To let you know that Flora

[GladAllOver]

isn't the only product made by Upfield.
You might want to be aware of some others:

Upfield's notable brands include Flora, Stork, I Can't Believe It's Not Butter, Rama, Country Crock, Becel, and Blue Band.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upfield_(company)

Just here to say...WANTING TO PROTECT WOMENS RIGHT DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY MEAN ANTI TRANS.

Again.
Morons

Thank you and goodnight.

*i apologies for the morons comment

Thankfully I'm pro trans rights so I'll add them all to the shopping list!

What are trans rights?

If vegan, why not use olive oil or other oils or tahini or other nut butter?

How is nut butter in your sarnies comparable to margarine though?
I mean, I love nut butters and olive oil, but either of them in a sandwich would be a bit weird!
Nut butter together with lettuce and tomatoes, anyone? No thankyou
I want a butter alternative and marg to me is

WotchaTalkinBoutWillis
I have never seen an example of discussion going too far on here. I see knowledge and humour and rigorous questions. Admittedly frustration arises because the trans advocates will never debate. They'll make a bland assertion of transphobia and then fail to substantiate it. You must be aware that Mumsnet is one of the few places that this can be discussed and you must be aware of how transactivists have intimidated people? If a cause is just it stands on its merits not by silencing debate.

Just here to say...WANTING TO PROTECT WOMENS RIGHT DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY MEAN ANTI TRANS.

HAS ANYBODY SAID THAT WANTING TO PROTECT WOMEN'S RIGHTS AUTOMATICALLY MEANS ANTI TRANS THOUGH?
I KNOW I HAVEN'T.
HAVEN'T SEEN ANYONE ELSE SAYING THAT ON THIS THREAD EITHER?
NOTHING WRONG WITH WANTING TO PROTECT WOMEN'S RIGHTS, THEY'RE IMPORTANT TOO DOESN'T MEAN WE ALL REJECT WOMEN'S RIGHTS JUST WE'RE NOT OK WITH SOME OF THE STUFF WE SEE ON HERE.

Was just following tone, and also can manage it without doing an insult

It will backfire once the shareholders see the profits drop. It’s mainly women who manage the household budgets and do the shopping. And it’s mainly men who run these big advertising budgets. In this age of going back to nature and eating wholesome healthy food flora and it’s company are on the way out anyway.

Why are you here then @WotchaTalkinBoutWillis? Honestly. If you think MN is so awful you should probably find another website. It seems very odd that there is a plethora of posters saying that they hate MN because people post opinions they don't like.

Do you apply the same rule if Facebook and Twitter too?

If not, and you're looking for a really tighter moderated board, I hear that netmums doesn't allow much in the way of opinions or debate so maybe you'd be happier there?

Kudos to Flora

I don't understand why someone would admire a company for not giving money to MN when they themselves are helping MN financially by frequenting the site.

If you felt that strongly, you wouldn't be here.

@Beansandcoffee MN really doesn't have the sway to overthrow an multi-million pound business. I literally couldn't care less if a product I buy is 'MN approved'.

HAS ANYBODY SAID THAT WANTING TO PROTECT WOMEN'S RIGHTS AUTOMATICALLY MEANS ANTI TRANS THOUGH?

The two are often conflated though. The default mantra for trans-activism is "no debate". Literally, they don't want people to even discuss this.

And if you think that's hysteria, then look at the reaction to the two whistleblowers from GIDS who have resigned specifically because of concerns about the speed kids are pushed through treatment. Treatment which has life changing and life long consequences.

I don't believe that there is such as a thing as a boy brain or a girl brain. I don't believe that people can be 'born in the wrong body'. I don't believe it's possible for human beings to change sex. I respect the right of anyone to dress as they want, call themselves whatever name they wish, and to enjoy legal protections to prevent harassment, violence and to protect their access to services.

I campaign strongly for women's rights now, in the same way that I have campaigned strongly all my life for the repeal of section 28, for equal marriage rights, for trans people to have access to services and live free from violence and fear. I've signed petitions, donated, volunteered, marched at protests, marched at Pride (back when it was a political protest event) and stood shoulder to shoulder with LGBT people. And there are lots of others like me. We are not "anti trans" and to dismiss us as such is lazy.

Admittedly frustration arises because the trans advocates will never debate.

I do.
Or should I say have. (I'm not anymore, learnt from experience)
I've seen a few others do so as well.
People DO discuss. It's the handful of handcore so called "GC" posters who ensure that you're never going to get a respectful debate as they make it crystal clear they don't want one.
Which is apparent when they get someone to "bite" by pretending to be interested and then turning the discussion to shit by acting like they're 5 years old.
What gives it an extra air of complicatedness (is that a word? it is now lol) is they're afforded a God like complex from other posters, don't ever question them, they are the all knowing.....
it's all completely messed up.

Loving the notion that a massive multinational took the word of one tweet from one person and decided to just go along with it.

“they have withdrawn advertising from MN on the say so of Mimmymum ...... who says MN is all transphobic.”

Cos that’s exactly how it works. Not.

Can people stop slagging off butter substitutes? My son is dairy-free and I use stuff like Pure for baking sponges.

Great post, ferret. I have to admit to blind wokeness maybe a year ago and used to roll my eyes at anything to do with trans topics in active chat. I had to

I don't understand why someone would admire a company for not giving money to MN when they themselves are helping MN financially by frequenting the site

Not aimed at me but I can answer from my perspective - I can admire their principled stance, they don't want to associate themselves with MN when they see transphobia on here, which is fair enough.
On the other hand I don't want MN to lose advertising as I've been an active member for absolute years and am a bit too addicted but I'm not liking what some are turning it into.

“Admittedly frustration arises because the trans advocates will never debate.”

FWR is openly hostile to anyone who even slightly resembles a trans advocate.

You get troll hunted, insulted, undermined, name called, sniped at and literally told to leave and that you are not welcome.

The longer you persist in trying to be present in the discussion the more the attacks are ramped up. If that doesn’t see you off, you get the ignore treatment, or recipes, or grey rock.

Protest at your treatment and you get told it’s only to be expected, and completely justifiable, because “there are so many TRAs and MRAs invading the board”.

It has been going on for years now, and it’s getting worse and worse.

Posted too soon!
I had to click on a thread about men being allowed into women's prisons before I realised that something major was wrong. Thanks to the clever, questioning, tenacious women of FWR for their efforts to keep basic rights and safe spaces for women and girls.

No, Jason, most liberal minded people are pro trans rights. Opposing women's right to speak on sex based protections is not liberal, nor genuinely helpful to transsexuals.

Can people stop slagging off butter substitutes? My son is dairy-free and I use stuff like Pure for baking sponges

Same, butter substitutes are ace - I can't eat as intolerant to milk and I'd have incredible stomach ache if I switched permanently to "proper butter"
Also a vegan in the household so to us the butter substitutes rock!!

How is fake food better for the environment and animal welfare? Even vegan food grown naturally requires the death of animals. So unless you grow food artificially in factories, which basically disconnects us from the environment anyway you are deluded if you think it helps nature.

Also, it's not margarine. Does no one remember Stephen Fry saying on QI that there is no margarine on sale in the UK?!

If you went to the shops and could not get butter, you cannot get margarine instead, because it is not sold in Britain. The UK Spreads Association, formerly the Margarine and Spreads Association claim that there is currently no margarine on sale in Britain. Margarine contains between 80-90% fat and is white in colour. In the USA, 19th Century dairy lobbies, in particular the powerful ones in states like New Hampshire demanded that margarine should not be coloured yellow and, in some places, managed to insist it should be coloured red to put people off buying it.

@JasonPollack; why are you against women's right to their own space?
As Flora is obviously a misogynistic brand, I'm very happy to boycott it and spread the word.