A womans assurance that she is using contraception.

[perkypink]

I'm not too sure how to title this.

A man and a woman enter into an adult consensual sexual relationship. The woman assures the man that she is using contraception (whether or not this is being used correctly is a different matter) and is happy to have sex without a condom (whether this is explicitly expressed or not). It is assumed when they have consensual sex and a condom is not used. A woman falls pregnant.

I don't understand why when the woman falls pregnant and the man wants to absolve his parental responsibility does the calls of 'was he using a condom' start. No - he wasn't using a condom because there was an assurance that contraception was being used and you were happy without using a condom.

When you are having that initial conversation about contraception and a woman assures a man she is using contraception and is happy without using a condom I feel the shouts blame on the man after when he doesn't want to be a father is sometimes unfair when he has acted on the word of the woman.

I am really interested to hear other peoples thoughts on the matter. Should there be better sex ed and should boys be told never to trust anybodys word on whether they are using contraception?

Oh and PIV sex is vastly overrated anyway. There are a LOT more fun ways to get your rocks off. No condom needed.

the perfect use rate for the contraceptive pill is 99.7%. But that is perfect use, one missed pill, one sickness bug , some that need taking in the same 3 hour window every day. These are all things that can easily happen. These take it down to 91%.

No one is perfect no one is infallible and the man needs to accept his part in it rather than absolve himself. He chose the pleasure of not using a condom

Everybody should know the failure rates of contraception (anyone remember the scene in Friends with Ross and the condom). Abstinence is the only 100% fully effective contraception.

Yes, boys should be taught not to trust women when it ćomes to contraception. Mistakes can be made unintentionally or lies can be told, so boys/men should protect themselves. They don't have the second chance that abortion provides to women, their mistakes don't come with a choice of consequences.

If anyone, man or woman, doesn't want to risk pregnancy, they need to be responsible for their own contraception.

In a long term relationship I think I would only ditch condoms if I knew there was LARC in place. (long acting reversible contraception)

I don't want to have any more babies so I take the pill and have a copper coil also.

Is this for your research ?? Or a real life ethical dilemma??
If I man doesn’t want to father a child he should take care of his own responsibility to ensure he gets his wish. Condom or vasectomy.
I do not believe any man is genuinely oblivious to the “entrapment” possibility you mention.

I teach Sex Ed. I teach that tbe only way a boy can ensure he doesn't become a father is to use a condom and use it properly. Once a girl becomes pregnant he has no rights over her body at all. No-one ever got hurt from a man taking responsibility for contraception.

If a man was to assure the woman that he was using a condom for penetration, and it was then removed during sex without the woman's knowledge, it would be rape.

Not in the UK it wouldn't as there have not yet been any prosecutions for "stealthing" however you could argue the case for it being sexual assault as the woman has consented to a covered penis (to protect against pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections) but did not consent to a unconvered one and was left at risk of physical harm via pregnancy or STI or both.

if the father "isn't keen" to procreate he should wear a condom. it's not complicated.

I never, ever want another child, so I make sure that is not possible. It’s my responsibility and I wouldn’t expect or trust my wish to anyone else.
Hoping a women takes care of contraception (or not) is no excuse ever.

Short term relationships then absolutely men should use condoms. Long term is different for me. There's an element of trust there and I have sympathy for those who are deceived.

People lie to each other. If you trust someone else, you still bear the consequences of your own actions.

If I lend you ten thousand pounds and you swear you'll pay it back, if you don't, I've still lost the money.

If I say I'm on the pill and I'm not, I'm still pregnant. And you're still half of that pregnancy, and you still have a responsibility towards that child.

Having sex leads to babies. If a man wants to avoid that risk 100%, then he should wear a condom or abstain.

This is what I have drummed into my DS.

I think it’s just that men don’t have that same terror about pregnancy (most) young women do.

Of course they don’t- it doesn’t affect them anywhere near as much. They can literally walk away once they’ve ejaculated and never be affected by the consequences ever again.

Woman uses contraception, man doesn't, it fails, and he should be able to absolve himself of all responsibility?

I'm not quite following your logic, OP.

"We are speaking about entrapment. Contraception being misused to purposely get pregnant

Is this really a thing? "

@InTheFrightGardenTonight there was actually a recent thread where a woman who knew her DH didn't want any more kids and deliberately didn't take her pill and got pregnant.

You have sex you have the potential to create a baby.

Don’t want a baby, wear a condom.

@Ginger1982 if the husband didn't want to have another baby he should have had a vasectomy

I tell my son to never ever take a woman’s word for it.

Having said that, if a child is created, even if it is by the mother lying, then it is both the parents responsibility and the man, as he cannot choose to have an abortion, has to immediately take that on board. If he wants to not wear a condom and the woman says it’s fine she’s on contraception - it is in that moment that he is handing over his consent for a possible child. Indeed, even if he does use a condom there is the chance it will fail.

Women have many other things that they also cannot change, they have to carry the baby, have to put their lives on the line giving birth etc - and if they leave contraception to the man and he does not put the condom on properly and she gets pregnant, she is also handing over the responsibility.

We are speaking about entrapment. Contraception being misused to purposely get pregnant.

That wasn’t clear at all in either your OP or the post I quoted.

So, I have done some research. There was a case in Canada where a woman told her partner that she was on the pill. It ended up she was not taking the pill.

He tried to sue her for fraudulent misrepresentation. The court found that, 'he accepted the risk of pregnancy that exists when a sexual partner is on the pill (0.3%), (but not the risk of pregnancy if she was not taking any contraceptives)'

Interesting. I do agree with a lot of the opinions on the thread and it's great to see other perspectives!
I thought before that those assurances should stand for more than what they did. A man should responsible for his contraception and if you choose to take the risk then shame on you. I suppose there will always be cases like the one I mentioned when there is entrapment but, you need to look after yourself and use condoms.

"You have sex you have the potential to create a baby."

Depends on the type of sex. It's not all PIV.

So, what is your AIBU question?

@Jennifer2r so it's ok for a woman to purposefully lie then?

@IWorkAtTheCheescakeFactory In the post you quoted the poster explicitly mentioned entrapment.

Anyone who doesn't want a child should use their own contraception. If you are male and you don't want a child it is your responsibility to wear a condom. This is what I will be teaching my DS.

If you are female and you don't want a child, don't just rely on condoms. Use them as well but use another form of contraception too.

We all need to take responsibility for our own selves in these situations.