Aibu to think that my kids aren’t coming back?

[SeaOfDespair]

I had my girls removed last month and it’s been a very traumatic experience. My family are so far away, my friends have dwindled away and I’m stuck looking at these 4 walls.

I’m seeing a private child psychologist and doing some work with him. He understands how harsh the system can be. I’m doing 2 different parenting courses online. I’m paying for all of this myself and has been a bit of a struggle recently.

My solicitor just tells me to go along with whatever they want. I’ve ticked one thing off the list, but they’re not forthcoming with starting their own assessments. Social worker is either sick, or can’t be bothered.

My youngest has arrived to contact with bruising to her face 4 times. She is cruising, but never managed to be bruised within my care. My elder one seems sort of happy, but is having a lot of tantrums and isn’t able to communicate with me.

From them wanting to keep them at home on an order, their original intentions until the court hearing, to pretending I don’t exist. They didn’t even turn up to the meeting last week. No apology given. No notification of cancellation.

From a case of closing ranks to keeping the case open, it never did surprise me that they applied for a court order. My social worker’s reasoning? I don’t agree with their concerns, so there needs to be a care order.

Am I being unreasonable to think I don’t stand a chance in hell of getting them back, if they’re not willing to even bother working with me?

That's interesting, but it doesn't answer my question.

I'll ask again:
If you've got loads of appropriate toys and books for the children, why was this flagged up as a concern?

What exactly did they say?

I'm not sure how I can answer that question in a way that you like. I thought I did, sorry.

She won't just suddenly be able to do things like puzzles though. do you sit with her offer her a piece to fit show her then give her a turn. Build towers of bricks , naming the colours as you go, taking turns then knock down. Tbh it sounds as if you really leave her to it or are quickly discouraged. If your contact is observed these interactions are more important.

I give up.

I can't take this anymore.

This thread needs to go immediately. What on earth is wrong with people, as the PP above, this lady has lost her children, it’s clear she is truly struggling. Be ashamed of yourselves! I’m reporting!

There are two important elements to decor that you have to take into account before all other considerations.
They are health and safety.

The '53 insanely clever' storage solutions (from the blog you are looking at) are not designs for homes with small children or toddlers or concrete walls, or people with little or no DIY skills, carpentry tools, or people who live in a rented home, even if your home didn't have mould and rising damp.

Some of the ideas are death traps for toddlers.

Some of them would be impossible for you to manage as your walls are concrete and you have already experienced difficulties drilling to hang a curtain rod.

At least 50 of them are completely irrelevant to your needs.

The three that are perhaps relevant are:
The plastic hooks in the back of the closet wall.
You could use those hooks in the kitchen on the back of your lower cupboard doors and keep your recycling bags hanging on the hooks.

The bed risers are nice if you have plastic storage boxes to slot under your bed.

Tension rods are a better idea than curtain rods for concrete walls if you have the window configuration to hold tension rods.

..........

The living room pictures you posted:

Blue couch photo - this room is not safe for small children.

• Those ladder bookshelves that lean on the wall are a disaster waiting to happen.
• Little breakable knick knacks - candles, tray, vase, etc. that children could break and hurt themselves with.
• The crates-as-furniture tend to look like junk in the average home.
• Couch looks comfortable and clean. Cushions are not neat but that it ok.

Red lamp photo -

• Tidy
• Clean
• Not cluttered.
• Lamp for light is nicer than just a ceiling light.
• Safe for small child and baby/toddler, as far as I can see.
• Fireplace clean and fire lit, seems to have fire guard.
• Comfortable furniture.

............
You mention your cords (TV, etc)
Are they spread around the floor right now?
If yes, this is a hazard for baby just learning to walk and for a small child too.
You absolutely need to corral them. There should not be any trip hazards on the floor.
Do the outlets in the room have childproof outlet covers? (This goes for all of the rooms).
.............

Wrt your kitchen:
Where do you keep your mop and bucket?
Broom and dustpan?
Are your cleaning sprays and liquids and powders (bleach, etc) kept in a cupboard that is locked or secured with childproof locks?

Where do you currently keep the toys?

You should have some sort of toy storage. This sort is the most practical:
www.target.com/p/toy-storage-primary-organizer-with-9-fabric-storage-bins-tot-tutors/-/A-53809419
(Sorry - link is for Target, a US store.)
Each bin could have a specific sort of toy in it - blocks, dollies, doll clothes, musical things, stuffed animals, train, cars and vehicles, dress up clothes, shape sorters/puzzles... They don't have to be jam packed.
Do you have that sort of toy?

Could you fit a small bookshelf unit into your living room to keep the children's books in?

Wrt your bathroom:
Are medicines kept in a cupboard that the girls can't reach?
Are items like razors kept up and out of their reach?
Same goes for nail polish remover and anything else that could be dangerous for the girls to get their hands on?

Do you have an airing cupboard for things like towels and sheets?

..............
A place where there is mould and damp isn't safe no matter how appropriately furnished, so you have to keep after the landlord/ council to fix it.

green
It will probably be kept up.
I reported it ages ago on the grounds that it was unlikely to be helping the OP and what she really needs is appropriate offline advice from appropriately qualified people who will know the full picture.

Well intentioned people advising on a thread where it's evident we only have partial one sided details and a stressed OP who has generally wanted more validation/confirmation that SS are awful and there's a vendetta or that the house / toys are no concern etc was never going to be the sort of thread conducive to helping the OP offline.

Thank you to the nice people on this thread. To the others, you've succeeded. I'm sat here in tears and feeling pointless carrying on.

This thread is clearly not helping Op, by reading through if anything it’s more distressing & upsetting for Op

Please don't pretend to represent what's helpful to me. You've said the same thing various times, it wasn't helpful in the first place. Thanks.

Not aimed at you, Green.

I hope this thread has helped a bit. I think the majority of posters are well meaning and want to help.

Social services need to ascertain if your DD's developmental delays are due to neglect or special needs. It's impossible for us to tell from the thread which one it is (or maybe a bit of both).
I do think you're going to have to be patient.

It's telling you're not sure what a cosy home is. It's important SS see you can provide somewhere 'normal' for your DDs.
What is your girls' bedroom like ? Is it nicely decorated ? Do you have any of their drawings/ paintings you could stick up ?

A nice rug on the floor, night lights, a little table or desk ? If you google 'girls bedroom ideas' it'll give you an idea.

OP, there are many people on MN who will be sympathetic and want to help you, and there will be some that get a superiority kick and stick the boot in. I really hope you can sort the wheat from the chaff and I hope you find a new better advocate.

OP, I think you need to take a step back. Plenty of people are/have tried to help you, and most of the time you've evaded the question or answered something irrelevant.

You need to evaluate the reasons why your girls were removed. The real reasons. Deep down you know it isn't just about toys. You don't have to admit the real reasons to us- as long as you know why, that's ok.

Stop being confrontational with SS. Just do as they say. Stop questioning and arguing. If they tell you to get X installed, then you do it. You get on it straight away, you do it without shortcuts and you tell them it's done and move onto the next thing. If you need an advocate that's fine, but stop messing around- get on a waiting list. Stop wasting time.

Your house needs to be welcoming and safe. You've described it as a dentist's waiting room- do you really think this appeals to a social worker or a child? No, it doesn't. Don't just wildly buy junk to store things in. Firstly, your home needs to be safe for a child. Child proof everything. Soft rugs on a hard floor/those foam tiles you get for kid play areas. No corners exposed. Toys neatly stored away but easily accessible. Child gates, furniture fixed so it cannot fall onto a child, etc. Might sound blatantly obvious but they'll be assessing these things in every visit.

As for cosy? It needs to be comfortable and homely. Pictures up (it really doesn't matter if you like it or not, you need to appeal to SS), a throw/blanket on the sofa, cushions. Blinds (that are safe)/curtains. Their rooms need to be very personal- lots of things they like with bedding etc. Toys, bedtime books.

It needs to look like your family of 3 live there and are established, not as if a random lone person has just moved in. I'd still reccomend a huge clear out of things you don't need (I wouldn't bin a thing of the children's though). Clear space where you can but ensure it's very clear the kids are your priority and the home is set up for their needs.

Getting upset over this thread isn't going to help you. I accept it's tough but if you want your kids back you're going to have to dig deep and actively make changes. People are trying to help you. Take their tips on board- without them you're risking your kid's return. There's some excellent ideas on this thread- 29 or so pages in fact. That is a lot of free help right there. So what people have said things you didn't want to hear. Use their concerns as a way of understanding why SS might have concerns. Use your own initiative. Do research. Prove you're the mum you say you are.

But you need to accept why they were removed. The real reasons. Until you accept the problems, you can't fix the problems.

OP, I think you need to take a step back. Plenty of people are/have tried to help you, and most of the time you've evaded the question or answered something irrelevant
This through and through.

There's been some great advice throughout the thread that's probably going to he ignored and even saying that the nature of some of the thread unlikely to be helpful gets a snarky response.

You've said what lots of us have said throughout Pepe but clear, helpful advice doesn't seem to be what's wanted. It's either total affirmation or you're awful people who aren't helpful at all.

@LolaSmiles

Indeed. I hoped by summarising everyone's tips perhaps OP could perhaps make a list of things to work on, but I think it'll fall on deaf ears.

But, you can only try. It's up to OP now. You have to control your own destiny. Nothing else we can do.

You've done a good job there Pepe.
There's loads of good advice.

I hope the OP gets an appropriate offline advocate and takes on board the advice here. Of course, they've already told me that the advice I gave to get appropriate offline advice is really not helpful at all (whilst saying they are going to be getting an advocate page or so back) so who knows. We can only hope.

OP, sending you lots of . I cannot even imagine how you feel.

I think if you are on the spectrum, this thread may be very overwhelming and some of the ideas may not make sense or be indistinguishable from others.

Would it be possible for you to ask a friend, a representative, or even pay someone in real life to

a) consolidate this thread and come up with specific proposals on how to make changes to your home? You could chose the one you dislike the least. I hated child proofing the flat and remember having all sorts of unsuitable furniture, corners etc. Luckily we had a nanny who did that for us.

b) come up with a plan for your days with the children. At first, I hated playing with toys, messy play and in general any pretend play . With DD3 (SHM, no more nanny), I used to find one play group per day (different church play groups, charging £1) where we spent the mornings and it was easier to learn how to do those things by watching others. I also found I loved bath time with lots of toys and bath crayons, walks, talking to DCs about everything we saw and reading books. A planned structure for the week may be useful?

c) as other PPs have said, get an advocate to help you deal with SS

OP really shouldn't need to be 'window-dressing' her home. It needs to be safe. It needs to be relatively clean. It needs to have the key pieces of furniture such as sofa, table, beds for the kids and kitchen appliances. Whether the walls have pictures on is a total red herring.

OP. Some of the advice in pp is good. Anyone who has a go at you should be ashamed of themselves.

Did you attend core groups and child protection conferences OP?

I found reading this thread very upsetting. OP i hope you are ok.

Clearly there are lots of people who have no understanding of aspergers. They are being very impatient in their questions and answers and are not being understanding at all, which I imagine reflects the way you have been treated by SW and other authorities.

We get mould in our flat, my dd won't eat veg and i am messy - these are all completely normal, common things.

To me it seems as though you are being discrimated against because you are on the autistic spectrum. I don't think you specified your cultural background but I have also read about evidence showing that cultural/ethnic background impacts the likelihood of your children being taken away.

For example stats of babies being taking from parents who come from the traveller community are very high, even if the parents have left the traveller community, with no ties to them.

Please ignore the negative comments on here. Try to stay strong and keep hope. Maintain a good relationship with you dauters guardians and hopefully you will continue to be part of their lives whatever the outcome.

My brother has aspergers and is an amazing uncle to my 2DC and will make a brilliant father one day. Seeing him interact with other people, including other family members who misunderstand him can be so frustrating. I really do understand your frustration and hope things work out for you xxx

OP thanks for sharing how you try and play with your young DC. I think it is very hard if your own parents did not play with you. It is often from our own childhood that we learn by example how to do this as a parent.

When playing with young kids, it is really easy to be a bit too pushy or over enthusiastic. And then they resist any attempt to play together. One way of initiating play with a young child is to do some pretend play beside them. For example, some farmyard animals on the floor and a child is playing with a few of them. Rather than saying to the kid things like - what noise does your animal make, just choose a few animals and do a bit of pretend play next to your DC. For example if you chose a pig, making the pig walk along and say things like - Percy pig decides to go for a walk and buy an enormous ice cream, etc. And let your DC initiate the play together.
Also young DCs can have a very short span of attention. So they will quickly switch from one thing to another.
Also watch how others play with their young kids. You are obviously intelligent, so should be able to pick up tips from observing others.
Also read the book Talk so Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk.