Do all dad's not cope with their children?

[Dizzynic101]

I have 2 year and 4 month old girls, I went out Saturday night, leaving my partner, my kids dad, with the kids for 3 hours. I went out for dinner and a few drinks, he text me most of the night saying I needed to go home because the kids wouldn't settle, were being naughty, wouldn't stop crying. It made me feel so guilty for leaving them, but I just needed a little bit of a break. He tells me he can't cope looking after the kids on his own. We had a huge argument yesterday because I've told him he being extremely unreasonable, I never go out and leave him with the kids. I've told him he needs to get over himself and deal with it, they are his kids too, somehow he turns it around on me and I end up feeling sorry for him! I've tried explaining to him how it makes me feel. He just doesn't listen.
I don't think going out for a few hours and leaving the children with their dad is a bad thing. He is also upset because he read my text message to my friend calling him a shithead for his behaviour on Saturday night. Now he's upset with me. I feel guilty for that too.

@Tsubasa1

I feel sorry for you that your DH is so spectacularly incompetent.

I'm sorry op but his been a bit selfless I rarely go out maybe four times a year but when I do my DP understands that it's my me time and my break just to relax and not have to worry he never text or asks me to come home and and we have three under three he needs to step up and realise that their his children and responsibility too not just yours

GEEpEe, whose role in life seems to be being the tiresome reactionary du jour on several threads.
^ This. So much this.

Most posters on here think if their DH can do it why can't yours. It's not like that in RL, and yes a babysitter is somewhat better equiped because of the experience of being with kids ALONE which your DP clearly doesn't have. @Skysblue had some good points

@Oakenbeach You don't need to feel sorry for me, that comment is unecessary.

I wouldn’t leave my 4 month olds with anyone as they were ebf and didn’t take bottles.

From a year they were fine to leave with dad.

I know that you might be used to getting your own way but this is a public forum. While in life you might drive down the dissenting voices, this isn't your show.

If you don't encourage your partner to take an active role from day 1, your toddler children will not be securely attached to them. It is simple. Anyone who would simply leave a child with someone who cannot meet their needs as some sort of learning experiment should be neutered.

The adult and responsible thing to do is to ensure you have a partner who shares your values before you conceive and discuss how you will parent and meet your individual goals. That's why I knew what my wife would accept and she knew that I was mostly on the same page anyway.

He is a shithead

No. Your partner just sounds pathetic. He is less equipped than most men

@GEEpEe stop blaming women! Why should father's have to be encouraged? And if they aren't it's our fault?

The kids are as much that grown ass man’s as they are yours. When he’s not at work he should be doing 50% of the childcare anyway. The fact that he can’t manage his own 3 kids for 3 hours is absolutely pathetic. He’s guilting you so he won’t have to do it again. It’s very manipulative. He should be left with them more frequently to give him the opportunity to get the hang of it.

Because women are often discouraging of their efforts. They sleep alone with the newborn so daddy doesn't have a bad nights sleep before work, they criticise their attempts to learn, they voluntarily halt their careers so as to be the present parent. They get up in the mornings and generally take the lead at keeping the house clean and tidy and the children watered and fed. We come from a society that has had generations of women as SAHP and men as breadwinners, it will take active effort to break that cycle.

If you don't, you're likely to fall into the default trap where despite also working full time these days, most women handle the vast majority of the household and childcare responsibilities.

Why are women the ones who are responsible for encouraging their partners and preventing them from falling into the default trap? Why isn't it equally the man's responsibility to say "it's all right, I'll get him dressed, you have a rest"? Why are women always expected to think for men?

And you haven't answered my question re SAHDs (I know quite a few, actually). Would you find it irresponsible for a SAHD to leave the children alone with their mother because not being the prime carer she might not respond to them? Would you find it the responsibility for a SAHD to "encourage" the mother to get to know her own children, or would you think maybe she could think of that herself?

As I said, after generations of it being the norm it takes a pointed effort from both to break the cycle. She can't make him do it but she can check he is open to it before conception.

You're assuming the working mother would take the same role that many working dads take by doing very little with the children and not making that effort on their return from work. That isn't the case. Working mums do far more childcare than their Male counterparts, even if their co-parent is a SAHP. The chances of a working mum doing so little that their child does not see them as a primary caregiver is remote.

If this was the case, then of course I'd encourage any parent to take a more active role but if a woman does this, it isn't a reflection of our patriarchal society. There would be a part of me that thinks "good on her", but overall, it's the children who miss out and that's what really matters.

Why are women the ones who are responsible for encouraging their partners and preventing them from falling into the default trap? Why isn't it equally the man's responsibility to say "it's all right, I'll get him dressed, you have a rest"? Why are women always expected to think for men?

I don't understand how anyone could possibly challenge this thinking and yet @GEEpEe managed it again...

Thank fuck I’m married to a man who, despite having a full time, senior role, and despite me currently being a SAHM, had children because he actually wants to spend time with them and care for them. Actually baffled by all this men who are seemingly happy to procreate then have absolutely nothing to do with the raising of that child.

You're assuming the working mother would take the same role that many working dads take by doing very little with the children and not making that effort on their return from work. That isn't the case. Working mums do far more childcare than their Male counterparts, even if their co-parent is a SAHP. The chances of a working mum doing so little that their child does not see them as a primary caregiver is remote.

In other words, even working mothers take responsibility for establishing a bond with their children. It is unlikely that they wouldn't have thought of it unless encouraged and told what to do by their husbands. And most of them will have had virtually no experience of childrearing before they become parents.

I am glad to say that generations of my family have been brought up by men who were capable of thinking for themselves. And while my grandfather, who would have been 130 this year, might have been excused if he hadn't, I can't see any excuse for a young man of today, after these matters have been talked about for half a decade. There cannot be any man alive today so ignorant they have never heard of dads taking part in childcare. If they decide not to, then that is a deliberate choice that cannot just be laid at the door of patriarchal society. They are patriarchal society because that's what they choose to be.

They sleep alone with the newborn so daddy doesn't have a bad nights sleep before work

I don't know anyone in real life who has done this, but even if so, do you think the woman enjoys doing all the night wake ups? Changing nappies and doing all of the feeds? Soothing to sleep? Or do you think often men harp on about not being able to be tired for work? Who do you really think benefits most from that arrangement?

they criticise their attempts to learn

Many women on here have explained that their partners don't want to learn, you can't really criticise something someone isn't doing.

they voluntarily halt their careers so as to be the present parent

For many families this is the only arrangement that works, dad's job is far too important for him to take any time off for childcare, so often it becomes unsustainable for a woman to work full time, have days off when the child is sick, and everything else in between. Again, in some cases, do you not think it's the actions of the man that prompt this?

They get up in the mornings and generally take the lead at keeping the house clean and tidy and the children watered and fed

Great, just what every woman dreams of. It would be so terrible if some men took the initiative and got up with baby, cooked meals and cleaned the house. Again, mostly their jobs are far too tiring and important to have time or energy to do such womanly work.

I know what you are trying to put across, but it's not up to women to train men, or beg them to help out. Yes you should carefully choose who you start a family with, but many men change. My DH was really thoughtful, good fun, considerate, supportive, we shared household jobs- none of that indicated he wouldn't be arsed. So again, stop blaming women for men that are useless (I know they aren't all, but some most definitely are through their own choices and actions).

If non-patriarchal society is a relatively new concept for men, then it's equally a relatively new concept for women. Yet I don't ring my husband to come and sort things out if something goes wrong at work. I grit my teeth and buckle down and learn new skills.

They get up in the mornings and generally take the lead at keeping the house clean and tidy and the children watered and fed.

You mean they have to do it because their pathetic excuses for men always wait for their wives to take the lead?
Funny how those same men don't seem to have problems taking the lead elsewhere.
It's true that some women don't allow men to take a role, but for the most part, it's the man who must step up.
While pre-baby behaviour can give some clues, some men change markedly.

There cannot be any man alive today so ignorant they have never heard of dads taking part in childcare. If they decide not to, then that is a deliberate choice that cannot just be laid at the door of patriarchal society. They are patriarchal society because that's what they choose to be

100% this. My dad, who is in his 60’s, spent a lot of time working abroad. My mum was a SAHM. When he was at home, he had a full and active part in our upbringing.
Now he’s retired he looks after my 1 year old completely on his own 1 day a week while I work. He picks my older 2 up from school on his own one evening a week and gives them dinner/helps with homework etc.

Am thinking of ringing my 87yo father and asking him "when we were little and you were looking after us, how did you work out that we would need to be fed and dressed and taken to the potty? I mean, you were a man in a patriarchal society, how did you come to understand these mysteries?"

Nope. My ex was like your husband. Kids were fine until I dared set foot out the door without them and then suddenly they were sick/wouldn't settle, or he couldn't find an item the kids needed like nappies/calpol and would text me all night/day complaining about it to the point I stopped going out.
Fact is he just could not be assed to take care of his children because that was my job.

My husband is the total opposite. he just does what needs to be done with regards to parenting, I don't worry when I leave the house for a few hours. so no not all dads just shit ones.