Can't afford Child maintenance payments.

[locco21]

Name change due to this being very outing!

DP has 2 children from a previous relationship. Of course there's been bumps in the road but overall everyone gets on okay and preciously there have rarely been any big issues between DP and his ex.

However, DP's ex is one of those 'you're not seeing your kids' type if he disagrees with her at all. For example, if she wants to go out on a Thursday (not his contact day), and he can't change his plans to look after them she will text him 'you're a shit dad and you're not seeing your kids again-I'm changing their surnames' etc... kind of thing. Not very nice at all. However DP has learnt to cope with this and now only makes arrangements to pick the kids up and doesn't entertain anything else.

Moving on, DP's ex has recently become worse and has been messaging abuse to us both- also saying things to upset the children etc... and has completely took a flip on her child maintenance stance.

Previously, due to the horrendous amount of debt his ex left him in (he stupidly took it on as He didn't want bailiffs turning up at his children's home). The arrangement was for DP to pay a lower rate of maintenance, organised by himself and his ex- this is so he could pay the debt and stay afloat. We buy the children lots of things also- basically they don't want for anything from either parent.

However, DP has currently changed jobs, he is receiving a lower pay rate however is much happier in this job which is also more stable. He didn't even mention it and carried on paying his maintenance as usual. However now his ex is filing a CMS case (which I know she is more than entitled to do- before anyone says anything). But DP simply can not afford the rate in which he would have to pay as he is still paying their debts. After rent, debts, bills and maintenance he would not have a penny left- meaning no petrol, no food etc... he's really stressing and doesn't know what to do.

His ex has rang him and explained all of this and he asked if she was struggling for money etc... that's where the change of heart come from? She said no, she just wanted to make life harder for him. Very petty to say the least.

Anyway, Is DP BU to contest this? No idea how he can even?! But should he just bite then bullet and pay the higher rate even if he cannot afford it? He is a great dad and this has really upset him. We know she is obviously legally entitled to this money, but it's sometimes so unfair for some dads as the CMS system doesn't take circumstance into account very often..

Opinions and advice welcome! Thanks 😊

Locco,

You need to take proper legal advice. The costs of residency vary hugely depending on both the resident and non-resident parent’s attitude to ‘extras’ (which can be far more than 50% of costs). If you are paying for half (or more than half) of clothes, school trips etc, then the resident parent is quids in.

It sounds like your partner’s ex is still feeling vindictive and is using the children both as a source of money and as a rod to beat your partner with.

If your partner wants a 50/50 parenting relationship and it is in the kids’ best interests, he should apply to court and get it formalised. That would mean that, other than hangovers, there would be far less contact with ex. And the financial issue would disappear.

In any event I would ask a solicitor (or CAB, if too expensive) how the old joint debt could reduce the payments in the interests of equity.

Regarding the debt: DH’s ex wife refused to sign their divorce until DH took it on even though it was in both their names. We paid off one lot at £800 ish. The other two still have about £1300 and £1200 outstanding, again both in joint names.

Anyway, with those 2, he has an agreement to pay £1 a month off each! He needs to call up the debtors and sound really sad. Explain everything you’ve said here re. not being able to eat etc and say that if they don’t accept your offer of £1 a month then you’ll have to stop paying. He’s got to be REALLY firm as they’ll say but can’t you afford XX and the standard answer is No.

Re the CMS variation as suggested above. Good idea only she can challenge it so no guarantees there.

Debt charities and similar can get the debt frozen. No more interest or late payment fees get added on. dp would annually fill out a form of income and outgoings. Let's say after all bills, living expenses etc he has £22 left over a month. The charity or similar would contact each (I will say) credit card company and make an offer. Say, £2.50 or £1.67 a month. This gets accepted and the ccc stops sending letters or making phone calls.
It might take a long(long) time to get debt free but the sheer relief of not being chased for the debt or worrying about it, is priceless.
I took on debts to hurry up my divorce, it was a big mistake but I did eventually pay it all off using a debt charity.

It sounds like he was living beyond his means with regards to the debt whilst in his last relationship and then didn’t think or the implications of taking a lower paid job whilst having children to support and a non working partner.

I’d be working a second job if I couldn’t afford my children, not looking for ways to pay less.

Child maintenance does not cover the costs of raising kids, he needs to work out a way to pay, take a second job perhaps. It really is his responsibility

No, it's the responsibility of both parents. The ex needs to take the hit and get a job. Lazy mare. And maybe she should take some responsibility for the debts but she sounds a selfish type, so she won't.

Poor kids having a mother like that. What will they think of her when they are older?

Also stop paying all the extras from now. And tell the kids why. Their mother's fault.

I find it strange that you feel no responsibility for the maintenance of his kids, but admit you cant earn enough money to keep afloat because you're studying and that falls to him.

His kids come first. He needs to pay at least the assigned amount of money which is not reduced by any dependents of your own. Once he's paid that,then he can see what he has left for other things like rent and relationships.

So how much does he pay? Because that's what it comes down to. If he paid say £350 + £300 towards joint debts, and now pays £500 in maintenance, I could have some sympathy.

If however he paid £100 in maintenance, supposedly paid for joint debts (but maybe he hasn't told you that he paid off his debts but not the joint), and now needs to pay £150, I have little sympathy especially if indeed, he then add enough to buy them quite a lot when they are with you.

The whole thing about him taking on joint debts, I have heard it so many times from guys who are very bad at managing money but don't want their new partner to know. I'd be very wary of any boyfriend with a bad credit, who says that it is all down to joint debts with the ex.

And fair enough that he jumped the gun and went for a lower paid job to ensure security, but surely nothing is stoppping him looking for another job that will pay as his old one did or even more. He is not stuck in his new job forever.

It does sound like he is trying to convince everyone that he is perfect, with excuses for everything, whilst the ex is evil, and out to give him a hard time for no proper reason. It might be, but in reality, it is rarely so black and white.

Mum presumably doesn't work because she is raising two DC with very little support from their father.

Talking about having 50/50 care just so you can ameliorate some of the cost burden is a bit grim.

OP I reckon your DH has sold you a lie here, I'd be very cautious about the "her debt" story at best I'm going to bet it was debt jointly incurred raising their DC.

Best thing to do is imagine what he'd do if they were your shared DC living with you FT. Presumably if he didn't have enough money to make it work he'd get a second job?

Pegasus,

So if less than 50/50 she is ‘bringing up the kids with very little help’ but wanting 50/50 is a ‘bit grim’ (as you are assuming that this is money driven despite the OP saying that is what he wants and he is a good father).

How do fathers win with attitudes like that?!

@locco21 regardless of the money situation, she shouldn't be texting you about contact so I'd be blocking her number. That's for your DP to deal with, not you. That way she can't manipulate you, or him via you. I'd also be getting DP to apply for a child arrangements order so that contact is scheduled and has to be stuck to. That's what I have. My exH is not able to contact me direct due to him being abusive which is a huge relief. It's £215 for a court application last I knew and he can selfrepresent. Lots of parents due and the courts are really good with those self repping.

You said they have been split quite a while ...

So how long is he taking to pay these debts off? If he’s paying the minimum and getting out of CM for it I’m not surprised she’s pissed off.

He should of been paying the difference in cms he wasn’t giving her at the higher paid job and then paying the same from his end as its joint debt.

How long was she supposed to take lower cms ? Until he’s decided he’s done.

Since it’s been quite a while then he’s had enough time to pay it back.

Assumingly the lower paid job is more secure than higher paid job given than the op said he was at risk of redundancy.

I’d imagine anyone looking at this would say it was a sensible move. Stability wise anyway.

If he has some paperwork it may be worth chasing her for some of the debt.

@DriftingLeaves so do you think all SAHPs are lazy? Or only the ones that are financially supported by benefits instead of their partners?

She does sound unreasonable OP but she has been accepting under the recommended payments for a while and it is costly to bring up children. Maintenance isn't an option.

The mum should get off her lazy arse and get a job. That's a pisstake. Why should their dad have to do everything?

Fucking hell, are you for real? So stay at home mums are now lazy, raising kids is a cake walk is it? And what job should she get that will cover the cost childcare for her after being out of the market for so long? Fuck you are stay at home parents lazy.

And by the way, paying less than the CMS amount and parenting your kids 1 day out of 7 is not “doing everything”. What a fucking insult.

I think anyone capable of working who lives off someone who cannot afford to support her could sometimes be described as lazy. And this woman in particular. How on earth do you mistake that for me saying all SAHMs are lazy?

Thing is CM is a very small amount of his wages, so I can only assume the debts are huge. The easy thing would be to arrange a repayment plan for these, they’re obviously not affordable regardless of maintenance

@DriftingLeaves because you said she's lazy for not having a job. But she's raising two children, which is hard work. Hardly lazy. So if she's lazy, then essentially you are saying all SAHPs are lazy.

And the child maintenance is to support her children, not her. She's not living off her ex, I doubt he's paying all her rent and bills.

Forgive me I've not read the full thread, but why is it unfair?

The payments applied by the CSA are notoriously low. So he's obviously not going to be paying much compared to his income.

Not getting why it's not fair he has to pay.

Obviously she's a complete cow, using the kids as weapons, but the money. Nope not getting it!

Ah applying for 50:50 now that's good advice :)

No I'm not. That's just silly. I was a SAHM for some years because we could afford for me to work part time around my DH's hours. If our circumstances had changed I would certainly have looked for work to support my DCs. Most reasonable people would.

Can you afford to be in full time education at the moment? Can your household afford it? You are in a partnership, had things been different you would have had a child together so your life is very much a partnership. I know his (her?) debts are not your concern, nor is his child maintenance, but if it affects household spend then it is your concern.

I think you both need to get some very serious financial advice. If he is paying debt that wasn't accrued by him, then that needs to be addressed. His children won't stop growing, needing food, warmth shelter etc to wait for the debt to be cleared. His ex might be a complete bitch, but he is in a situation now as are you, that needs revising.

Could he apply for 50/50 custody of the children. Remove the need for maintenance? Apply for full custody, as the mother treats her children as weapons, and receive maintenance from their mother?

You both need to speak to someone about your joint financial situation. He needs to move jobs to a higher paid one. You might need to consider if full-time education is sensible right now. He needs to get his debts looked at and see what, if anything, can be done.