To think that this country is utterly corrupt?

[bingbangbing]

After the Sabinsky scandal, I can't help but think this.

This government was elected on a pack of lies, I think we all know that there will not be 40 new hospitals etc

Even before Boris took over, we had Hancock giving speeches from the HQ of Babylon.

The attacks on the media are nothing short of dictatorial- the gov is going after the BBC and has made threatening noises towards C4.

We were one of the most respected governments- the mother of all parliaments, an old and stable country. Famous for reason and restraint.

What the fuck happened?

Tories were voted in.

Utterly corrupt? You haven’t the faintest idea what an utterly corrupt government is. If you did, this thread won’t even be here. By all means complain about government wrong doings.

^
This.... YABU. In fact, you are being ridiculous. Anyone who thinks this country is “utterly corrupt” is naive and has had a very sheltered life.

Having worked in the public sector at a senior level for many years - including being lead officer for procurement in my organisation - I have never once been offered, or been aware of anyone offering, bribes.

Things may not be good for many people in this country, and I understand the anger over austerity... It doesn’t follow that we are corrupt.

The world corruption index shows us as 12th out of 180 countries.... If that makes us “utterly” corrupt, what adjectives do you have left for the likes of Somalia (at the bottom).

We have housing benefit that pays for housing itself for those that cannot afford it.

Yes this is true. But this system wasn't originally created for a society whose majority can never get on the property ladder and whose wages can't even cover their rent. Housing benefit/Housing itself wasn't intended to become the abused behemoth it's become. It was meant to support people in need, not be the default solution to an eternal housing crisis.

But policies that you and others may disagree with is not the same thing as corruption. To conflate the two hurts your argument. Like I said, corruption is 'dishonest or fraudulent conduct by those in power, typically involving bribery.’

Agree completely.

Do you really think a comparison with Victorians is the most appropriate comparison to make?

The Victorians has just experienced first enclosure (one of the lowest points of the rich using their powers legally against the poor in English history). Then they had the Industrial Revolution, a profound economic shift. The changes were indescribably vast, and they did not respond to the inequality straight away. But the history of the Victorian period is a very slow, piecemeal, but by bit clawing back, against the new economic reality, of some kind of social contract with the less advantaged groups. That trend continued - slowly, bit by bit, piecemeal, with setbacks, and a Great Leap Forward just after the WWI, until the 60s. The story ever since has been a slow piecemeal dismantling of those rights, and of all the systems put in place to enable the lower classes to better themselves by their own efforts. That capability is now almost gone.

Lots of folk didn’t realise the country was corrupt as the most corrupt people are well spoken and wearing suits and their media friends cover a lot of shit up. However, the mask is slipping.

Unfortunately though, people are so worn down trying to survive, they don’t have the energy to fight our hastening decline.

The British aren’t super human and Britain is as at risk of descent into chaos and corruption as any other country.

Oh no please do inform us common folk is it true the establishment are really lizards

Oh please no one is saying there isn’t any form of corruption in this country

I’m with you all the way. This is my 67th year on this planet and I can never remember being shocked and frightened before. Comparisons with other regimes are completely irrelevant, that’s like saying an emotional or financial abuser’s OK because he doesn’t hit his partner. Not only is our society corrupt but there are no responsible and mature politicians or, if there are, they’re maintaining a very low profile.

YANBU. I'm so disgusted by the recent racism and that fact that Sabisky wasn't actually sacked.

I can never remember being shocked and frightened before
Same. Actually to the point of thinking at what stage do I just take the family and leave the country.

I don’t think the OP is using the word corruption in the usual sense, either. Can you define your use, OP?

Bribery is not necessary for corruption.

What is happening, is that transparency and procedure is going out the window.

The standard precedents if not the laws by which this country is run are being ignored if not attacked.

@willowashen

Maybe you're not high enough up to warrant a bribe?

I've seen some stuff. Not naming it. Not actual bribery but some serious jobs for the boys, chronic failure being covered up etc

Well Im no fan of this current government ,but can think of many much worse! Often its tempting to look back at a "golden age" and feel things then were so much better.The 60s gave way to great social change, and a better way of life for many people under a Labour govt .However the 70s we were in decline! Looking across the pond ,how many of us would wish to live in the US? Even apart from DT there has always been a huge gap between rich /poor there .Very little health provision that is free and much shorter holidays as well . Europe has its own problems as well and Macron has made sweeping changes to the pension system! Lets not even start in China/India and so on!

Looking across the pond ,how many of us would wish to live in the US?

well I definitely would

I can't remember being lied to with such utter cynicism

The 'suicide' of Dr David Kelly. Weapons of mass destruction.

I've seen some stuff. Not naming it. Not actual bribery but some serious jobs for the boys, chronic failure being covered up etc

E.G. Rotherham

This is a Tory bashing thread, isn't it OP?

No, not Rotherham

Not my sector.

Fear of being accused of racism and classism- the victims were seen as chavs or not credible witnesses

This is a Tory bashing thread, isn't it OP?

Is it Tory bashing though, to be worried about what's happening to our country and about recent developments? I for one didn't feel this way when Theresa May was in charge or when David Cameron was in charge. I really don't think any of the stuff happening now is Tory in the broad sense of what I had previously understood that to mean.

The Tories are in power. The Tories gave us Brexit which I do think unleashed this demon.

It's an anything goes atmosphere. Doesn't matter if it's right, just come out of it looking good.

It's straight out of Machiavelli or the Ceasers when you think about it.

As much as I wasn’t a fan of Cameron, I still feel that he and Osbourne were still doing what they felt was right for the country. With this current lot, it feels as though they are working for forces outside of this country which are not in our interests.

I also feel May was trying (to the point she began to look very unwell) to hold back those forces.

Did anyone actually believe the 40 hospitals crap?

I think some people must have, as well as the NHS bus bollocks during the referendum.

That isn't exactly the problem though, as i see it. The problem lies with a media that doesn't hold anyone to account - why the bloody hell Laura K and her colleagues didn't push and push and push those points in the run up to the election escapes me. And the ridiculousness of the current government saying they want to scrap the BBC licence because they were biased against them? Well, apparently everyone with X position thinks that the BBC News was only supporting Y position. So with hindsight maybe the BBC is ok? (probably not though)

Saw PP referring to people not banging on about Germany and WW2. Bloody hell, where have you been? Go on Twitter, go on pretty much any comment site, there's tons of it. I live in Germany and a regular question to me when British people find out is "how can you live with those murdering bastards". From apparently normal educated people.

It's also not really beyond expectations for a country that is now (I think) the 5th most wealthy in the world, to consider how it built up that position and pay something back to the places it exploited to get there.

So yes, OP probably IBU to think the country is completely corrupt - but the government can apparently do what it likes because nobody holds it to proper account.

I also feel May was trying (to the point she began to look very unwell) to hold back those forces.

I agree tellmetruth4 I imagine that she and a few others are looking on at what's currently happening with some degree of horror. I don't think DC/Osborne would have tolerated somebody with abhorrent racist eugenicist views in number 10, for example. Nor did I feel like they'd try to undermine the law courts. What's happening now is way beyond mainstream Tory imo.

I think quite a lot of people believed the election promises.

Another way to look at it, is the last chapter in the fall of the British Empire.

When Northern Ireland and Scotland go, it'll be complete.

They will go.