To ask for help from fellow procastinating under achievers?

[Hingeandbracket]

It started when I failed to do any work at University because there was no-one there to make me.

I have lurched through various jobs with varying degrees of success and or failure.

I berate myself for being lazy and disorganised - but surely it's not as simple as that.

Has anyone climbed out of the pit of their own despair in such circumstances and gone on to become Sir Richard Branson?

My 2 children ( early 20s) have both been diagnosed with ADHD in the last year. I'd be amazed if DH hasn't got it but at the moment he doesn't feel that having a diagnosis would help him as he has a job that suits his strengths.
Medication has helped both my DC enormously. DS recently had his first grade for a project done whilst taking meds, he's repeating 2nd year as he struggled with self directed study. For the first time ever he got a grade that reflected his ability and it has given him so much confidence. I can't tell you what a relief it is for him (and me) that he can focus in the way he needs to in order to do the amount of depth of work that his uni course demands. He's always underachieved and without meds I think that would always be the case. The meds don't have any effect on his sense of who he is/feels, they just allow him to get on with his life. There shouldn't be this stigma/reluctance around medication, it's not a case of 'overcoming' ADHD through will or effort. Management strategies can help but to all of you who are struggling, please seek help because it can be transformative.
If you can try and find a psychiatrist who specialises in adult ADHD rather than a generalist.

My problem definitely stems from being ‘naturally bright’ as a kid, sailed through school with encouragement from teachers and families. And then once I hit GCSE age it all went a bit downhill as I wasn’t very good at self-motivating. I managed to get through GCSE and A Level with good grades due to being naturally quite clever, but I’d love to know where I would have ended up if I had the self motivation on top of that. I’ve somehow got a decent job, but I have no motivation to push myself any harder for a promotion, even though I know I could do it. I think it’s due to being naturally a lazy person, doing the bare minimum is all I can be bothered to do, and procrastination is a very good skill of mine

procrastination is a very good skill of mine

Funnily enough that's what I say about myself all too often- I'm an expert in the art of time wasting 😶😬

(But is it really time wasting though...? I'm finding this particular use of my time very enlightening and possibly life changing...!)

Apologies in advance but I'm compiling a tedious list of all my 'ways', which, since finding this thread, I'm convinced could be down to ADHD. Interested to know if people can relate (I know you can because I've read all the post on here, but feel compelled to list all my infuriating 'quirks'!)

@vanillacaramelalmond your suggestion of getting assessed for adult ADHD has struck a chord- I've searched local psychiatrists and have done an online test via one of them- scored very high. If medication can help the brain fog/shambolic lack of focus, this could be what I've always been searching for (without realising it!)

I scored 54 out of 60 on the online questionnaire

But my GP would laugh herself silly if I asked for a referral. Last time I went to ask about feeling unwell and thought it might be hypothyroidism (mum had it) or possibly menopause. She told me that she could tell I have anxiety just by looking at my face. She also rattled off the number for a counsellor but I didn't catch it - like I'm going to see a complete stranger and waffle on about my self-made misery anyway.

I’ve done the ADHD quiz and got 49

The “comments entered” bit is blank?

I don’t want to pathologise something that’s not in need of it....I still feel it’s more a case of being lazy and undisciplined and needing to change habits. Looking at the list of how to help yourself if you have it, it’s the same old stuff they always say.

Medication, now that I’m happy to try. I wouldn’t be holding down a job without fluoxetine, in fact I don’t think I’d be alive without it.

The psychiatrist my DC saw generally needs a GP referral but in the pre appointment info it does say that she recognised that this might not always be possible as some hcps can be unsympathetic, and in that case there may be a way around the referral route. My DD was diagnosed first in the city where's she's at uni but didn't find that psychiatrist very supportive so I did some research and found another for DS who DD has seen subsequently for meds advice. They had to travel some way to see her for their first appointment but follow up appointments have all been by phone/Skype. She's good, very supportive but it can be a bit of a minefield finding the right person especially given the difficulties people with ADHD have. I'm not sure how easy my DC would have found it to organise without my help, so having a friend/family member who can help is useful (although the 'who do I tell' dilemma is a whole other topic).
I rarely post on MN but feel so strongly about the benefits of diagnosis having seen the difference it's made to my DC that I really want to spread the word!

vanilla please could you say what the benefits were?

The main benefit has been having the medication which has allowed both DC to achieve what they're capable of and has given them both so much more confidence. They're affected in different ways -
DD could cope with schoolwork and got really good results but is now doing a very academic uni course which she feels she wouldn't cope with without meds because of the very high workload. On a personal level she was always quite hard work because her brain's going a million miles an hour and so she's always been very restless which has sometimes made her quite impatient. On meds she's much calmer but still absolutely 'herself'.
DS really struggled at school, he's much more physically as well as mentally restless and he was assessed as having Sen but despite seeing 2 Ed psychs was diagnosed with dyslexia and not ADHD. A recent uni assessment showed the opposite which would be funny if it wasn't so depressing given the effect it's had on his life. So he underachieved right through to A level and really felt that he didn't have the ability that we always told him was there. He's doing an art based uni course but still found it a real struggle before meds to do the amount of work that is needed to get the higher grades. I mentioned in my first post how this changed once he started taking the meds, he can sit and concentrate for as long as he needs and recently got a 1st for a project having previously got no higher than a 2.2. That has given him so much confidence.
Both DC also find they are coping much better with chores, organising stuff etc.
And I think having the diagnosis does give them an explanation for how they are and has improved their self esteem.

Thanks vanilla
I thought it would be meds

I Have terrible issues with insomnia so actually, not sure if meds would be right for me anyway.

Oh yes! I'm a chronic procrastinator. Totally relate op.

Anyone ever feel this quite so much before the internet/ Iphones/ emails were invented though?

Looking at the list of how to help yourself if you have it, it’s the same old stuff they always say.

Where is this? I can tell you in a second if the advice is actually useful for ADHD brains or not - 90% of advice given "for" ADHD is useless because it doesn't really understand the disorder.

I take low dose Nortriptyline which is a non standard treatment but I didn't get any response on Ritalin and there isn't anything else approved for adults in Germany. Apparently Elvanse is now allowed, but that's very recent. I believe the Nortryptiline treatment is based on a similar premise to Strattera - increasing levels of noradrenaline, which is thought to be low in particularly the inattentive side of ADHD. I'm not very high scoring for hyperactivity/impulsive behaviour, mostly inattentive.

There are non stimulant medications if you are concerned about insomnia.

Bertie, it comes up after you do the quiz.

I can’t access MN till tomorrow now but will check back for replies.

Autumn the effect of meds will have worn off by the time you go to bed - in fact, I'm not sure of the reason, but some people find their insomnia (which can be a symptom of ADHD) improves

Which quiz? I couldn't see a link to the quiz :)

In the same boat here, OP

I understand the worry about self diagnosis etc but it's interesting that you use the words "lazy" and "undisciplined" AutumnRose. Have you ever thought why you, or anyone is lazy or undisciplined? There words teachers/parents often use about children, then you use them further to "beat ourselves up" but if people just bandy those about without looking into it further, it's a pretty pointless and unhelpful assessment.

@Sarahlou63

I wonder why so many people are eager to self diagnose ADHD? Is it a 'get out' clause

Perhaps we are eager because it seems to a)correspond to our experiences and b) offer some hope? You link to an article about self limiting beliefs, but IMO telling oneself "it's just laziness/I'm looking for a get out clause" is a hell of a lot more limiting than thinking "perhaps I should get tested and see if medication or other ADHD coping strategies might help me".

Exactly @toomuchtooold.

Posted too soon..

Spent a lifetime with other people and me myself blaming me for my shortcomings, where I felt like the tools to change weren't available to me.

There are a few people commenting here about jobs that are suitable for people like us - emergency services etc. What if you have a career that you are inexplicably (given limitations of being totally hopeless as described on this thread!) doing quite well at, which is desk based, quite self directed, basically all the worst possible features of an environment for avoiding procrastination, etc. Has anyone employed any helpful strategies which have assisted them to overcome their worst self. I am shortly being promoted and will be managing a new joiner after a period of working mostly by myself, and sort of doing what I feel like, or more often not doing what I don't feel like :-/ I'm petrified that I am going to finally be found out and really want to try and use it as an impetus to do better!

College Info Geek on youtube has some brilliant organisational and motivational tips, and I find a lot of them work fantastically around the limitations of ADHD. I don't think the guy who presents it has ADHD but he's quite honest about having totally human failings like laziness, choosing the easier route if he sees it, etc, and I find that really relateable and helpful as he explains how to get around those mental blocks, rather than just suggesting you should be more disciplined/productive/motivated magically or because of willpower or because you have decided it's moral or whatever. There seems to be a lot moving in that direction nowadays, and I think that's great.

If you have found something you enjoy and are good at, then don't worry about things people say about ideal jobs! I've just applied for a desk job and if I get it I am hoping I'll enjoy/be quite good at it, but I know well the hopeless feeling of "Nobody could possibly want to hire me" and having a patchwork CV - that's more what I was hoping to inspire in people with those job ideas.

Generally I never expect anybody else to know anything about ADHD so I would never say to anyone "I have ADHD - please make allowances for me". Instead I am specific about what I'm having difficulty with and what I need. So if somebody asks me to do something verbally or on the phone, I say "Yes/No/I'll get back to you, but could you just send me a quick email with that info in please? My memory is terrible ." Or I excuse the fact I'm looking through my phone by explaining I need to put that appointment into my calendar right now.

I am going to look up the alternative drugs suggested, thank you.

Someone said that the label of lazy might be unhelpful. I suppose it’s helpful because it’s fixable.

I think lazy is unhelpful, I find it more useful to think about what's really stopping me from doing certain things, or picking the harder option. Lazy being fixable just ends up being a stick to beat yourself with.

I struggle with transitions = build in more time for them. Prepare for them. Have routines (hahaha! I used to hate the very idea of routine), "hang" tasks onto external events I have no control over. Make the next task more appealing or easy.

I find ordinary things more exhausting than most people because they're using more of my brain power. = Don't have such high expectations of self! It's totally ok to get less done than other people. I am still achieving more than my old self. It's an improvement. Being honest about my capability helps me to work with it. It's ok for one task to take up the whole of an afternoon or morning and by extension the whole day.

I have difficulty with motivators that are too far removed, it's like my perspective is wrong. = use bigger motivators, or move my motivators closer or make them more visible. Don't expect self to work like everyone else. Learn what actually motivates me (rather than what I think ought to motivate me) and work with that.

Russell barkley is excellent at setting these things out. I have learned a lot from him.