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AIBU?

To think that Turkeys Voted for Christmas?

847 replies

StormzysHat · 15/12/2019 13:45

NC. This could appear goady but honestly it's a genuine confusion to me.

According to what we are led to believe by the media / some people on MN, "northerners" (as a generic group) voted for Conservatives because they are disadvantaged and fed up with the north south divide among other reasons.

How come disadvantaged Londoners voted Labour? I work in support sector and many people in my care will be in shelters this Christmas, and others rely on food banks. They were saddened and disheartened by Labour's loss and felt the Conservatives in no way represent them. This is on top of the Tory devised hostile environment and Windrush scandal making peoples' lives hell.

I understand that people are / have been pissed off and wanted to have their voices heard. But WHY would the very communities ravaged by the Tories in the 80's vote for them?

Why is it that Corbyn who lives in a very modest way, in Upper Holloway and who went to grammar school is seen as less acceptable than an old Etonian millionaire proven liar? How can Boris Jonson be seen as someone who can help the north south divide or to champion the working class FFS??

I completely accept Corbyn's leadership has been poor and don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan. BUT, given the alternative, I can't understand HOW working class people could vote for Johnson?

AIBU to think the turkeys just voted for Christmas?

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Justanotherlurker · 17/12/2019 16:35

Most people do not read manifestos or follow policy. They absorb sound bites, headlines and memes. That is regardless of class.

That is true across the board hence why you have plenty of labour supporters still offering sound bites and anti tory memes, this forum was full of them in the run up to last thursday.

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 16:38

You don't sound very speechless.

Anyway, everyone is scratching their heads trying to work out what went wrong.

Tory policy won't actually benefit people on low incomes. It just won't.

So, what is left? Personality. It had become a presidential style race.

Roy Chubby Brown is hugely popular where I come from. People would like to pretend that, that strand of working class culture doesn't exist but it does. Trust me, I grew up with it.

It's not pleasant and Boris played to it.

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Trewser · 17/12/2019 16:38

God, the labour memes were tedious. Just waiting a week or so before I unblock everyone

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Trewser · 17/12/2019 16:40

One minute Bj is a posh billionaire from Eton, the next he's channeling roy chubby brown, make your mind up

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MarshaBradyo · 17/12/2019 16:41

I’m not against people being direct and fast with messages. Labour need to get better at this.

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Dapplegrey · 17/12/2019 16:42

Heath and Wilson went to Oxford via grammar school.

That doesn’t make them posh.

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Elle7rose · 17/12/2019 16:45

... and lots of people said they were voting for 'Change' because they were voting for Brexit- they voted for more of the same plus the horrors of Brexit and the economic crisis that that will cause!

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koshkat · 17/12/2019 16:45

The sweeping statements on here about what constitutes the 'working class' are really obnoxious and so very telling.

THIS is why Labour didn't get in grey. Has the penny not dropped yet?

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derxa · 17/12/2019 16:45

Roy Chubby Brown is hugely popular where I come from. People would like to pretend that, that strand of working class culture doesn't exist but it does. Trust me, I grew up with it. And what of it. I've heard that some people laugh at Mrs Brown's Boys, Michael MacIntyre and even Nish Kumar. There's no accounting for taste is there?

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 16:46

Where did I mention Elton?

There is a nasty strand in working class culture. It's inverted snobbery (against the middle class not the rich), calling people a swot or a hippy, defying authority just for the hell of it, sneering at feminism and until recently, gay rights, it claims that you can't mention Christmas because of Muslims and God knows what else.

It's there and Boris is playing to it.

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koshkat · 17/12/2019 16:48

There is a nasty strand in working class culture. It's inverted snobbery (against the middle class not the rich), calling people a swot or a hippy, defying authority just for the hell of it, sneering at feminism and until recently, gay rights, it claims that you can't mention Christmas because of Muslims and God knows what else.

You are in a massive hole. Stop digging because it is becoming embarrassing FGS.

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 16:50

Oh, so working class culture is all wonderful?

Right.

There's shit in every nest. This is my own background I'm talking about- a salient point you seem to have missed.

Boris played to the worst elements. He really did.

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Trewser · 17/12/2019 16:51

My grandparents were working class and I find what you've written really offensive and ignorant.

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 16:52

Why?

I grew up working class.

I lived alongside those attitudes. I still do some days.

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koshkat · 17/12/2019 16:53

Well your own background sounds bloody grim and I am sorry about that. But to pretend that this is 'working class' culture is just crap. And offensive crap at that.

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 16:56

No, it is one strand of it.

It is not the totality of it.

Boris is playing to some of the worst elements.

It is vile.

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koshkat · 17/12/2019 16:57

In your opinion. I disagree.

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derxa · 17/12/2019 16:57

My grandparents were working class and I find what you've written really offensive and ignorant.
It's gobsmacking. I don't understand it.

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BovaryX · 17/12/2019 16:57

The ingrained snobbery has come out in full force since Thursday, and it has been from those who are struggling to work out how Labour lost, with threads titled such as this one

One would have thought that after being decimated in the North and losing constituencies that had voted Labour for a hundred years there would be some humility, some critical reflection. But apparently not. This thread, like others, is radioactive with contempt for the very voters Labour claims to represent. Labour has become the party of intolerant ideologues and insufferable snobs. If this thread is representative, they will be wallowing on the sidelines for years to come.

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SeaWitchly · 17/12/2019 16:58

The Tory led media have demonised Corbyn ever since he became Labour leader. Mud sticks - hence Corbyn derided as a ‘terrorist’ and ‘‘unpatriotic’. Then the belief that Brexit is the answer to all the community’s difficulty and that Boris is the man to get Brexit done so vote for him.
I do not believe the north will reach the promised land through Conservative rule and Brexit but would be happy to be proven wrong... people’s lives are at stake and I hope Boris and his party will at least attempt to honour their promises and the trust the people put in them.
But I am afraid that these communities will be betrayed and this will inevitably lead to further unrest and dissatisfaction.

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DuckWillow · 17/12/2019 17:01

Lots of working class young men went out and voted in their droves. And they voted Tory and any other party. Not enough voted Labour.

Yesterday when I was angry and hormonal I was raging about the man next door who raves about Brexit (but really has no idea what that means) while posting all kinds of bollocks to FB about Muslims banning Xmas.

But my neighbour has absorbed all the sound bites from the Far Right (and I don't include the Conservatives in that). In my opinion nobody jumped on Britain First quickly enough when they were posting their nasty and false sound bites a few years ago. As a result we have a much less tolerant society who feel Labour does not speak for them.

I voted Labour in my area (a safe Tory seat) to try and reduce the majority my MP has. This was effective and his majority was reduced. In reality I had no desire to see either Party win. I didn't like Corbyn and I can't stand Boris.

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Trewser · 17/12/2019 17:02

I agree in part with what you say but I think Corbyn WAS unpatriotic, no need for speech marks.

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koshkat · 17/12/2019 17:02

I am sorry but the whole media demonisation thing is just crap. Johnson has had more than his fair share and so does every other leader. So sick of the pathetic excuses constantly being wheeled out.

Does not help that my sister is pretty high up in Momentum and it is like debating a plank when she gets going. The media hatred of Corbyn is one of her favourite topics too.

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Trewser · 17/12/2019 17:03

Omg koshkat so is mine. Absolutely no debate possible or you are a vile murdering cunt.

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thefluffysideofgrey · 17/12/2019 17:04

Of course not, we'll be shafted.

There'll be a few piecemeal measures but nothing of any substance. Boris is already backtracking on the employment guarantees in relation to Brexit for example.

Zero hours will be the norm in a couple of years.

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