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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think Racists have won this round.

295 replies

Temp123999 · 08/01/2020 19:00

apple.news/AssxAoQwcTPqUCSyvFxCKdQ

The only Black/mixed race member of the royal family has been bullied and insulted to the point that she's made the decision to step back.

OP posts:
WineOrGinOrBoth · 09/01/2020 22:16

It does not make any sense. Harry is Charles son. End of.

Leflic · 09/01/2020 22:18

Walkingdeadfangirl - what? Harry and Charles share a long horsey nose and too close together eyes. The spit of each other.

Walkingdeadfangirl · 09/01/2020 22:22

Powerful organisations never cover up any of their little 'digressions', do they?

malylis · 09/01/2020 22:28

Tin foil hat for walkingdeadfangirl.

crestedrobin · 09/01/2020 22:34

Oh so her being "uppity" isnt that?
Yes that is racist, however the majority of people haven't said that. Don't tar everyone with the same brush. The biggest racists imo are the royal family, add to that bigoted, greedy and ruthless.

Walkingdeadfangirl · 09/01/2020 23:13

malylis Maybe, agree to disagree, but it does explain why Harry is treating his 'Dad' and his family so shit over the past few days.

I look forward to him leaving 'the Firm' completely. Paying his own way, buying his own house, paying for his own flights, his own security and not trading on the Royal Families name.

malylis · 10/01/2020 06:57

He pays for his own flights when its not work related.

Security he would have if he renounced his royal status anyway.

He never owned the house.

He'll always be able to use the name he was born with.

Teateaandmoretea · 10/01/2020 07:22

I think uppity is classist first and foremost. Class in the UK is the most important 'privilege' by miles and people both male and female are judged constantly for it. Unfortunately for MM she falls flat on her face on this one.

WineOrGinOrBoth · 10/01/2020 07:49

Uppity isn’t a racist word. I’ve been called uppity by a ex bf family. Why? Because I went to university!

SamanthaBrique · 10/01/2020 07:54

A little explanation of why uppity is considered racist when applied to black people.

Teateaandmoretea · 10/01/2020 08:13

Anything can be considered racist in context. It can also be considered sexist and classist, so there are 3 aspects to it. Plus Royals should be seen and not heard.

The class issue is to do with her father looks like he has just walked out of the Royle family. Her mother otoh has grace and appears as and looks like an ordinary middle class woman (which is the expectation of British society).

Hefzi · 10/01/2020 11:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Patroclus · 10/01/2020 14:05

Uppity is very much a historically racist thing to describe black people.

A bit like how 'not one of us' can mean different things.

Butchyrestingface · 10/01/2020 14:10

Uppity is very much a historically racist thing to describe black people

To preface, I absolutely think MM has been subject to racism and misogyny and have said so many times on MN.

However, I am unfamiliar with the word “uppity” being used as a racial epithet and before recent events would have read it as signifying sexist attitudes towards MM as a woman.

I’ve seen enough criticism of “uppity” as being racially charged to recognise that it must be a thing. Was it more prevalent in the US than the UK or used equally in both?

IrmaFayLear · 10/01/2020 14:15

My understanding is that in the US it has been used in a racist way. But not in the UK, so therefore people here are quite likely to use it about anyone - no matter what their creed or colour - who they deem to be a bit cocky and giving themselves (undeserved) airs and graces.

Of all the silly things I saw some idiots complaining about The Mr Men's "Mr Uppity" !!!! (Although I believe Mr Greedy was fat shaming, and some other Mr Man was mansplaining....)

Hadalifeonce · 10/01/2020 14:18

I don't generally read the tabloid press, but don't recall seeing anything racist written about the Duchess of Sussex, or said on TV. Is someone able to tell me the kind of things which have been said, I am sure the press complaints body would be all over this surely?

AmelieTaylor · 10/01/2020 14:19

Of course it’s her colour/race

Couldn’t possibly be because she’s ‘always wanted to marry a price’ and now she has she’s set about making his relationship with his family & friends as awkward as possible.

Or that despite being told what her future life would be like she’s now whinging about it.

Nope definitely get race 🙄

Urkiddingright · 10/01/2020 14:25

Princess Diana must be turning in her grave since Harry married that "black" woman.

Yeah ‘cause her boyfriend wasn’t brown or anything... Some people are so very stupid.

I personally think you’re allowed to dislike someone of a different race without being racist. You’re only racist if you dislike them because they’re a different race. The British public haven’t warmed to her because she’s American for starters, she also wants to be an A list celebrity but before she met Harry was literally just on a TV show very few British people watched. She isn’t Hollywood A list by any means, she was a Deal or No Deal girl a few years ago ffs. I don’t think her Dad or sister helped matters either. Their climate change hypocrisy wasn’t great and I don’t think people like the fact she wears extortionate clothes whilst simultaneously preaching about impoverished women. It’s really nothing to do with her race for most people, I think any woman Harry married was bound to face scrutiny.

DeeCeeCherry · 10/01/2020 14:30

I personally think you’re allowed to dislike someone of a different race without being racist. You’re only racist if you dislike them because they’re a different race

In shit hot news, nobody on MN/wider society can possibly be racist about Meghan. Because they haven't said so and instead are hiding behind other reasons to 'justify' being an absolute bitch + using outdated 1950s sexist language and implications, about a woman they don't know and will never meet. Everything BUT 'I don't like her because she's part black'.

Great to know racism has been eradicated and her race and colour couldn't possibly be a reason for much of the hate.

ScreamingLadySutch · 10/01/2020 14:40

@Frothybothie

Africa will suffice.

My deleted comment was surmising psychological things, sorry Mumsnet Towers. No reference to race, promise.

ScreamingLadySutch · 10/01/2020 15:28

For those for whom this is important, the writer has exactly the same parentage as Meghan:

It is absurd to blame the Harry and Meghan fiasco on 'British racism'
SHERELLE JACOBS
DAILY TELEGRAPH COLUMNIST

10 JANUARY 2020 • 6:00AM

In this photo released by Kensington Palace on Monday May 21, 2018, shows an official wedding photo of Britain's Prince Harry and Meghan Markle, center, in Windsor Castle, Windsor, England, Saturday May 19, 2018. Others in photo from left, back row, Jasper Dyer, Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall, Prince Charles, Doria Ragland, Prince William; center row, Brian Mulroney, Prince Philip, Queen Elizabeth II, Kate, Duchess of Cambridge, Princess Charlotte, Prince George, Rylan Litt, John Mulroney; front row, Ivy Mulroney, Florence van Cutsem, Zalie Warren, Remi Litt.
Britain’s frustration with the Sussexes stems from the pair's desire to have their cake and eat it CREDIT: ALEXI LUBOMIRSKI/ PA

The cultural tension between the Sussexes and the public has nothing to do with colour

The Duke and Duchess of Sussex's extraordinary announcement – evening timed for the American audience – may have blindsided the Crown, but the liberal narrative setting in is utterly predictable. According to various commentators, and sympathisers on social media, the couple were partly driven away by British racism.

It is true that Meghan has suffered racist remarks on internet platforms. And, no doubt, a very small minority of genuinely prejudiced Britons will dislike the Duchess simply because of the colour of her skin. But the suggestion that the public at large is instinctively hostile to the couple because a dingy, residual bigotry claws at the inner depths of the British zeitgest is absurd. So too the idea that the country's press is institutionally prejudiced, peppering their copy with double-entendres that Meghan is ‘unsuitable’ for the Royal Family, and doesn't 'fit in'. This theory has been reinforced by the Duke of Sussex’s claim that there have been 'racial undertones' to his wife’s press coverage.

This is not only a fundamental misreading of the public’s frustration with Harry and Meghan’s conduct, but also an analysis that suffers from a short memory. When Meghan and Harry announced their engagement, both Middle England and the media fawned over the couple. Faithful monarchists toasted their wedding day in Jubilee-style street parties. The press hailed her as a “breath of fresh air”. But it wasn’t long before the whiff of rot started to seep from the Sussex’s tacit social contract with the country; the secrecy over Archie’s christening did not sit comfortably alongside revelations about the £2.4 million refurbishment of Frogmore cottage. Nor the career shift to heckling the public on climate change while zipping around on private jets.

Britain’s frustration with the Sussexes thus centres around their naive hypocrisy and self-destructive determination to have their cake and eat it. It is categorically not about Meghan’s race.

Yes, there is a disconnect between the royal pair and swathes of Britain. Not because Meghan has foreign ancestors, but due to the fact that the couple seem to live on another PR-oiled, celebnocratic planet. As reflected in their new website which toothily techno-jabbers about going forward in a “progressive new role” and continuing to “collaborate” with Her Majesty.

It is, of course, true that there has been a tension between the pair and the wider public, but this is cultural rather than racial. The Middle English instinct is that we should aspire to a colour blind society. This is partly because, unlike America, the UK has not need to find a language of ‘empowerment’ or a legal framework for affirmative action, to cauterise deep wounds from an incendiary race relations history. But also partly because – ironically enough given the royal subject-matter – Britain’s demons are entangled in class rather than race. Meritocracy runs in modern Britain’s marrows, because most of us fiercely believe that people should not be defined by their background.

Meghan’s perspective on race, is unsurprisingly, more informed by the American, than the British experience. Hence her rhetoric about sisterhood, and self-identifying as ‘woman of colour’. But for many Britons it just jarred. Including for this writer, who has almost overnight gone from being mixed-race when filling out forms, to a being, by metropolitan cultural definition, a one-drop ‘person of colour’.

Such is why that Vogue magazine cover – which featured 15 inspirational women – ruffled so many feathers. The celebration of “black” ballerinas and “Somali” boxers was weightily cadenced poetry to the pious wokeocracy. But to the rest of us, it exposed a lightweight and flippantly tokenistic attitude.

Many will continue to insist that the scourge of racism drove Harry and Meghan away, but one wonders whether the modern phenomenon of victimised narcissism is actually the culprit here. Eyebrow-raising elements to this story – from their discourteous behaviour towards the Queen to the decision to quit their apparently taxing public role after a six-week luxury holiday – all hint at a lack of self-awareness. Relieved of their royal duties, one can only hope they find the time to indulge in some soul searching. Meanwhile, the British public have clear consciences.

malylis · 10/01/2020 15:43

Yes but she doesn't have the same experiences does she?

Also discounting the telegraph as a source, writing for privileged white people.

malylis · 10/01/2020 15:43

In fact its just utter bollocks.

GinDaddy · 10/01/2020 16:14

@malylis

That's absurd to discount an entire newspaper as a source just because of its historical bias.

I'm mixed race and I thought that article was spot on.

The issue with Meghan was never really about race (despite the horrible initial headlines) but about culture, of a US aspiring superstar ignoring the traditions and conventions of the family she married into.

It's that simple.

ScreamingLadySutch · 10/01/2020 16:25

Thank you, @GinDaddy

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