Would it matter less if I died?

[ladybee28]

Bracing myself a bit for a backlash on this, but...

I've heard a number of comments over recent months, exclusively from people who have children, that have left me feeling a bit weird, and I'm trying to untangle my logic from my feelings.

A few weeks ago a well-known musician died, and in telling me about it, my DP (who has a son) added to the story: "He had two kids and everything", shaking his head.

Then this morning a friend was talking about someone she knows who's been diagnosed with brain cancer – and then added extra qualification to the story by saying: "He's got kids, too." (He also has a wife he's been with since he was 15, and three sisters, and parents - but they don't get a mention)

Similar situations have popped up multiple times when people have passed away recently, where the fact that they were parents seemed to be added on to the story as an extra layer of sadness.

It feels like the reversal of their comments would be if a person without children died, they'd sit there and say: "Well, it could be worse - at least they didn't have kids."

And while I KNOW it's awful to lose a parent, and I can't imagine what that must be like for the children in question, it still makes me look at my friend, and my DP, and wonder: on some level, do they think it would matter less if I died, because I don't have children?

Is my life less valuable / important in their eyes because I've chosen not to be a mother?

AIBU to feel a bit weird about this, even though I know that's not explicitly what they mean?

I'd particularly like to hear from people who would probably say something like that, and understand more about where they're coming from – feels easier to have this conversation here with you all than bring it up with people IRL

OP, please don’t overthink this. As some PPs have said, it has nothing to do with your value, just a concern for the impact on small children. I lost my mum when I was 5. My life changed completely and I went from happy and secure to bullied and crying overnight. Losing a parent is horrible.

@GetRid – that doesn't offend me – I've heard that phrase a thousand times before and I'll hear it a thousand times again. And you're right, I won't ever understand exactly what it feels like to be a parent and to imagine that happening. But that doesn't mean I don't fully acknowledge that it would be horrendous for the children – it just still feels weird to hear it said to me, as someone they know doesn't have kids.

And, as I said in my OP, I'm not saying how I feel is logical. It IS weird - that's exactly the word I used, multiple times. Sometimes I feel things that AREN'T logical – and then I try to look at those feelings more closely and get other people's opinions on them... which is what I'm doing here.

@DontBuyANewMumCashmere that story landed the idea in a different way – I'm so sorry about your friend – and thank you for sharing the mixed feelings you have about the kids / no kids element when it comes to her. That helped me see it differently.

And @Lostsocksaresoannoying I'm not 'fretting over ridiculous petty things at all – there is no 'fretting' here. It's hardly keeping me up at night. I just noticed how I felt about something, noticed how those feelings contradicted something I could logically understand, and wanted to hear more from people who might say something like that so I could better untangle the two. It obviously hit you hard though, so I'm sorry it pulled your spikes out so quick.

It wouldn't matter less but people tend to have overwhelming empathy for children who've lost their parents, children and are so so vulnerable anyway and they will feel the loss in ways that adults won't. That's all

Well of course, yes it would matter less if you died rather than the you who died with children.

Get over yourself ffs

Personally don't think you are overthinking or over reacting. I've noticed it too, having children does seem to be seen as a measure of how tragic something is. It's good to know all us child free individuals are dispensable

If I knew I was dying my most overwhelming sadness would be for my children. I love my husband very much and my parents and I have a few friends I hold very dear. But the focus of my grief would be for my children. I have 2 teenagers and an 8 year old and none of them are ready to manage without their mother. I do not think for one moment I am worth more as a human being than you are OP. But to my children I am - currently - pretty much indispensable.

It's devastating beyond belief when a child loses a parent - but in addition to this, I can't imagine knowing I wouldn't see my child's next birthday or see them grow up and find out who they turn into, can't help them when they're hurt and knowing that you're not there to help them when they need you most.

I can't even bear to think about it

No, it just adds to the sadness because for me I cannot bear the thought of a child left without a parent, or a parent dealing with knowing they are leaving their child/ren.

@Hefzi it can feel as though someone's extraneous value comes from those who depend on them, and that, as a result, their death is considered to have more impact

You've put it in a much more nuanced way than I did – thank you for this.

And this thread is going much faster than I can respond to properly – but to those of you who have shared your personal experiences, thank you. It makes sense and it helps put things in perspective.

I wonder if maybe it's just something in the way it's said: "They had kids", referring to THEM, rather than "How terrible for their kids" or "I feel awful for their children", referring actually to the experience of the children, that has it land with me in a different way.

And since it's people who know me IRL, and know I don't have children, it feels more 'pointed' than it would otherwise.

Reading your responses, where you make that more explicit, I totally get it and it doesn't bring up that feeling in me.

I've had that said to me too. I get what you mean.

People can choose to be insulted by it, but what you're really insulted by is peoples empathy towards children. Which is strange. People dont hold more value to me because they are parents, but I do immediately think of the children left without a mum. I was in my early 20s when my DM died but my sibling was only 7/8. So while we all got sympathy everyone including myself felt an extra sense of grief when thinking about a young child losing their mum 🤷‍♀️

Every life matters to the people who love them but loss of a parent is more than other losses. Spouses can remarry and parents can have more children if they choose to but you only get one set of parents. I am not saying that husband/wife/children can be replaced but the there is a possibility f being able to move on from these losses. Sorry I really don't know how to put it in nice words as this all sounds very harsh.

When you die it won’t matter because your dead.

I think you're right.

I value my own life more now than I did pre DC. I want to be here to support them as they grow up.

When I was just whiterose doing my own thing I was less bothered.

I’m child free and I wouldn’t be offended by that comment. Kids are obviously completely dependent on their parents so from a child’s point of view, surely you can understand that losing a parent is the worst thing that can possibly happen to them. I think it’s just looking at the situation from a child’s perspective and empathising.

@InsertFunnyUsername – what you're really insulted by is peoples empathy towards children. Which is strange

THAT's a really interesting comment, actually – and there might even be some truth to it.

I had a pretty unpleasant childhood with a mother I no longer have a relationship with, and have spent the last couple of years quietly working through the sadness that witnessing the loving relationship between my DP and DSS brought up in me.

I wonder if this is an echo of the same thing? Thanks for pointing it out – I might not otherwise have noticed it.

I think you’re getting a hard time on here and some people are being much ruder than they would be in real life - looking at you, @thorswife

Op, I don’t think your friends and do mean it in a negative way to you; they’re just thinking about the pain of the dc who are left behind when a parent dies.

When you due you will be mourned by family, your dh, friends, but perhaps all those types of grief are different to a child’s grief for a parent.

(and just to add to the above update, before anyone tries to jump on my relationship with DSS, we have a great relationship, he's WONDERFUL, and I worked through this stuff BECAUSE I adore him, so please don't touch that. It's precious to me.)

Speaking as someone who doesn’t have children, and as someone who lost a parent early in life, I do think my death would matter more if I was a parent. Of course it would - I’d be leaving a child behind!

I don't think it doesn't matter if people without kids die. I don't think they're less important or the grief of their family is lesser. I do think it's less sad.

I've lost a few people over the last few years, relatives and friends. My friend who died at the age of thirty, leaving behind a newborn baby and a toddler is the most sad. That's not to say I grieved more for her than I did my own grandad. I didn't. We weren't close, but her death is the one that saddens me the most, iyswim? Whenever I think about my grandad I think of all the happy times I had with him. Whenever I think about my friend my thoughts are shadowed by the thought of her children and her desperation to stay with them as long as possible.

It’s because they grow up without a parent. What don’t you understand about that?

Get over yourself.

I'm sorry op I just don't understand why you're even thinking about how valuable your life might be in comparison to others.

When someone young dies people say how terrible it was, they were so young, I don't start thinking I'm less valuable because I'm older.

My children are completely dependent on me for everything, I love them more than life itself, the thoughts of leaving them suffering while they are still young is unbearable.

Is doesn't mean my life is worth more than yours, it's nothing to do with you, it's about children suffering when they don't deserve to.

*It’s because they grow up without a parent. What don’t you understand about that?

Get over yourself*

Who said I didn't understand it? Put your claws back in.

On a practical level it' is worse if someone dies and they have dependent children, because who's going to raise them?

We only really matter to the people who love us.

sadness that witnessing the loving relationship between my DP and DSS brought up in me. I wonder if this is an echo of the same thing?

Yes I would say you are right. I understand OP. I feel incredibly sad sometimes when I see mother and daughter relationships and eye roll at mothers day when I never before (obviously i wouldn't say anything to anyone celebrating it, we still do) It's natural, just dont think you dont matter or that it reflects on you as a person. You matter without a child, and I matter without a Mum