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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think wanting a drink doesn't make you an alcoholic

198 replies

pumpandthump · 21/12/2019 19:14

Because some mnetters do.

This isn't a taat more a thread about several posts on various threads.

I very rarely drink, for example, the last time I had a drink was 15th November at my works Christmas do. Before that I'm not sure, but probably a glass of wine in September or October. I drink roughly once a month, slightly less often. Usually just 1 or 2 drinks, with or after a meal. This year I have been 'merry' but not drunk, once.

Christmas day I enjoy a drink- bucks fizz as we open presents in the morning, a glass of red or 2 with our meal and then a Bailey's in the evening once the kids are in bed. I don't HAVE to have them, but I'd be really disappointed if I couldn't, it's part of the tradition.

According to some posters, being unwilling to forego this alcohol makes me an alcoholic. Aibu to think this is ridiculous?

OP posts:
Lulualla · 21/12/2019 21:12

@MrsEnglishh

Some people are more susceptible to addiction, yes. That's fact. Are you saying science is wrong on that? What evidence have you used to conclude that?
If those people never drink then they'll never know. But it's a factor.

And people with big predisposition to addiction can put their bodies into the position of needing it by drinking habitually and then realising they cannot say no even when they dont want to drink. They chose to drink to begin with, but they didn't choose for their bodies to become addicted. Or people who go through tragedy and drink, but then cannot stop because they have become addicted.

Have you ever seen someone go through detox? Have you seen what they're bodies put them through? Imagine going through that whilst knowing it would all stop if you give your body what it wants. All the pain would stop if you just had a drink.

It's a disease. Its bit a choice. You're just ignorant.

Greggers2017 · 21/12/2019 21:13

@MrsEnglishh do you actually believe what you are saying?
Some people have addictive personalities. Substance misuse often comes hand in hand with domestic violence and mental health, known as the toxic trio.
People experiment, people bow to peer pressure, people use to cope and then very, very quickly end up on the downward spiral to addiction. You have no idea what you are talking about.

TheFormidableMrsC · 21/12/2019 21:14

@MrsEnglishh

So you're saying addiction starts before someone chooses to put the substance into their bodies? OK

Yes it does. Given the very long line of alcoholics in my family. My brother and I were very aware of this and have monitored ourselves accordingly. However, the sheer amount of family members with alcohol issues in my family suggest it's a genetic problem. I have come across many other families with the same story. Of course you could choose not to drink, but most people don't, let's be honest.

MrsEnglishh · 21/12/2019 21:17

Ah, now see, you assume I'm ignorant. No, I have personal, close experience of addiction. I also have led a very upsetting and traumatic life involving CSA, DV, tragic deaths and many other experiences that I've had to deal with.

I chose not to put addictive substances into my body. An "addictive personality" is just an excuse. I have absolutely no time or sympathy for alcoholics or drug addicts. There is always a choice and these people ruin lives, are a massive drain on the NHS, cause violence, heartache and even murder people when they carry on driving around. No sympathy at all.

It isn't a disease. It's not cancer. It's not diabetes. It's a choice.

That's all I'm going to say now, I won't be responding further. Froth away Wine

Skidzer · 21/12/2019 21:19

Well now that she's left, can we party?

lisasimpsonssaxophone · 21/12/2019 21:20

YANBU, but as a newly sober person whose life has changed immeasurably for the better since giving up alcohol, you do start to see things through a different ‘lens’ and all those cheesy greetings cards and novelty gin/prosecco themed gifts start to take on a bit of a sad new meaning.

I also think people need to believe that ‘alcoholics’ exist as some kind of separate category of people who have some defined symptoms or specific patterns of drinking which tip them into that category, so that they can feel confident that they definitely aren’t one and have no danger of ever becoming one. Rather than recognising that anyone can develop a problem with alcohol given the right (or wrong) combination of factors. Some of the ‘I’m definitely not an alcoholic because alcoholics do such-and-such’ posts on this thread ring familiar bells for me... but maybe I’m over identifying.

But I don’t think just enjoying a drink automatically means you’re an ‘alcoholic’ and I would never pass comment on anyone else’s relationship with alcohol unless they had concerns of their own and wanted to talk about it.

Skidzer · 21/12/2019 21:21

these people ruin lives,

You're ruining my life right now Mrs!

Lulualla · 21/12/2019 21:21

@MrsEnglishh
Type 2 diabetes is a choice though, isn't it? You do it to yourself with diet choices.
Stomach cancer, lung cancer, skin cancer... all very easy to call those choices.
Someone taking a drunk of wine doesn't intend to become addicted; the disease takes over.
Someone going out in sun doesnt intend to get skin cancer; the disease just takes over.

lilgreen · 21/12/2019 21:22

Oooh I love a drink. Not to excess but most weekends I have a few drinks: couple of glasses of wine on Friday, Saturday and/or Sunday. Don’t drink in the week.

Greggers2017 · 21/12/2019 21:23

@MrsEnglishh what an absolute ignorant tw*t you are.
I would love you to come into my work place and listen to the stories of some of the people I work, they are horrendous. You can see why they do what they do and how they quickly end up on that downward spiral.
You sound like an awful person. I expect you tell people with mental illnesses to cheer up and get on with it.

rosie1959 · 21/12/2019 21:26

Please anyone that is reading this ask for help
Those of us that have been through it know alcoholics are sick people and need help
I sit regularly in a room of alcoholics not the down and out that some imagine but ordinarily people who are looking for an answer Alcoholism is not fussy if you are a doctor nurse lawyer judge we all suffer from the same mental illness I have met people from all walks of life and know better now to think I know it all

pointythings · 21/12/2019 21:30

MrsEnglishh your experiences have clearly made you bitter. It's a shame they have not made you wiser. Science and research do not lie. You are just choosing to believe the prejudices engendered by your personal experience.

Addiction is a complex thing, which involves the coming together of genetic and environmental factors. Inborn susceptibility is absolutely a part of it - this is why my DDs don't drink. Their late father was an alcoholic, so is one of their uncles and so was a great-uncle. So they choose to be careful.

The need to make that choice does not exist for everyone.

ChristmassySpice · 21/12/2019 21:36

I know this isn't a TAAT but I just saw a poster reply to someone who was worried about an alcoholic attending on Christmas Day. The reply was that if they had alcohol available on Christmas Day then they should also be questioning themselves!

Northernsoullover · 21/12/2019 21:37

@MrsEnglishh that's an awful thing to say. I have witnessed the death of a good friend from complications caused by alcohol addiction. He never intended to get addicted. He was desperate to stop.

lisasimpsonssaxophone · 21/12/2019 21:37

The need to make that choice does not exist for everyone.

I used to believe this, then I started to think about quitting alcohol and I read a few books on the subject and it was a real eye opener. I think it was in the Unexpected Joy of Being Sober that the author talks about how people seemed to need to hear that she was an ‘alcoholic’ to feel comfortable with her not drinking.

It’s definitely been my own experience too, as when you say you’ve given up alcohol because it makes you feel a bit shit and you’d rather not have it any more people seem to go a bit funny. It’s almost like ‘are... are we allowed to do that?!’ whereas if you say you can’t have it because you’re an alcoholic people don’t seem to argue nearly as much.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 21/12/2019 21:43

YANBU, MN is so funny when it comes to alcohol. If you have more than a thimbleful of wine every fortnight you're an alcoholic. I'm hearing it IRL a bit too - my family ALWAYS say my niece's ex was an alcoholic. He was 19, his dad worked away 3 weeks of the month and he would throw parties every weekend and then would go out during student night on Wednesday's. This apparently made him a raging alcoholic and she is Better Off Without Him - really I think it's their way of trying to forget that she stalked the poor bugger once he broke up with her and threatened suicide if they didn't get back together - which worked, for 2 weeks, before it went pear shaped again. God knows what they'd have said if they knew about my Uni days - I would drink 4 nights out of 7, for 2 years, and that was considered tame! I'm now in my mid-30's and drink maybe 3-4 times a year. Including Christmas

Tinkobell · 21/12/2019 21:44

@MrsEnglishh.....you are the biggest ignoramus I've ever had the misfortune to read on MN.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 21/12/2019 21:45

And my dad was an alcoholic, and died suddenly of chronic liver failure aged 53. So I know what an alcoholic looks like

Tinkobell · 21/12/2019 21:48

The world is full recovered and recovering addicts of all types who have made a tremendous step and concerted effort to maintain their recovery who are fully functioning and contributing members of society as much as anyone else on this planet!

Tinkobell · 21/12/2019 21:53

Zoe Ball, Davina McCall, Daniel Ratcliffe, Elton John to name a few ......all recovered alcoholics but presumably a waste of space in the opinion of the great @MrsEnglishh.

Bodear · 21/12/2019 22:00

@virginpinkmartini
The OP was talking about alcoholism, not being physically dependent. They are very different things and many (most) alcoholics are not physically dependent.

Having said that, no, of course op isn’t an alcoholic.

Skidzer · 21/12/2019 22:11

Most alcoholics are not physically dependent?

PMSL

Trewser · 21/12/2019 22:20

Ah, OK. The liquid is forced down an alcoholic's neck. Same as a smoker is held down and has cigarettes shoved in their mouth. Or a drug addict is force fed drugs. I see

The poster who wrote this sounds incredibly immature.

Lulualla · 21/12/2019 22:22

@Bodear
Alcoholic and alcohol dependent are interchangeable. Alcoholics are dependent on alcohol.

The other term is alcohol abuse. Those are people who happily dont drink regularly and who dont NEED to drink, but they go binge drinking at the weekend or whatever. Binge drinkers arent (usually) alcohol dependent. Alcoholics are

pointythings · 21/12/2019 22:38

Skidzer you are both right and wrong.

The physical side of alcohol dependency is easily overcome with a safe detox. However, it is perfectly possible for a destructive psychological dependency to exist long before the stage where the physical dependency becomes dangerous enough to require detox. And once the detox process is complete, that psychological dependency remains and needs addressing, otherwise you end up with a 'dry drunk' - someone who has all the problems a drinking alcoholic has, just without the alcohol. It's not a pretty picture.

My husband was psychologically dependent long before he developed the physical dependency. And of course it is also true that damage to health kicks in much earlier than full blown physical dependency that requires detox.