To think that this country is utterly corrupt?

[bingbangbing]

After the Sabinsky scandal, I can't help but think this.

This government was elected on a pack of lies, I think we all know that there will not be 40 new hospitals etc

Even before Boris took over, we had Hancock giving speeches from the HQ of Babylon.

The attacks on the media are nothing short of dictatorial- the gov is going after the BBC and has made threatening noises towards C4.

We were one of the most respected governments- the mother of all parliaments, an old and stable country. Famous for reason and restraint.

What the fuck happened?

The vast majority of governments are corrupt. Money talks. I also don't think we've ever been particularly internationally respected- too much hatred towards us for that. There's only so much of the world you can invade before people stop liking you.

I don't think i've experienced so much guff* from one government/election in my life. On the other hand WTF is wrong with opposition parties these days? they're too busy infighting to … oppose. Bastards.

*where guff = outright lies that everyone knows are lies

Having lived in an utterly corrupt country, I can safely say whilst all governments are corrupt to a point the UK has a way to go before branding it utterly corrupt.

Having lived in an utterly corrupt country, I can safely say whilst all governments are corrupt to a point the UK has a way to go before branding it utterly corrupt.

Fair point.

Yup - agree. And the media have descended to the absolute gutter. There is no accountability, no scrutiny, opposition is in complete disarray and government can do exactly whatever the hell it wants.

Lol, you don’t around much do you?

It pains me to say it but Labour are now just as bad. The police are being directed by small charities. Housing policy will never be addressed because so many decision makers hold BTL portfolios. Tendering processes are as dodgy as they ever were (hence the smart motorways we were promised ate not as smart as they were supposed to be and people are dying in significant numbers). And so on.

Plus ca change.

I agree OP. People just don't care anymore. They know about the lies the racism, the incompetence...but it doesn't matter.

I know there are countries that have it worse, however that is no reason to accept the decline of my own.

We are in decline. I was thinking the other day, how I had a local library and swimming pool. My son has neither unless we drive a significant distance. That's the small scale stuff.

Perhaps. But it’s a hierarchy, which most of its people have decreasing access to. While being continually vilified for not being able to.

You’d have to look at the deregulation and international competition that opened up in the 90s. The decreasing power of local government and distributed economic systems. The emphasis, enabling and worship of private capital, glorifying the ability of rich people to exploit anyone poorer and more disadvantaged.

It is not sudden as some people seem to think. It hasn’t happened overnight. It’s been a long slow weakening of all checks and safeguards.

There's been suggestions of corruption for every government and shadow government for years and years. Why has just this government caused your wrath this morning? Quick look at Wikipedia shows an entertaining list of political scandals for all parties since 1890.

That isn't to say you shouldn't be cross, it's just that this has been going on for a very long time.

It's definitely got worse.

I'm know spring chicken and I can definitely feel a decline.

Maybe in the future, history students will be writing essays about the high point of post-war Britain being some time around 2000. All downhill from there.

“This has been going on for a very long time”. Agreed, in that nothing is ever perfect: but it hasn’t had such an impact before. Op is right. We are in decline. The refusal of the rich to return some of their wealth gained by exploiting the poor has been a feature of the decline of other civilisations in the past.

In your day people probably used libraries and swimming pools more. These days kids either play more online stuff or do a whole host of new activities that we didn’t have. We never had trampoline parks or soft play in our day.

Accountability

Someone mentioned it previously but I really believe there just simply isn’t any real accountability in anything and that leads to people being able to constantly pass the buck. The ‘it’s not my fault/responsibility’ attitude is responsible for a lot.

Did anyone actually believe the 40 hospitals crap?

Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Johnson and his cronies have been all about the power from the word go. Why anyone would believe anything that comes out of his mouth is beyond me.

I think most countries have some corruption, those in power will stop at nowt to keep them and their cronies there.

In the UK this still means the ruling classes and for a long long time, even after we gained "democracy", this was done by denying ordinary people and women the vote.

To being with, after full democracy, people were determined to make it count and to hold government to account but ordinary people have become lazy about it.

In the relatively short time since full democracy was achieved, having a strong opposition and a free press meant that government (mostly) had to behave. Unfortunately now, the ruling classes have learned to play the new system and we have a situation where working class people are voting for policies that will only help the rich, where ordinary people believe everything they're told by those in authority (the bus, why do so many people still believe that?!) and where the press have become the bad guys, creating a situation were controls over what they can print/say are welcomed.

Plus shockingly poor opposition, I'm actually furious with the Labour party ATM.

I don't think there's corruption in every day life though, the way there is in some countries. I'm not going to say no police office has ever accepted a bribe but I highly doubt it's an everyday occurrence for officers to be offered bribes.

I agree OP and it’s frightening. Currently most frightened by the changes they are planning to make to the judiciary and the very fabric of our democracy.

But it’s okay for huge swathes of people because they will “get Brexit done”.

I was in the supermarket yesterday and a woman was extolling Boris Johnson’s “virtues” to a shop assistant. Things like that make me feel like darkness is closing in.

Having lived in an utterly corrupt country, I can safely say whilst all governments are corrupt to a point the UK has a way to go before branding it utterly corrupt.

Very well said. I get fed up with people using idiot phrases like Broken Britain, RIp-off-Britain and so on, they really need to get out more and I don't mean a couple of weeks on a beach or by a pool. They really have no idea.

Or perhaps you have no idea of what things look like at the bottom of the pile, mrsB. Living costs are outstripping wages, which means the whole basis of working for a living is under threat. What’s replacing it is not a system at all. We despise system and organisation now.

Depends on context. Day to day I see much less corruption than many countries for example bribes to get train tickets or police, planning permission etc.

Money will get influence in UK and pretty much everywhere in the world.

It hasn't got worse. Google on the Blair government or the Hamiltons.

Or Lloyd George and the honours system.

Politics and lies have always gone hand in hand read up on some history todays lies are in comparison tame

And if you had lived in a country where corruption is part of your every day living you certainly would appreciate living in the UK where it is not.

It’s far from perfect and certainly things can be improved but it’s a far better place to live than the majority of countries in this world and that includes some in Europe

We are in decline. I was thinking the other day, how I had a local library and swimming pool. My son has neither unless we drive a significant distance. That's the small scale stuff.

I moved away 15 years ago. The last time I was back, about 4 years ago, I was really shocked at the decline. Everywhere just looked run down and unloved. Apart from the City which my satnav decided to lead us through. That was shocking in how bright and shiney it was, like being on another planet.