions. In this sort of scenario the children are emotionally neglected (you mightn't feel you're doing that, but you could do better if he wasn't around/this wasn't happening.) Think of all the emotional energy you're spending on him. It's very draining and doesn't leave you with as much as you would otherwise have to give to the kids.