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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to expect my FIL to pay what he owes!

313 replies

73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 19:58

My FIL lives by himself. He's elderly but in reasonable health most of the time. He is quite well off (over 300K in the bank we think) but doesn't spend much as he prefers a quiet life and simple things.

The issue is that he asks us to get things - like DIY stuff so my OH can fix things which are broken when we visit (we don't mind doing this) and presents for the kids (he says can you put £50 in a card for them from me) - but without prompting will usually not pay us back. My OH and I have completely joint finances. I bring home twice as much as him (irrelevant really, but just for context).

He is generous at other times, e.g. he gave us £1000 each (me and OH for Xmas last year). My OH says that because of this we can't ask him to pay us back as it's too awkward. But I say that we put that cash into the mortgage so don't actually have it to give to the kids and anyway he gave it as a gift, not a fund for us to hold for him to spend when he wants/ needs to.

I find FIL really difficult. He's used to thinking only of him, so for example when we visit, it takes around 6 hours to drive to his. He doesn't get milk or bread in for us or any other food. After we arrive I have to go to the supermarket to stock up on basics. His wife died a couple of years ago and he's been trained to be inept (or lazy??) around the house so I don't expect him to cook us meals but to order an extra pint of milk and buy enough bread for us all to have breakfast is really no big ask and certainly within his capabilities. I can't figure out whether my OH is being unreasonable or whether my frustration at being expected to join my OH's family in treating my FIL like someone who really can't do anything for anyone else is clouding my thinking about this.

YABU - yes it's unreasonable to ask your FIL to reimburse you for small sums of money when he's generous with presents sometimes.

YANBU - FIL should reimburse you and if he doesn't do it without prompting it's reasonable to expect OH to prompt him.

OP posts:
nonevernotever · 30/10/2019 21:52

Ah crossed with your last two posts. Actually if he's taking your service for granted and is pretty self-centred, and you resent his treatment of your mil on her behalf then I can see why you find it so hard to get past it. The difference with my mum is that it is not deliberate, she doesn't expect it and we want to help. I don't want her thinking she can't ask us to get her stuff or worrying about keeping track of everything

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 21:54

Maybe the 2K was in part to cover/say thank you for things you paid for last year?

He didn't say so but yes he might have been thinking that.

OP posts:
Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 21:56

And how is it relevant how much he has in the bank (the might need care eventually) or the fact that you earn more than DH?

As I said to make it clear that it's not that he can't afford things which would clearly be different territory. And to make it clear that is is 'our' money not OH's money which is being spent. I was just trying to foresee some issues which might detract from the point. Neither are especially relevant in their own right.

OP posts:
Sammy867 · 30/10/2019 21:57

I don’t understand why you can’t just order a delivery to be delivered to his for a time after you’re due to arrive for yourselves? Lots of people won’t want to buy extra food or won’t know what others want to eat and obviously if his wife was previously doing all the shopping he may just not want to tread on anyone’s toes.
I would just order the delivery and text him to say you’re on your way, you’ve got some food to be delivered at x time when you should have arrived but if you’re a bit late then can he take it in and pack it away? We do this when visiting quite a lot and it works fine.

oobedobe · 30/10/2019 21:58

Maybe talk to OH and see if he will agree to ask for large sums back, eg if there was a specific DIY issue that was $200+ then remind FIL if it was $20 or $50 here and there just let it go.

But ultimately it is his Dad so I think OH gets final say on whether he thinks it is appropriate to ask for money back or not.

abitlostandalwayshungry · 30/10/2019 22:02

YANBU.

It politeness to have basics at home when visitors arrive after a long journey. It would be a small gesture from his side to show his appreciation for your time and your help around his home. Most of the solutions here are ideas how you should compensate for a mans unwillingness to host.

The money - a generous gift is not meant to make up for the smaller sums he owns, then it's not a gift but an advance payment for his expenses.

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:03

The difference with my mum is that it is not deliberate, she doesn't expect it and we want to help

Yes I can see that's very different. It sounds like you are doing a fantastic job for your mum and you're a credit to her.

Am example of my FIL's behavior might help pad out the differences to your mum. We spend every other Xmas with him (on the years we're not there on the day we see him just before Xmas and have an early Xmas there). Last year he had been invited to a friends for actual Xmas day. My OH was in the shops and called him to say 'I;m standing by the kids toys, shall I get this for x and this for y on your behalf and a bottle of wine for the neighbour' (X and Y being grandchildren of the neighbours who would also be there on xmas day'. FIL would not be persuaded and went on xmas day with nothing for his hosts or anyone else there. He said 'it's not any more hassle having an extra person'. In case anyone's wondering, he did not follow up with a post-event thank you gift. He just went and ate their food and took nothing even though his son would have bought and wrapped everything for him and it would have cost around £20 all in. He just doesn't think of others and social niceties. It's not ASD btw in case anyone's wondering. My OH was very embarassed on his behalf about the xmas day debacle. Especially as FIL was given a gift.

OP posts:
ArnoldBee · 30/10/2019 22:04

It may help to re-frame your thinking as its unlikely anything will change unless you discuss it with FIL and your DH. I would accept the £2k but for that year take out all the expenses incurred that year on your FILs behalf. The remainder would then be your present. As others have said this may be what your FIL is already thinking. The food issue in my experience is an old people thing. Yes its frustrating after a 6 hour journey but there are things you can do to minimise the impact on yourself. Sometimes there are battles that can't be won.

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:04

But ultimately it is his Dad so I think OH gets final say on whether he thinks it is appropriate to ask for money back or not.

I agree which is why I won't approach FIL directly myself.

OP posts:
Crazycrazylady · 30/10/2019 22:05

Gosh op. You do sound mean and
Hateful towards him, each of your posts highlight how little you think of him. He is your husbands father, maybe try and show
a little human kindness.

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:06

Most of the solutions here are ideas how you should compensate for a mans unwillingness to host.

Yes! That's it! that's my frustration and that's why advice about cool boxes is so frustrating. It's not addressing the issue and it's not the best solution (for us) to the problems which the unwillingness to host presents. Thank you for expressing this so well.

OP posts:
Etinox · 30/10/2019 22:06

@73Sunglasslover
I think you’ve worked it out yourself with the (new to us) info about his granddaughter and the old bathroom. I suspect you’ve just made the connection too. Flowers
Now you’ve recognised the connection you can accept it doesn’t feel welcoming when you visit and prepare yourself and be vigilant of your DH’s controlling or stingy corners.

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:08

I would get DH to ask FIL to add his name to his bank account, then any expenses can be taken directly. He may have to take him to the bank to sort it out. It also makes sense for future planning (also power of attorney).

Power of attorney is set up for the future but perhaps it's worth re-visiting the here and now. Maybe my OH needs a second bank card of his dad's. I might suggest that to him. If he and his sister are both OK with it and FIL thinks it's a good idea this could be a useful step to take.

OP posts:
blubelle7 · 30/10/2019 22:08

YABVVVVU and incredibly precious

The things you describe are a minor inconvenience and you are aware of them

  1. Keep money back from his generous gifts to cover expenses
  2. Do an online shop for his to arrive when you do

FFS would you be this petty if he was your own dad? You are literally looking for reasons to fall out over nothing

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:12

maybe try and show
a little human kindness.

I really do. We visit him. I cook his favourite meals and stock his freezer with my best attempt at the scones his wife used to make. We go out when he wants to and where he wants to. We play old-fashioned board games with him, I get him a present at his birthday and xmas and we prioritise visiting him at half terms over doing something more exciting for us and we do all of that without complaining. But you think I'm not showing human kindness when he says 'I'll sponsor you £50 for that run OH. I'm glad you chose cancer research as the charity as that's what we lost your sister to' and then doesn't reimburse the £50 we put in on his behalf. I think you and I must have different ideas about what human kindness means.

OP posts:
justasking111 · 30/10/2019 22:12

My son took a Tesco shop from Wales to Italy for a friend. You need a cool box that plugs into the cigarette lighter to keep things cool. They work really well.

www.halfords.com/camping-leisure/camping/coolboxes

LEELULUMPKIN · 30/10/2019 22:13

YABU. The fact that you've been weighing up that he has approx 300k in the bank tells me all I need to know about you OP.

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:16

I think you’ve worked it out yourself with the (new to us) info about his granddaughter and the old bathroom. I suspect you’ve just made the connection too

Thinking about it here has made me realise just what level of anger I feel towards him for the opportunities he denied his wife. None of it was financially driven. They 'looked' for 20 years for a new home and he sabotaged every potential move. But it was not because of the money. It's because he didn't really want to move and didn't stop to think about his wife's needs and desires. There are many such stories. I'm not witholding them or drip feeding but they were married for 48 years so there are many examples of his selfish behaviour - mainly small stuff. Sometimes bigger. I can't state them all here! I can think more about how these feeling are clouding my thinking now.

OP posts:
LEELULUMPKIN · 30/10/2019 22:17

Here we go................

Original poster
73Sunglasslover · 30/10/2019 22:17

YABU. The fact that you've been weighing up that he has approx 300k in the bank tells me all I need to know about you OP.

I know because OH helped him sort out finances when his wife died. It really doesn't tell you anything more than that. Why would you think that knowing this means I'm after it or something?

OP posts:
MaeveDidIt · 30/10/2019 22:17

YABVU
You come across as a real penny pinching taker, and it's very unattractive.

He is family for gods sake - put your mental spreadsheet away.
Why don't you do something nice and get an online shop in for him.
Stop focussing on me me me all the time.

walkinwar · 30/10/2019 22:21

I don't understand the negativity towards you OP, I see it regularly on hear whenever largish sums of money are involved and I think it comes down to jealousy on their part. I get not feeling welcome based on the food/milk issue but having an elderly father who lived on his own for many ways I can say it won't change unless you DH prompts him. And as it frustrates you perhaps he should. I do however think your being awkward about taking food in a cooler box!

Majorcollywobble · 30/10/2019 22:23

YABU
On the one hand you say he’s generous at Christmas to the tune of giving you £1000 each . On the other you are irritated that he never buys in milk or bread before you visit .
The DIY jobs can’t involve huge amounts of money - he perhaps reckons you won’t resent a few pounds here and there . A thousand pounds each really is pretty generous even if a small part of it he “owes” you .

MaeveDidIt · 30/10/2019 22:23

... and presumably you and your DH will one day gain financially on his passing and you're quibbling - shame on you.

Ariela · 30/10/2019 22:23

I get you don't want to travel with a weekend's food in the car - so arrange a food delivery in consultation with FIL so he knows and is in to receive it of all the food you'll eat on top of his normal supplies.

If you're canny, you can take advantage of the discounts new shoppers receive (use a different email to your usual online shopping one when you sign up)