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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To tell vulnerable relative they'll just have to make do

266 replies

Shrubbish · 09/04/2020 16:00

A member of my family has learning difficulties, no formal diagnosis but struggles with basic reading/writing and social skills. They have capacity but function mentally much younger than they are. They are elderly.

They cannot and do not budget their money. This makes things difficult because they do have capacity so are expected to be responsible, but responsible they are not.

They called me this morning (2nd week in a row) and said they are running low on food and can I help. They don't bank, they use the post office so I couldn't simply transfer the money over.

Faced with the possibility of them going without until they get paid on Tuesday, I very reluctantly agreed to give them another £20.

I had to visit three different cash points as two were out of service, I then met them in a desolate car park (maintaining the 2m distance) and put the money on the floor. I was wearing gloves, not to say I think that makes things any better.

The same happened last week, they needed £10 which was supposed to be for bread, milk, cereal etc. I suspect they spent it on cigarettes.

I can't and won't do this again, but what do I say when they call me and say they're without food/electric?

I'm anxious and angry because I've put myself and others at risk, but felt obligated as they are telling me they would be without food. I have children at home and a DH who is currently taking unpaid leave, so all of our efforts to stay safe seem pointless if I continue to disregard the rules.

Feel free to give me a hard time, I encourage it. I'm furious with myself and would expect nothing less.

WIBU to say that's it, no more, either budget or go without.

OP posts:
ChocolateNoodle · 11/04/2020 09:11

Does your relative reimburse you?
Your husband is on unpaid leave so put your family first and tell the relative you have no spare cash!

ChocolateNoodle · 11/04/2020 09:17

HIDING THEIR REQUEST FOR CIGARETTES BY ASKING FOR FOOD
Well, your relative is crafty and devious!
Refer them to Age U.K.
I imagine by giving them £20.00 frequently, you are leaving your own family short as your husband is on unpaid leave.

AnnUumellemahaye · 11/04/2020 09:58

Do Age UK deal with people of 63? It's hardly elderly.

It sounds more like she needs Adult Social Services.

MiddlesexGirl · 11/04/2020 10:02

Not rtft but can you just drop some essentials on her doorstep when you do your own shop?

crankysaurus · 11/04/2020 10:08

I don't have much to add as you've got some good advice, but it might be worth contacting your other relative (her sibling?) to let her know what you're doing so she doesn't feel the need to sub her out money instead. Look after yourself, it all sounds quite stressful.

Freddie28 · 11/04/2020 13:46

Perhaps they are lonely

swelchphr · 11/04/2020 13:51

If you are offering food (by way of grocery shopping) and it’s being refused, then no more. You are not a cash machine, and if they are that desperate for food, they would take what’s offered.

Darkstarrheart · 11/04/2020 16:38

Shrubbish

Just sending you a hug sweetheart, don't be so hard on yourself- you are doing your best Flowers

MommaDuck · 12/04/2020 18:28

OP, I really feel your pain. This is very similar to my situation with my mum.
It’s been like this my whole life. Her behaviour at times is manipulative and makes me so frustrated.
Of course the worst part is the guilt I carry for feeling frustrated with her, when I know because of her learning difficulties and child like mental state, that it’s not truly her fault that she behaves the way she does.
It’s absolutely fucking exhausting having a parent with these issues and you end up being their carer your whole life! It’s killing me right now and you have every right to feel completely fucked off with it. I’m over the pity party stage of my life, but by god to I sometimes wish I could have been born into a normal family instead of being born to two parents with learning difficulties and mental health problems - as an only child with no sibling support too!
It’s fucking shit- so feel allowed to be as frustrated as you want to be, whilst also helping as much as you feel able to.

Best of luck to you!

Shrubbish · 12/04/2020 19:55

Thank you for the replies everybody. I've told her I'm no longer in a position to give cash but will help her with food when she needs that.

Then guess what happened today? She's gone out to meet my other family member because she's out of cigarettes again

The first time I gave her £10 I actually gave her a packet of tobacco with it (we are smokers ourselves, so I'm not a hypocrite, but we do smoke tobacco to keep the costs down and find it lasts us well)

She ploughed through that when It should have lasted a week, then when I gave her the £20 she undeniably spent some of that on cigarettes and didn't make them last either.

Darkstarrheart that made me smile, I truly appreciate the kindness

MommaDuck I'm so sorry you can relate on such a personal level, I've never spoken to anybody who is going through exactly the same so I appreciate you sharing that with me. It lets me know I'm not alone (and it certainly feels that way most of the time!) Can I ask if your parents have a diagnosis? I'm incredibly frustrated at the lack of diagnosis for mum, she's on long-term meds for depression but has never had any support for the learning disability/LD's.

I was an only child growing up and found it very tough as all the "responsible" stuff fell to me. I discovered my brother two years ago (who was given away for adoption at birth) and he's a wonderful person, but he certainly doesn't owe mum anything and i could never ask him to provide support now.

OP posts:
MommaDuck · 12/04/2020 21:13

Hi Shrubbish.

It’s what I call a bit of an old school diagnosis.
My mum is 63 years old now. So back in the day I think it was all a little slap dash.

She’s been admitted to psychiatric units previously and met my father there.
Clearly back in the day there was nothing to stop males and females conceiving- perhaps I was made in a broom cupboard Grin

My father was a schizophrenic- passed away in 2013. My mother is on anti-psychotics and anti-depressants. Was always told her diagnosis was simply ‘manic depressive’ now known as bipolar. Also that she has the mental age of a 12 year old (although at times I would beg to differ and say it was younger- my sons are 9 & 11 and both present with a higher IQ.

She has no boundaries with money, although funnily enough similar to your mum, lives independently somewhat, pays bills on time but can’t make her spare money last more than a day. Also went to a ‘special school’. Never been able to work.

Her memory is exceptionally good. However her thought processing is poor. Lack of attention to detail, lack of common sense.
It’s very evident when people talk to her that she’s not ‘quite right’ is the only way I can put it. Bad social anxiety, no friends, very pessimistic, glass always half empty. Hard to bring her out of depressive episodes.
But not a formal diagnosis that you’d expect nowadays.

I am her main carer. I’m alone with two children, work FT as a midwife/teacher - so stressful jobs and have to care for her on top of it. I am the only person she sees so to speak.
She goes out independently and I give her money to do so (I manage all her finances now) and give her a daily spend. She can catch a bus and go into a coffee shop etc. However she is morbidly obese and can’t control her weight. She used the money I give her to buy junk food- it’s her vice, perhaps like cigarettes are your mums vice.
Her weight creates further complications for her health.
If I stop her daily allowance, she becomes more depressed.
Adult social care not interested. And because of her own brain capacity she is also not interested in helping herself.
I grew up with my grandparent and after that in the care system.
It is a burden I have to carry and I’m no longer ashamed to admit that to the world.
People may call me cruel, but I urge them to walk in my shoes for a few months and see how it leaves them feeling.

I grew up the most part in care and then in turn cared for both parents, one terminally ill. Then care for my own children, and lastly myself.
And it’s really hard work and debilitating sometimes.

I love her. She’s my mum. I also know she is a helpless soul. I feel for her and want to care for her. But I’d be lying if I said there wasn’t some resent for carrying such a burden.

I cannot share with her when I am low or stressed, she does not have the capacity to comprehend it . And that leaves me feeling like I want a mum to turn too, instead of having an extra ‘child’.

When I separated from my husband I had to pretend to her it was my choice and I was happy alone and smiled through the devastating pain. Because I could not allow her to carry the burden.

Instead I was crushed and craved a mum to cry too. A mum to hold me and reassure me and tell me it would be ok. A mum to move back home to with my own children when I was becoming homeless and being forced out of military accommodation. A mum to take care of me. Instead she just said ok and nodded when I told her and did not understand it was an issue.

Sorry about the life story, I just ended up rambling (although somewhat therapeutic Smile )
I hope this gives you insight, that you are not alone.
And anyone that passes judgement, should not, unless they have ever had to deal with a similar situation.
I want to care for my mum because I love her and she’s my mum. But I want this to be because I want to. Not because I have to.

Butterymuffin · 12/04/2020 21:20

@MommaDuck oh my word. That really is a burden. No reasonable person would ever call you cruel, or blame you for resenting it. Flowers

ScrimpshawTheSecond · 12/04/2020 21:23

OP and Mommaduck, I'm so sorry. You come across as incredibly kind, perceptive, caring, intelligent and capable women. I wish you both all the very best. WineWine

Shrubbish · 12/04/2020 23:07

MommaDuck You sound like an incredible woman. No apologies necessary. It has helped beyond measure to hear from somebody who absolutely gets it in the way that my "real life" friends and acquaintances wouldn't. I'm in awe of your strength momma.

I absolutely get you about craving a mum to cry to. Much like your account, mine has never been able to comprehend the deep sadness I've felt at various points when I've needed her.

My start was somewhat similar to yours in the sense of grandparents stepping in. I was cared for by grandparents until the age of 8 (except mum was also living in the house - my grandparents took on the parenting role) and then mum got a house of her own and went to live independently, with me.

I've never known my father or been able to get any real information from mum. What I do know is that I was the product of a very brief "relationship" and my grandparents (both now deceased) didn't approve. I suspect this is because they were dubious about his intentions, given the way mum was.

So from the age of 8 I was thrust into "parent" mode and remember having to read all of the mail to mum, and getting worried when the demands for bills came. My grandparents remained hugely supportive but we're nearing the end of their lives by then and both sadly died when I was around 13.

Mum was a magnet for predatory individuals who clearly only got involved with bad intentions. One of these men tried to abuse me after luring me to his flat to gift me a mobile phone, after grooming me right under her nose.

She used to shout and swear in public and as a result of that we became a target for local youths, two different houses we lived in had completely boarded up windows and i remember feeling so humiliated and not wanting anybody to know where I lived.

I stopped attending school in year 6, she wasn't bothered, then tried to return to another school in year 7 but that didn't last long so I dropped out completely.

Social services were involved and I was deemed to be neglected, but they never took me into care (looking back I desperately wish they had done).

She was always bad with money so we were always skint, if I needed new clothes I had to shop lift. I remember her going into asda filling up a trolly full of stuff and walking out with it, she wasn't caught.

There were no rules and I was left to run wild and took full advantage of that, believing it was a good thing. I got in with a bad crowd at 13 and began taking drugs recreationally and she just thought it was funny, she still to this day reminds me in humour of the time I was hallucinating after taking ecstasy and thought I could see faces in the bushes, and laughs about it. I was 14. She also purchased me ecstasy on one occasion. I ended up in hospital twice after accidental overdoses and she didn't have much to say about it afterwards in terms of punishment. The first time it happened I ended up in intensive care needing emergency surgery. I'd had a tonsilectomy on my 13th birthday (great birthday that was) then less than a fortnight later was out with my "friends" taking drugs, the wounds in my mouth opened up as a result of me swallowing amphetamines as they hadn't yet healed - so I was bleeding profusely from my throat, rushed to hospital and put under for surgery.

When I came around in the ICU she was nitpicking as soon as I opened my eyes so she was asked to leave by the doctors.

Social services still did nothing, and they knew about all of this as I was under a child protection plan.

She allowed a middle aged man into the house to take harder drugs with me when I was 14/15, she just sat across the room laughing and joking.

She didn't bat an eye when men old enough to be my dad were sniffing around me and did absolutely no safeguarding. Some pretty bad stuff happened that still troubles me now but I can't quite bring myself to admit to half of it.

I "grew out of" the drug use by 16 with no encouragement from her, I was fortunate not to become addicted to anything.

We moved into a house that actually had windows and life wasn't too bad but then she developed a liking for booze and would go drinking with the neighbour across the road. I hated that and would worry alot. As soon as she stopped getting child benefit for me she made it clear I wasn't wanted in the house so I moved in with a friend a few months shy of my 17th birthday. She would cause scenes on the street near the flat, shouting up at the window after we had an argument. I still remember her screeching "nobody likes you" which she had clearly observed as being the case (I didn't have many friends, surprise surprise)

The flat where I lived was just around the corner from her house and I went to visit her one day to find both of my aunt's there, I was happy to see them (they lived in the other side of the country - where I live now) but it then became apparent that they were there to "collect" mum and move her down to where she (and i) lives now.

Nobody told me anything, the plan was to get rid of her pets and pack whatever would fit into the car and to leave without telling me "because you would have tried to stop her or would want to move with her"

It turns out she had been on the phone to them painting me as the devil saying I was the reason she drinks, which is utter lies. I hadn't done a thing wrong to her at all, apart from try to stop her drinking. She lies alot, this was when I started to realise that.

I still had half of my stuff at her house so they promised not to leave before I could arrange for it to be collected, I planned to come back in two days with my friend and transport the rest of my stuff.

I went home and was heartbroken because she was all I had in the world, as bad as she was.

Two days passed and I went to her house to collect my stuff and say goodbye as arranged and she had already gone. I called the estate agent and explained what had happened, told them I needed to get access to collect my stuff.

Met with the estate agent who let me in and there was nothing there, only my diary was there which someone had put in the storage cupboard. My computer was gone aswell as everything else I had there.

I didn't get to speak to mum for three months or so after this as she changed her number and my aunt was blocking any attempt of me getting through. When I did finally speak to her she claims she left my computer in the cupboard safe with the rest of my stuff "so somebody clearly broke in and took it"

At 18 I ended up in an abusive relationship, she didn't bother coming down to check on me, she knew everything that was happening. I had a baby at 19 who was taken away from me at birth and subsequently adopted because SS said i had no support and couldn't keep him safe from the father, despite me pressing charges and moving into a refuge and doing everything asked of me. When applying to have him adopted they heavily referenced my bad upbringing (that they failed to protect me from) as another reason I wouldn't be a good enough parent. Another blow and reminder of how much she had let me down.

She was nowhere to be seen.

The mug that I am, desperately wanting my mum, chose to move to where she lives when I turned 23 and this is where I am now.

I've gone on to become a mother again (a good one at that, if I do say so myself) and have built a good life for myself, a lovely DH, relatively well paid job despite my lack of education, and have built a good solid foundation for my DC. If you met me you would never know I came from the background that I did.

When I arrived here at 23 it became apparent she was still drinking, still screaming and shouting making a scene in public, still lying and being deceitful, still blaming everybody else for her problems in life. I received an apology from the aunt's who took her at face value when she said I was the reason she would drink.

I did everything in my power to support her, I sourced her support for the drinking and would accompany her to appointments. I handled all of her admin. I bailed her out time and time again when she claimed she was in dire straights. I took control of her finances (with her permission) and would take her shopping every week and endlessly tried to help her budget.

She has fallen over drunk countless times and ended up in the hospital, she drinks more now than she did when I lived with her. I've had to take her to hospital countless times and wasted NHS resources.

I've had to parent her whilst parenting my own DC who are far less difficult (my eldest is on the spectrum and can be hard work, but my god it's a walk in the park compared to my mother)

And here we are, many years later, and she is still doing the same things. She drinks less now, to her credit, but is still wasting all of her money and expecting others to pick up the pieces.

Despite everything, I still love her deeply and so I'm terribly conflicted when it comes to continuing to support her.

I think I always will, but I've now drawn the line with money.

Wow that was a bit of an essay of my own there, hope I haven't bored anybody! It feels cathartic to get it all out iykwim.

OP posts:
LookStupidInEverything · 13/04/2020 00:28

@Shrubbish
@MommaDuck
Heartbreaking stuff. You both sound like incredible woman
FlowersFlowers

LookStupidInEverything · 13/04/2020 00:29

*Women
I can’t imagine the stress of a situation like this. Look after yourselves
FlowersFlowers

forrestgreen · 13/04/2020 00:46

Never written this before, but I'm very proud of you.
And I think you need to try to get some help for you to unpick your relationship.

itsthefuture · 13/04/2020 00:52

This thread - this way of thinking - is exactly why I had a termination for medical reasons when I discovered my unborn baby had a severe chromosome disorder.

There is no good will or kindness left in the world.

itsthefuture · 13/04/2020 01:00

Has she been assessed for dyspraxia or similar op? It's never too late .

Gp could help if she's willing to be assessed?

itsthefuture · 13/04/2020 01:04

I hadn't read the full thread. Apologies op. I had an eerily similar childhood.
Not seen my dm for over 20 years.

Sometimes you have to walk away.

Thanks

Durgasarrow · 13/04/2020 01:19

63 isn't elderly!!

Shrubbish · 13/04/2020 01:23

Lookstupid and Forrestgreen, thank you so much. I did regret posting that after I read it back, it's all a bit mopey isn't it. I'm feeling a bit embarrassed and raw now, I tend not to go down that rabbit hole as alot of it is unprocessed.

Itsthefuture, you needn't apologise. I can understand people thinking my OP sounded harsh and uncaring. I'm sorry you too can relate to some of it.

OP posts:
Shrubbish · 13/04/2020 01:26

Durga you are right, it isn't elderly.

For those who haven't RTFT (and I don't blame you) I did say I wrote that to be vague.

I'm aware there are some highly intelligent, hard working women on here in their 60's who would take offence to being called elderly - so I do apologise.

OP posts:
FruitShrewsbury · 13/04/2020 01:37

Flowers You sound a very decent person OP

Gingerkittykat · 13/04/2020 02:26

@Shrubbish

I've got a lot of respect for you and the way you have built a good life for you and your family. I hope you can get some support for yourself. Flowers