To think CV19 pandemic will highlight just how shit so many men are?

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

We are obviously in very weird times where there's a general understating that everyone has to step out their comfort zone, adjust things etc be it working from home whilst looking after kids, doing a supermarket shop alone and once in a blue moon and staying indoors all day. However reading, here and on social media in the last few weeks (and RL accounts from friends) that men are unwilling to change the smallest things, including

• Women having to bend over backwards to sort getting to the supermarket because her DH won't do it
• no matter who is the higher earner, women doing both WFH and childcare duties while men get their full working days to themselves
• women being the ones sorting crafts, books, writing etc for home schooling whilst men barely know what school year their child is in.

It does seem that a lot of blokes were happy to have kids and have the fun moments - playing on an evening, holidays etc - but now have the daunting task of doing the hard stuff and can't cope for the life of them.

I suspect that a lot of women put up with this pre-pandemic because it's how they'd always been and she tolerated it because that's what women have been socialises to do. But this uselessness will be a nail in the coffin for many couples. Men have probably got away with a lot because they're Very Busy with work so women got on with things, but working from home probably exposes how Busy men actually are.

AIBU to think that many women will be exposed to just how utterly shit their OHs are?

Disclaimer: sorry not sorry on pointing out it's only men. Never once seen a post about a woman not stepping up to be a mother. Yes NAMALT and I'm sure your Nigel is lovely, but the point is I think a lot of other 'Nigels' will be shown to be nothing of the sort.

I think picsinred states it very well, I think men like ‘the idea’ of kids and families but a great many aren’t so Keen on the actual day to day grind and hassle of it, particularly with young kids or teens. I think a lot of men much prefer the ‘all attention on them’ pre kids dating scenario and hence that's why affairs are so common , they like being the centre of attention. There are women like this too but I think it’s more dominant in men

LOL. Yep the MRA klaxon has clearly sounded and Greyt and Dido have heroically stepped up. Good job, very subtle

These threads are utterly pathetic. At the very least, why don't they stay in FWR?

Yanbu

FortunesFavour

LOL. Yep the MRA klaxon has clearly sounded and Greyt and Dido have heroically stepped up. Good job, very subtle

I always ask this but "lol" ? Are you 13? Isn't there some homework you could be doing?

On a more serious note- do you and posters like you have any idea just how silly and feeble throwing out "ooh here are the MRAs" sounds? It really isn't the killer trump card you think it is.

At best it just shows an inability to construct a counter-argument; at worst it's intended to shut up women with whom you disagree.

These threads are utterly pathetic. At the very least, why don't they stay in FWR?

When I find threads that I find “ utterly pathetic”, I click off them. There a bar at the top of the page where you can do this. There’s also a box with “ topics “ on the right . Here you will be able to find lots of other threads you might prefer.

There’s also an option to “ hide this thread “ - right at the top below the blue bar.

You’re welcome .

I0NA

Just as there is on fwr. Doesn't stop posters complaining "this isn't AIBU , why don't posters who don't like feminist chat stay there"

Why anyone goes on and on complaining on threads they find “ utterly pathetic “ beats me.

Because people being encouraged to bend and break rules puts people's lives at risk. Why shouldn't that be called out?

To make entire sweeping statements about one sex is wrong however you are not that far from the truth. There are a lot of men out there like this and a lot of women who enable it. Lots of mothers and wives who think nothing of washing, cooking , cleaning, taking care of the kids, giving up work, shopping, ferrying kids to appointments, play dates, clubs, school and carrying the mental load without even thinking.

My dh is a wonderful man and dad. When we met I out earned him by a long stretch and worked full time. We got married had two kids and I decided part time hours worked better for me and our family. He still works full time and has had two promotions at work. I have facilitated his achievements by taking a step back in my career by going part time. He recognises this thankfully but some men do not! This is so common amongst friends of mine.

I do the majority of the cooking and cleaning but he does cook at the weekends, washes dishes and anything else that is needed. He is a very hands on dad, takes them to groups on the weekend usually and feeds them dinner, does bath and bed time most days. He changes nappies too. We do not do the same chores but are equal in the amount we do for our family and we are both happy. He is not the type that would watch telly if I was doing dishes, he will either dry up for me or sort the kids out. I do carry most of the mental load but I have started to reduce this eg. It is mil's birthday in a fortnight. Dh will be sorting this out or not, previously I would have done so.

I think people need to be clear in their expectations of each other. If ever I feel dh is not doing his fair share i raise it straight away. I do not see why I should be a martyr and am no more responsible for our family than he is.

IONA- got any comments on this utterly irresponsible and entitled behaviour?

You were all over the similar thread on FWR

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/apr/05/scotland-chief-medical-officer-seen-flouting-lockdown-advice-catherine-calderwood

Or it could be highlighting that a lot of women chose to be martyrs?

I often read threads on here where women tolerate horrendous behaviour from a so called partner who doesn't actually give anything in return.

DH thought our marriage meant that he got to be looked after while I ran myself ragged looking after 3 kids and him. The end result was me throwing him out for 12 months - and the condition of his return was that things never went back to how they were. He still needs the odd reminder, as do I.

A partnership means two people giving and taking, and finding that constant compromise. It will never work unless the scales balance. Anything else is a dictatorship.

Straight out of the MRA playbook Dido, good to see you’re sticking to the script.

No, not 13, and far better and constructing arguments than your good self, but don’t let that stop the insults. I see through you so can’t be bothered to engage.

I'm not seeing anything remotely resembling a well constructed argument coming from you. FortunesFavour As for insults? Well you're pretty good at handing them out.

Repeating MRA over and over isn't btw a well constructed argument- more like a stuck record.

It's peculiar really that you are accusing me of being an MRA yet you are intent on trying to shut up women who don't agree with you.

Now I wonder who might have an interest in doing that? Let's think MRA possibly?

Yanbu OP

What is MRA?

Pickupapenguinnnn

Its Men's Rights Activist.

Also anyone that dares disagree with a MN feminist.

Men abusing women has gone up, men murdering us has gone up.... so yes, absolutely

I cant believe so many women on yhis thread are using their own good relationship as some type of proof that this isn't a real issue and many, many women are not currently suffering more than before the lockdown at the hands of their partners... It's literally a fact. AIBU is currently full of women struggling to deal with their partners during this time plus rates of male violence against their partners has gone up significantly...and so has rates of them murdering their partners.

I think it actually highlights how much crap women have accepted in the past. Many have operated under the false impression that their partner would pick the slack where necessary and surprise surprise, many won’t.

I think part of the problem stems from how women behave at the beginning of a relationship.

Often they are desperate for it to work and bend over backwards to make it work.

Then they move in with these men and again are bending over backwards to make it work, via doing absolutely everything to make the mens life supremely comfortable and allowing them to be the laziest possible version of themselves.

The shit can hit the fan when they become pregnant.....again mostly wanted by the woman .......and suddenly realise he doesn't do a solitary thing in the home. Perhaps they have become unwell and again realise he really doesn't do a thing for them or their home.

Baby arrives and lo and behold again shock that the penny really drops that they have the most selfish, lazy twat on their hands.....and so it continues on...baby, toddler and through rearing the children.

The thing is that we show men how to treat us and how we expected to be treated.

You get a whiff of a guy being a selfish disrespectful twat while dating him....you dump his ass.

You move in with him and find him being a lazy twat, not pulling his weight.... you dump his ass.

Same with him being mean, tight, slow to pay his way, never treats you....again..YOU DUMB HIS ASS..

What you DONT bloody do is put up with it, get pregnant, tie yourself to him....

There are loads of men who don't behave like this, but by gum there are a huge amount who treat women very poorly.

The police are very, very aware this is going to be a ver difficult time for victims of DV.

Wow yep, it's all because women 'let it happen', men never manipulate the woman or act like a different person, women don't have issues which keep them with these men including trauma, coercive control doesn't exist, all women are educated on red flags, it's just because 'we show them how to treat us'..... What a shitty, harmful victim blaming attitude.

"again mostly wanted by the woman" proof of this? It's EXTREMELY common for men to want to get women pregnant, especially if he wants control/to lock her down etc

Going out on a limb here, but suspect OP is telling about an escalated version of this due to pandemic:

www.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/26/gender-wars-household-chores-comic

and frankly, unless you live in some rose hued Scandi equality paradise, I'm sure every single woman can relate to this in some way, even if not married or partnered or have kids, i.e. the disproportionate mental load heaped on us of being caretakers for other people.

Anyway, when's the next Dworkin book night? :)

My.husband has been great , has been and is generally more shouty than me with the kids and I do have to tell him to chill more but we've been in shielding for 3 weeks now with 3 kids , he's self employed and I'm a SAHM but have a childcare background so I've taken on most of the home schooling , he's been doing gardening , di y and sharing general house work, I've been painting all my daughters furniture this weekend so he's been bearing the brunt of the child care while building a new raised bed , I won't tolerate the "wife work" labels though I enjoying cooking so he cleans up after dinner , we share house work pretty equalIy in general though , I think if someone's go a slacking partner they need to kick them up the arse!