To think teacher shouldn’t describe child as arrogant?

[pinkgreenpurpleblue]

AIBU to be uncomfortable with this adjective ascribed to (nearly 13 year old) child?

because teachers don't feel comfortable telling their parents the truth

Unless things have changed we were always told not to be negative on written reports which made some a struggle!
Many parents can't handle the truth about their dear, they see a cute baby who's grown a bit, the teacher sees a hormonal horror sometimes.

KatnissK Fri 10-Jan-20 20:15:11
If you are concerned OP, then I suggest you send an email to the teacher regarding that comment and asking for some further insight into how your son is behaving. As a teacher I probably wouldn't use that word, but if I have read the thread correctly I believe this was said to you at parents' evening which is a busy and stressful night when we've one set of parents after another. I've often felt I'm speaking gibberish by the end of such evenings and I'm sure I've worded my opinions poorly on occasion. A follow up email would probably be helpful to either reassure you or explain the situation better.

This seems like good advice to me, and what I would do if I were in the same position.

FWIW my son's (Y3) teacher asked to have a word with me, and went on to report some undesirable behaviour that my son had done in class. I told his teacher that I would speak to him about it, explain where he had gone wrong and was hoping that would be enough to ensure there wasn't a repeat, which we did not want. The look of relief on the teacher's face made me realise he had been tense and was clearly concerned about how I would take the negative news. But this is the thing, you don't want to just hear about the good things, although it's nice - if they don't tell you about the undesirable things, if you don't know about it, how can we do anything to resolve it?

she did say tacked onto positives ’but he is arrogant.’ I asked what she meant and she repeated it.

As has been said, the teacher has 5 mins, with one parent after another. They've told you lots of positives about your dc and then something you didn't like hearing.
Unless you have a difficulty understanding or processing language, or you are working in a language that isn't your first language, then you know what arrogant means.

Of course a teacher should use a word to describe what the child is like. What would be the point of us all traipsing up to parents' evenings otherwise ?

At the point I've clicked on the poll, 93% of respondents are saying YABU.

Go and find out more information and why it was used.

It may be correct and it may not be.

Sorry, I also meant to say that if this had been said to me, I would be focusing on sorting out my dc's arrogance and attitude at school over picking at the teacher's language choice.

Teacher threads though ...

I’m a sports coach/ teacher and would never use use that word to describe a child when talking to their parents. Not because I would be scared but I’d be able to describe their behaviour better.

I also know two school teachers. One is the most neurotic people, boarding on toxic I know and the other is a complete wreak head.

Teachers are not gods and I just don’t understand the MN mentally of not being able to challenge them.

Teachers are just humans. Humans make assumptions about people people. I’ve know teachers to take a dislike to some ones child 😱 yes it does happen

Does your dc not come across as arrogant in any other part of his life.

Was your child at PE?

I remember arrogant kids at secondary.

One would show off about their marks to less academically able pupils.

Another would try and humiliate the teacher by disrupting things and constantly correcting them.

I remember kids who would try and negotiate marking with the teacher. So we'd be going through a test and they'd say things like I definitely deserve the mark for this, the question is not exam style so doesn't matter etc

I remember another who never did homework or contributed in class but aced the exam at the end.

We are talking about teenagers here. The stereotype of a teen is a cocky know-it-all. This Mark Twain quote is spot on for many:
“When I was a boy of 14, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be 21, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years.”

Most kids behave differently at school compared to home. The self-conscious teen years often mean the difference is even bigger

It’s funny how it’s almost always boys. Why do they end up arrogant. I would be really interested to know. When I was that age I was very clever. But I was slightly embarrassed about it. And never wanted it brought to anyone’s attention

@Peterspotter People aren't saying you can't disagree with what is said. The OP is questioning the choice of word. She hasn't said "this is a complete shock to me, and I don't recognise that in my dc at all" she's saying "I don't like that word", which kind of misses the point.

We all have different 'lines' about what words are acceptable in common parlance - there are regularly threads on here asking about certain words and if they are appropriate - but the point is, as a parent, I would be focusing on the behaviour, not the partcular word choice and, whether, in an ideal scenario the teacher might have been able to think of 'a slightly different word to use which still conveyed the meaning'

Teachers are not gods and I just don’t understand the MN mentally of not being able to challenge them.
That would be an amazing point, if there was a mentality of not challenging teachers, but there isn't.

The general consensus is that if people have queries or questions or want to raise issues in schools then:

• there's a polite and reasonable way to do things
• it's worth going into any discussion with an open mind and being open to the fact that the information you're unhappy about is accurate/ your DC may have not given you the full story
• raise issues with the most appropriate person and follow procedure rather than following some of the terrible and inaccurate advice that gets dished out by some posters

Well some kids are arrogant. My friends sister was arrogant at 13 and is still arrogant now.l (29) She has an air about her that she is somehow special and feels she can order people around.

Be clear on the problem behaviour. Do not assume reason behind it.

But again, how is a child supposed to learn what is wrong with their behaviour if you nobody ever ascribes negative attributes to it?

“Frequently pulls wings off flies.”

“Takes money from other children with threats of force.”

“Talks over others constantly.”

But don’t say the behaviour is cruel, bullying or selfish. Because that’s “labelling”.

@pinkgreenpurpleblue did you manage to get any further feed back?

A lot of teenagers can be very arrogant. You had positive feedback too, so I'd put it down to teen years thing unless there are related discipline & peer issues arising regularly around that, in which case it needs sorting. When teaching I had a couple of very arrogant 9 year olds. Both sets of rather pushy 'I run the PTA & therefore you better make nice' parents were convinced their offspring were perfect. I went with 'sometimes over confident' at parents evening, mindful that the Head was scared of them too & that both could be spiteful if things didn't go their way. Wealthy area, very aggressive mindset generally from parents, I regularly felt like to parents, we were seen as their staff, to be organised & dictated too. I left teaching for this very reason.

I would really feel this comment like a kick in the chest, and I'd be bothered that she didn't give examples...but I would also accept that he's coming across to her as arrogant and there may well be something in that.

But again, how is a child supposed to learn what is wrong with their behaviour if you nobody ever ascribes negative attributes to it?

Describe the behaviour, say it is unacceptable, and what needs to change.

What's so difficult?

Talks over others constantly - may be because the child (or adult) is selfish, or arrogant. Or they may have poor social skills, or come from a culture where this behaviour is acceptable/normal. Or have anxiety which comes out as constant talking. Or whatever.

So, say that talking over other people is not acceptable, because everyone has a right to be heard.

Is 'arrogant' - well, what is he doing that comes across as arrogant?

Maybe he is arrogant, and thinks he is better than everyone else. Or maybe he isn't, but something he is doing is interpreted by the teacher as being arrogant. Either way, he can't change until he is told what, exactly, is the problem in his behaviour.

he's coming across to her as arrogant

Yes, and as a skilled professional (which, of course, all teachers are...) she should be able to explain what actions (or lack of action) of his causes her to come to this conclusion. So he can change that behaviour, and his parents can help him change his behaviour.

Children who are able in a subject can be arrogant about it.

My ds is a love,y charming lily and hardworking young man. All his teachers comment on it.

However he also has asd and can be a pedantic arse on a spectacular level.
I know it. So can hardly be surprised if any teachers point it out

But if you know what arrogant is then you as the parent can explain and advise how to be less so.

I don't think we'd ask a teacher to explain what they meant if they said can be "chatty" "figgity" "disorganised and forgets homework".

But I do know if a teacher said my child can be arrogant I would be more concerned about teaching him some humility than the teachers choice of words.

OP I think there are far worse things than being arrogant. I’d rather my kid was arrogant than a people pleaser, too shy to speak in class, conflict avoidant or liable to blind obedience. A bit too much confidence is a darn sight better than too little. If the teacher hasn’t mentioned particular actions and it hasn’t come up in other ways, I would maybe ask your child why the teacher might think that, but otherwise just forget about it.

For a long time teachers have not been able to say anything negative about a pupil. It has been prettied up in bullshit language, so much so that reports and general correspondence is meaningless.

Yep. And then those kids grow up and hit the working world, finding themselves astonished that they aren't setting the world on fire and that their bosses and colleagues think they are dickheads.

The number of times I've been challenged by new hires (mostly graduates) who feel - in no particular order - that adherence to working hours, completing menial but useful tasks and following annual leave rules, are all things that should apply to everyone but them. One memorable moment was one such employee's mother calling me to take me to task for rejecting her child's holiday request. The fact that said child was 22 and had been told repeatedly that he couldn't take more than two weeks off at a time, was apparently neither here nor there. Another was being told very confidently that the chap in question had an excellent memory and therefore did not need a paper and pen to take notes. So I rattled off the system requirements I was teaching him; two minutes into the session he muttered that he needed to write this all down...

These are real incidents (with some non-essential bits edited for anonymity!). Do your son a favour and take the feedback on board - I guarantee that his future employers will thank you

As a teacher, I can honestly say that I've had students who come across immensely arrogant, convinced they know everything, ignore instructions and lessons. Some snap out of it when given questions they can't answer, but others literally hunker down and insist it's the question that's wrong when they hit work that shows their gaps in understanding. I've never had an arrogant student whose arrogance was justified.
The catch is, even where honestly applicable, I can't use the word to describe them. It's too strong. It makes parents defensive, like we're saying their child is bad, even though we know it's behavioural and something worth working on. I wish I could use it more freely, though, because for some students it's their main barrier to learning.
We're encouraged to be tactful when talking to parents, so unless the parent uses the word first (some are very forward about what their child is like) I wouldn't be willing to, for fear of the consequences, especially if it was in writing.

TLDR: It's unusual for a teacher to do that out of the blue. There's a chance the teacher and your child just don't mesh well (it happens). Ask for clarification on the behaviour, perhaps?

ask for clarification on the behaviour perhaps?

Exactly what those of us who are questioning the teacher's use of the word are saying.

What behaviour is causing the teacher to assume that the OP's son is 'arrogant'

And whatever the behaviour, 'arrogant' ascribes intent to the behaviour, which may or may not be correct