Awful situation - someone I manage going for the same promotion?

[icecreaminapot]

I have applied for a job (not in my current place) that would represent a step-up for me, but would be a natural progression. I spoke to my boss first, who was supportive.

Today, someone I manage has told me they also applied. We have both been short-listed. The issue is this person is not qualified or experienced enough for the role. Yes, I know, they are entitled to apply for any job they want, but the only way they would meet the criteria is if they lied about what they have done in the current post. They are struggling in their current role, never mind trying to step up. I have had to support them massively and refer them to my boss to try and improve matters. They are in no way ready for the next step up, but to get short-listed they must have taken credit for things I or others in our team have actually done. No doubt about it.

My worry is that in doing this they have probably cast doubt on my application. I feel like we have both been shortlisted so the recruiters can work out who's lying! What do I do? If anyone ha experience of this would love to hear it, especially from recruiters.

I've been vague for obvious reasons, but ours is a niche industry so I know that this is a problem and our applications will have stood out like a sore thumb.

They have as much right to try to get the job as you do. Concentrate on your own interview.

Honestly someone else from the same company you work in applying for the same job casts no doubt on your application at all. Don't even think about the other candidate - just focus on your own interview skills and examples you can give to show you are suitable.

Icecream, just concentrate on your own application and interview. There's nothing you can do about the other person. If you are asked for a reference it would be reasonable for you to refer the firm to someone else to do it, as you are applying for same job. I doubt she will put you down as referee, though.

Good luck, I hope you get the job. Do let us know. Stop worrying, what will be will be.

PineappleDanish That is the exact nature of my concern - thank you.

OP, are you concerned that this colleague will be critical of your management/development skills in an interview?

It's possible that they've been honest about not thriving in their current position, but have impressed sufficiently thus far in the process to be shortlisted.

Some managers get satisfaction from helping and mentoring their employees so they succeed in their careers and some managers like to keep their employees firmly in their place to focus on advancing their own careers. Different management styles.

I've always made a quick escape from managers who aren't interested in my career progression and I'm guessing that is how your employee is feeling.

Are you worried they will ask you how you manage under performers and they ask her what support she has received.

Don't worry about it at all. Focus on being clear on what you do not others. A good interviewer should be able to see the difference between you.

I can see why this would be irritating but I wouldn't worry. The fact that you are credible and experienced and she isn't will shine through at interview.

What you could do in interview is say something like 'I led on this project, supported by my team of x role and x role who assisted with x, y and z' and if your management experience comes up, talk about your experience managing and developing inexperienced individuals, and giving them exposure to more advanced projects which you've been leading, of course with absolutely no inference of who you might be referring to. Absolutely staying professional and in no way suggesting any slight on your colleague, just being truthful about your experience and the role you've taken.

I'm not worried about either of us being asked about the support for under performance that I have provided - if it is answered honestly. And what if they ask me if I have ever had to deal with under performance and I have to omit the identity of the person? Or allude to it? If giving a full answer I would have to refer to their role...and that would make it explicit who I was referring to.

But no, it's not awkward at all and I am obviously a shit manager to even consider this an issue.

If you're asked for a reference say it's a conflict of interest as you're interviewing for the same role. The interviewing company would know that and accept it. If a referee is required, suggest either HR or your boss.

I think you are getting a hard time here OP.

However if they do have doubts I like to think they would ask you both questions that would unmask the truth and could also request exact job titles and responsibilities to be specified in references if needed.

Your colleague has more to fear from you being up against her than you do.

All you can do is be truthful about what you have done in the interview. If you know there are specific things you need to have experience in to be shortlisted make sure you’re confident to talk about those things in interviews.

In terms of the reference I would pass it on to another colleague as it doesn’t seem appropriate for you to provide one, but maybe give them some honest information to include.

In terms of whether she lied or not, there’s nothing you can do about that. It is up to the interviewers to make sure they check information given in CVs etc through the references and interview questions etc.

From your point of view hopefully they will catch her out and then at least there’s one less candidate for you to do better than, or they will fall for it and she’ll get the job and at least she won’t be part of your team anymore.

If you're asked about dealing with under performance just be honest, whilst being vague enough to try not to point the finger at her. After all, it could have been a previous person in her role couldn't it?

Don't worry about it. As long as you're not being untruthful or malicious, you need to just do what you would always do in an interview, never mind that she's applied for it too.

I'll add that where I am, a referee is asked specific questions about the applicant and their competencies and performance. A confirmation of employment ie dates worked would go to HR not a referee.

So unless you have a good relationship with someone, you don't ask them to be a referee. If you're underperforming you certainly wouldn't ask your boss.

It's giving the other person a bit of leeway here as they can say they used an alternative referee as they knew you (their boss) had applied for the role too. Usually if a person doesn't have their direct manager as a referee, people do ask why not.

If you are required to give a reference prior to their interview, I was abstain and pass that task up to your manager. I would contact them to explain that you’ve done this for transparency purposes as you yourself have been shortlisted and you feel it would be unethical under the circumstances for you to provide the reference. Your manager can then provide an accurate reference possibly commenting on missed targets etc in a way that if you do that it may actually go against you at interview if it’s seen as you trying to thwart their chances.

Can you take a portfolio of your work, either in hard copy or on USB/computer which would prove what you've done? Make sure you can supply accurate details of projects in a way that removes all doubts and remove all assistance from her as of now. Lock everything down in your current situation.

I imagine it's not just you and this other person in the race. Neither of you may get it.

The whole recruitment process is so open to abuse. So many people embroider, exaggerate and downright lie about their skills and experience. It is often simply the person who interviews best who gets the job.

You should never name a person when asked about how you manage underperformance. How unprofessional. Be careful not to mention her or her role at all, you could lose this interview all my yourself at this rate.
Just be confident and honest, and ignore that she is also going for the role. I'm sure there are a number of candidates.

To me It really is as simple as if this organisation hires her then you know they aren't the type of place that does their due diligence so it's not a place you would actually want to work because if they miss relatively simple things like this then what else do they miss or not manage correctly!

From a recruiting point of view I know that in some roles I have shortlisted some candidates that fit the criteria but I don't necessarily think will pass the interview stage especially when we haven't had many people applying! but because the application fits essential/desirable I have to put them forward.

Honestly, you are over thinking this.

You need to pretend you don't know they've applied and focus on your own performance.

If a pre-interview verbal reference is asked for, I think you should refer it to your boss actually as it would clearly be a conflict of interest to give a reference for a job where you are also an applicant.,

If they've lied, they'll be caught out. If they get the job, that's a management problem solved for you. If you're asked questions about handling poor performance, just answer honestly without naming them.

I get it OP.

If you think you can pull it off without coming across as being petty (which will be difficult), I think a pp advice of referring to your colleague by their role/job description and being very clear about who did what in any scenarios you are asked to describe would be the way to go.

Do you know anyone who has the ear of the hiring manager for the new role? A quiet word might do the trick...

I agree with you though, its a tricky situation that has the potential to (unfairly) reflect very badly on you whatever you do. I hope it works out for the best.

Your answers will illustrate the depth of your knowledge and you will be able to describe your achievements in great detail with examples. Therefore it will be clear that you have been honest in your application. People that lie on applications cannot offer this level of detail and will be found out by a competent interviewer. Good luck OP

If you are required to give a reference prior to their interview, I was abstain and pass that task up to your manager. I would contact them to explain that you’ve done this for transparency purposes as you yourself have been shortlisted and you feel it would be unethical under the circumstances for you to provide the reference. Your manager can then provide an accurate reference possibly commenting on missed targets etc in a way that if you do that it may actually go against you at interview if it’s seen as you trying to thwart their chances.

This.

To me It really is as simple as if this organisation hires her then you know they aren't the type of place that does their due diligence so it's not a place you would actually want to work because if they miss relatively simple things like this then what else do they miss or not manage correctly!

And this.

Worse case scenario - she gets the role and you no longer have to deal with her holding back your team.

Dh manages a large technical team and after a few hiring errors has no introduced a technical test in. Apparently it is really easy but it is surprising how few people can actual do it despite interviewing really well.