Choir disappointment

[nannytothequeen]

This isn't really an AIBU. Cos I probably am. But I don't know where else to post. All my adult life I have derived a lot of pleasure from singing in choirs. I can read music competently and have always been a solid singer. Moved to a new place and joined a choir. No auditions needed. Have a couple of friends singing in another section. Paid my subs. Attended all rehearsals. I have found it a bit cliquey. Most singers are older than me and some much older and have known each other for years. But it doesn't matter when you're singing. In the last couple of weeks I have had some snide comments from other singers about getting something wrong, or not saying the words right or singing too loudly (in the loud bits) or being off key ( that particular criticism was galling because I had stopped singing at that point to try and listen to get it right). I have felt increasingly ganged up on but have largely ignored the comments.

Today I got an email from the choir leader saying that the conductor remains concerned that my voice is not balancing with the others. I didn't know he was concerned. He has never even spoken to me about anything ever. So I have been asked not to take part in the upcoming concert that I have been practicing for. However I am more than welcome to try out next year when all choir members will be auditioned.

AIBU to think fuck that for a game of soldiers? AIBU to be a bit upset? AIBU to think that something I have loved for literally decades has been kind of spoiled ? It sounds pathetic but it is like another rejection after a horrible marriage breakdown after he found another woman in the shape of a former friend and a move to a new place on my own.

Argh OP, this sort of thing is awful. Mrs Scrommidge and I were in a choral society when we first got together and it had all the worst types of behaviour you can get - cliques of the most bitchy kind, turning up pissed to concerts, playground shithousery of all kinds - and life is too bloody short for this sort of nonsense. The problem usually is when someone comes along who is genuinely able for it musically it seems to cause enormous offence to a certain sort of person.

I sing in a barbershop chorus with over 50 women and no one has been asked to leave while I have been there. If someone is singing the wrong notes or not blending the section lead will have a quiet word in private. We all have to record ourselves on phones at least in the run up to competitions and the section leader feeds back to us in private. We have some very strong singers who are sometimes asked to tone it down a little. The director places everyone according to the qualities of our voices and we can discretely request a move if a strong voice is bellowing at us.

We sing to a high standard and compete but everyone builds each other up and new members are always very welcome.

I think I'd try one (or maybe both!) of the worldmusic choirs - you may find you love that method as well (ie learning by ear etc without scores). It also sounds as though it would be very different music from what you're used to, and the change may be refreshing.

You don't sound pathetic at all by the way! (just rereading the op).

Can you perhaps aim higher? Try for a choir that does audition.

I know you have said the choirs are limited, but what about church or cathedral choirs? You don’t even have to pay subs, some will pay you!

Just this once - Daily Mail

I'm in a choir, and have a lot of power in my voice. Sometimes I get fixed with a hard stare from our coach, sometimes there's a 'admire the commitment Wilson but take it down a notch' comment, other times it's 'where are you, can't hear you at all?' Not all in one session I hesitate to add! It's just I'm not brilliant at blending, so she reminds me that's what I need to work on.

I'm not saying it's always easy to hear criticism, but that is the coach's job. Also giving that kind of snidey feedback to another choir member would be Frowned Upon Indeed in my choir, it's just not cricket. And it certainly wouldn't be passed on via email like that either. Yuck.

I'm really sorry OP because I know this is important to you, but this choir's ethos is terrible and it's not for you. Try somewhere else. You might enjoy the world choir and find it a bit of a challenge?

Reminds me of the old choir joke:

How many sopranos does it take to change a lightbulb?

Eight. One to stand on the stepladder and seven to stand around saying "It's too high for you, you'll never reach it"

This sounds awful. I agree with PP that you are probably too good for this particular choir. I would find another one, the right one for you is out there somewhere!

I don't care too much about the choir. I just want to sing! (Perhaps not early music though). And I have not even mentioned the Grade 8 or the other choirs thing either. I'm not in the UK so choirs are thin on the ground. The local audition choir is the early music choir. And other towns are a long way away. Nearest town of any size is 80 miles away and over a mountain range. Nearest proper city is 6 hours drive over a high altitude mountain pass!

I am also a trained classical musician (previously professional) and I have had similar experiences with amateur groups. Not always, but often. OP, you know from your own experience that what they are saying is untrue. You have a good feel of what your strengths are and really, it seems like this cliquey group did not enjoy someone else with a good voice and training coming along. IME, amateur choirs and orchestras are still competitive and people can feel challenged or threatened when competent musicians join. Regardless, they have not handled this well. They lose out on having a strong singer, and once the anger leaves you a bit, you will see that you would be happier belonging to another choir with a better sense of inclusitivity and kindness.

Oh OP, my first reaction was to say - join another choir but I see that this isn't going to be easy. I would seek a meeting with the conductor to chat about the email and also the welcome / vibe and how unpleasant it is. I think constructive feedback is OK if done in an appropriate and sensitive manner and also is applied to all members of the choir. And maybe you are not the only one who has tried to join this choir and been met with a clique - perhaps you could put some energy into finding other like minded individuals and set up a 'singing for fun' group of your own?

Oh that's disappointing! They sound awful. Would you have the energy or skills or time to set up your own choir? Is there a choir near where you work (or is that the same area that you live in)?

The choir I accompany has people traveling over an hour to get there (not me - too lazy!) because they are such a kind group.

Out the choir. Bet they’re not even that good. You’re pretty well trained and I bet your voice is absolutely fine, they’ll just be a bunch that hates newcomers.

Given your location updates maybe you could start your own choir? Or start one for local children and add on an adult choir later. Become the premier choir on your side of the mountain? Or partner up with a local church?

Thank you everyone for encouraging words. I am not angry. Just upset. I have had a series of significant life blows in the last couple of years and at one point I tried to kill myself im sad to say. I have been trying to engage in things I love and this situation makes me feel a bit like being back in that old dark place.

I’d try and stick up for yourself having seen the update. It’s a pretty poor show to chuck someone out without discussing what they’d like you to change first.

The conductor may be ignoring your calls. Have you masked your caller Id? I’d be asking them why they have asked you to leave rather than asking you to change x, y and z.

They sound awful. I was going to say you are in the wrong choir but rtft, it seems you don't have much choice. Do you think they are being bitchy because you have an English accent and it jars with the local one?

I think in your position I might get a few singing lessons, to brush up, and then set up a small singing group that sings the kind of music you love and be in competition with them! Sounds like your area needs more than one choir.

Gosh cross post. They have handled this very badly even if your voice genuinely didn’t blend well.

Well clearly your background demonstrates you can sing well, so I would guess the queen bee has decided you're a threat and wants rid. I'd look elsewhere for another choir to join. It's clearly them.

Try not to let it bother you, but I realise that's easier said than done. I've found (string player) it's taken me a few goes to find the right orchestra for me).

It's awful actually. How angry are you? Enough to reply and ask for specific examples of your "mistakes"? Bring up the incident where you weren't actually singing at the time. They're probably too cowardly to reply though! They don't deserve you.

Also, maybe look for some workshops that offer siniging as therapy. Very different approach. They may not be nearby but it would be worth doing a residential.

No. I haven't masked my caller id. I don't see that I should have to. I live and work in the same area. As for church choirs, I really have no idea. I don't think it's s big thing here. I was recently overseas and went to church. Happily singing along to all the hymns. After the service the minister stopped me and asked me if I would consider being in his church choir so my voice can't be that bad!

OP, I have been through some very difficult times in the last while and knew that to take my mind off things, I needed to play again. It has helped. I accompany a gospel choir (definitely not my cup of tea) but enjoy the atmosphere of creating music so much. Maybe you could reconsider the early music group? Maybe the music isn't to your liking but the culture of the choir could be.

OP I once ran a creative group - not music but similar dynamic. It became extremely cliquey and the self appointed big cats always scared off newcomers. Then they started to actually bully someone and came to me insisting I sack her from the group. I refused, disbanded the group and set up a new group the next day, being very selective about who I'd allow in. They were outraged that I hadn't bowed down to their manipulations. The new group ran very happily for years and thrived. The old group had become tiny and really mean spirited. Sounds like your area is crying out for a new choir.

Why not try the one where you learn by ear. It is slower and can be a bit frustrating sometimes but it is different skill altogether from singing from written music
I'm my choir, lots of the more competent musicians say they found it hard at first but love it now. It forced you to truly listen in a way that is harder to do if you rely on written music. Learning the words by ear can be a challenge but those are often given out on paper if they are very long and complicated.

In my current choir we learn by ear but the leader does some times give out music for those who want it. When she does that, I find things get much more difficult as people start arguing about if they are on the right note or not and start doubting themselves. I find it much much better when we do it by ear without music
Obviously the music is needed for much more complex pieces and for really good choirs but we are a local community choir and learning by ear is part of the challenge.