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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask a lady to stop volunteering?

306 replies

Mumofone1862 · 15/10/2019 09:11

I run a non profit playgroup and for the past month I have had a new volunteer.

There are a few issues- on several occasions I have been talking to mums about something they have asked me about and the woman cuts in to tell a story about herself and it's like she is trying to cut the mum out of the conversation and just talk to me.

As volunteers the main thing is to just welcome new mums and make sure they are happy ect. But two mums have come to me because she doesn't listen when they ask her not to take their children or tell them what to do with their child.

This is the same with my child, he cries whenever she comes near him as he knows she will pick him up. I told her atleaat 4 times last week not to pick him up but she doesn't listen. In the end it means I have to carry him around as he is scared which makes running a group alot harder.

One woman has stopped coming as the volunteer is so 'in your face', you can politely end a conversation and walk away and she will follow you.

I set up a playgroup as I hated being left out at playgroups and by following me around and talking over the mums it isn't a great environment.

I understand she probably just wants to be my friend but I want to talk to everyone and as volunteers we should be talking to different people to help everyone feel welcome.

She doesn't help set up or put away, her idea of helping is looking after my son, but he honestly was better before she came. I have politely said multiple times for her to not go near my son. I explained he is a mummy's boy and doesn't like strangers so is better left alone or with me but she ignores me as though she knows best.

She is in her late 60's and has said she is lonley as her child has grown up, but the last two weeks I've barely made enough to run the group whereas before her I was doubling the money and we were able to do really fun crafts and have lots of fruit for the children rather than just bananas!

The fact multiple people have come to me makes me think more people think the same but are being polite.

Should I ask her to leave? My husband said to ask her to do kitchen duties (tea/coffee ect) but I don't know how I would go about it as I already have a specific volunteer to make drinks who is happy as they are and it would be obvious I was trying to push her out? I could just be honest but she seems very emotional (e.g. almost crying when my son doesn't want her to hold him)

OP posts:
CarWreck · 16/10/2019 12:19

It’s also the law that volunteers whose duties involve specific contact with children must undergo an enhanced DBS Check.

I had assumed just being in a room wasn't "specific contact with children" but I could be wrong!

Waspnest · 16/10/2019 12:48

OP if you've lost loads of parents because of her just within a month I think you need to deal with the issue now or your group will go down the pan. (The DBS thing is an important side issue IMO.) Your set up sounds similar to ones that I attended (and helped run) when DD was young and the thing is, I went there partly to just get out of the house and partly to make friends with other mums. If some of the mums that I got on with stopped going I would have probably also stopped going - we would have found another group or started going round each others houses.

I do feel sorry for you, I think you've been put in an awkward position but if you really value your group you've got to step up and deal with the issue properly.

ReanimatedSGB · 16/10/2019 13:03

Look, volunteers are not employees. You do not have a duty of care to a fucking nuisance who is spoiling the group for the people it's actually supposed to benefit. Just contact this woman eg by phone and say 'I'm afraid this situation is not working out for us, we don't need you to volunteer any more, please do not come back.'
I sometimes think it's a pity more employers can't just pay off incompetent or unpleasant staff: having to go through the procedures can mean a tiresome person carries on causing trouble for weeks or months...

Original poster
Mumofone1862 · 16/10/2019 13:06

I will definitely bring up the DBS check, I think maybe until it is sorted I should run the group alone as I have all relevant certificates and am able to run it alone so it won't really affect me (apart from less stress) if I go it alone!

I don't want to give people the impression she is 'creepy', the way she is with the children is more that she wants a cuddle and to make them happy, not realising they are only unhappy becuase she has taken them from their parents/playzone!

OP posts:
lyralalala · 16/10/2019 13:18

I honestly would prefer no volunteers as I can do everything quicker alone, but everyone wants to help (hinder).

You need to set up proper duties for volunteers. They’re not staff but you need to set it up properly as if they are.

Regarding the DBS - speak to them and they’ll tell you if she needs one. The fact a lot of people have them doesn’t actually tell you anything; lots of places (specially schools) apply for them for people that they actually shouldn’t. If the parents are there then she probably doesn’t need one, unless you have vulnerable parents.

However, that’s something you need to know. You shouldn’t be having people helping out if you don’t know what rules you should be following. Any issues will fall on your head (I’m chair of a voluntary run child care place so I get the stress you have, but you need to protect yourself)

Userzzzzz · 16/10/2019 14:37

this:

“ she wants a cuddle and to make them happy, not realising they are only unhappy becuase she has taken them from their parents/playzone”

Combined with no dbs or references is asking for trouble!

SnuggyBuggy · 16/10/2019 14:43

It sounds like you could be on thin ice if a parent complains. The relevance of the age here is that at 60 this is likely to be very ingrained behaviour that she can't change and if she was going to pick up social skills she'd have done so years ago.

lyralalala · 16/10/2019 14:44

Combined with no dbs or references is asking for trouble!

Behaving inappropriately with the children is asking for trouble DBS or not. DBS isn’t a safety cloak. If the woman doesn’t respect the boundaries of the children (or doesn’t understand them) then it’s an issue regardless of what her DBS says on the day it’s printed

lyralalala · 16/10/2019 14:47

Also OP, if she’s working under your care and has issues then you have a duty of care toward her. If she’s putting herself in a vulnerable position with cuddling and lifting the children then you must tell her to stop.

One of the first things we tell all our volunteers is that the rules around not being alone with children are actually as much for their protection as they are for the children. People’s reputations, and life, can be ruined by an accusation of impropriety because even if they are innocent there is always the whole “there’s no smoke without fire” and “better safe than sorry”.

Userzzzzz · 16/10/2019 14:51

lyralalala I agree the dbs isn’t a safety blanket. I was more just thinking about potential liability for the OP if someone complains and there hasn’t been any sort of checking.

It’s a long time ago now but my university wouldn’t let anyone volunteer with children unless they had a crb, safeguarding training, first aid training and a training session on appropriate behaviour.

AthollPlace · 16/10/2019 16:57

she wants a cuddle and to make them happy
Wanting to touch children for her own gratification is not ok. She’s supposed to be supporting the playgroup not fulfilling her own need to touch vulnerable minors against their wishes. The mere fact she wants to cuddle them is exactly why she shouldn’t be in a position where she can do so.

mrshousty · 16/10/2019 17:27

I would have a chat with her and tell her pretty much what we have. I'm afraid that the older generation are a bit too set in their ways and will always think they know.best without keeping an open mind. She might be better looking into volunteering with the elderly as a companion

Lillyringlet · 16/10/2019 17:38

If you are in Brighton I might know who you are talking about...

There was a volunteer just like that. She gave dangerous advice, talked over parents (and this was a under 9 months group so new mums), was a bit (very) sexist, and poor off so many people going.

Three of us complained as it was awful. Never found out what happened as my little girl moved up to the next group.

There are rules when "it isn't a good fit" works. It isn't so don't let her volunteer anymore.

Also thank you for running a group.

Hunstanton · 16/10/2019 17:41

OP you have a real conundrum on your hands here, and i agree that your best direction is to speak to the organisation who introduced her to you.

I am also of the opinion that you won't 'change' her behaviours as most people, even a lot younger, are fairly entrenched when it comes to instinctive behavioural responses. And her instincts around these toddlers and their mums just sounds off.

If you do go down the DBS route, what if she arms herself with one pretty quickly, then comes back into her post? It will only provide a short term solution.

mummy1234321 · 16/10/2019 17:55

I wouldn’t worry about offending her.
I’m volunteering in a completely different setting for people with sensitive health issues. It is always said that you have to be very careful in what you say and what you do. You can’t keep going round upsetting people and if someone complains it means you are ‘not a match’.
That’s the way it works here, it doesn’t matter you do it for free. I think it’s very good and person in charge sets her expectations from the start.

lyralalala · 16/10/2019 17:55

It’s a long time ago now but my university wouldn’t let anyone volunteer with children unless they had a crb, safeguarding training, first aid training and a training session on appropriate behaviour.

There’s been a, long over due, bit of a crackdown on unnecessary DBS checks thankfully.

Partly because too many of them needing done slows the system, but also because they seem to be seen by many as a guarantee that a person is ok.

A school local to us has been grumbling that they have been told to stop checking every parent that goes on a trip and occasionally goes in to read with kids (under full supervision of the teacher). There are so many misconceptions now about who should and shouldn’t be checked that many places just check absolutely everyone

mummy1234321 · 16/10/2019 17:59

And yes I have enhanced DBS, safeguarding lvl2 training and long record of working professionally with people I volunteer for...
Don’t settle with anyone you are not happy with x

Aunaturalmama · 16/10/2019 18:17

I would ask her to leave as multiple people have expressed discomfort and she doesn’t seem in the right mind to understand boundaries. Which is quite scary for children. As the playgroup creator I feel it’s your job to keep the kids comfortable

Aunaturalmama · 16/10/2019 18:19

After reading comments...could this lady be a predator?

Deminism · 16/10/2019 18:37

When it comes to kids and instinct if she feels wrong then I would just tell her it isn’t working out. Horrible to do though - I am crap at this kind of confrontation.

snoopiij · 16/10/2019 18:41

get rid asap!!! people like that will not stop until they are running the place been there got the tee shirt!!! it's not for you to sort out that she is lonely think why she is? this won't be a new thing this is her as she is!! I am 66 so been around long enough to know how people act, you have seen the facts you owe her nothing whether she volunteers or not!! she is dangerous not only to your business but to the kids, she will be of the thought kids do as I say not at they want to do, we live in a different world to when she had kids and smacking was acceptable, I am not saying she will but she has already prover it's her way or no way!!! you will be sorry in a few weeks if you don't get rid now!!! things will be so much worse!!! good luck she sounds terrible

Thehappygardener · 16/10/2019 18:42

In my view, it feels as though you would be wise to gently ask her to leave before she does more damage, it’s difficult to see how she can change enough to fit into your playgroup. There may (or may not) be other, more appropriate volunteering roles for her, elsewhere. Please remember that her future volunteering is not your responsibility.

Age isn’t the issue here, some older people are far more empathic and thoughtful than some younger people. What matters is her personality and her expectations of what SHE wants to do in YOUR playgroup.

When I was a student Health Visitor many years ago, there were two female volunteers who weighed the babies in our clinic. But they were bossy, opinionated and often patronising with the mothers. After three weeks of working with them, and gently talking to them, only to be completely ignored, I asked for them to have training or be moved to another volunteering role but was told by my manager that they were ‘indispensable’. In my view, they were completely inappropriate as they were upsetting vulnerable parents, some of whom did not return. I moved as part of my training, and I didn’t find out what happened but I do hope that they are not still there.

I very much hope it goes well, you’ve had a lot of advice here and I am sure you’ll reach a kind and thoughtful decision 🌺

thisisthend · 16/10/2019 18:52

I would suggest that you explain that there are regulations with working with children that have only recently come in and now apply to your group, such as suitable childcare qualifications, dbs checks and she just does not meet criteria any longer. Lots of student playworkers/social workers may want to try out for the post, and explain to her that the criteria has changed. That way, she won't feel that it is personal.

B9ddy · 16/10/2019 18:52

I agree with you husband ...
Don't reject this lonely well meaning woman
Give her a 'special' job to make her feel wanted

MuseumOfYou · 16/10/2019 18:52

The relevance of the age here is that at 60 this is likely to be very ingrained behaviour that she can't change

Aside from the original question, I am not that far off 60 and I'm a bit horrified that this might the way I am viewed.

There are plenty of us that still love learning and developing. We're not fossils yet.