circumcision ... to be conflicted

[Forallyouknow]

Come from a culture where you have a boy = you get it done. Never paid much attention to it until - predictably - had a boy. Had a traumatic birth where baby nearly didn’t make it- he is well now. Literally as soon as he was home I’ve been pestered from every relative / acquaintance when we are having it done- they want a party where they give money to the child. I can’t bear to put him through intentional pain but it seems it’s a case of when rather than if... I don’t know anyone from the same culture who wouldn’t do it ( even the young ones) whilst I don’t mind going against the grain there’s a part of me that thinks we should- I don’t know why other than it’s just assumed you do it. Feel very conflicted over the whole thing. Unfortunately because it is normally celebrated with a big party everyone knows whether you have had it done or not so my plan to just hope no one notices whilst I decide hasn’t worked. Guess more wondering what others think of it than aibu...

The pressure to conform to this is insane. I experienced it enormous. My uncle still isn't speaking to me and my son is now Nearly 13. The rest took nearly a year to get over it. It caused enormous drama in my family and a lot of stress.

I'm not as devout as a lot of my family and I am just expected to be different now but as you can see it's taken a long time. I divorced - major drama, I married a non Jew and am having his child - major drama.

It's exhausting so I sympathise with the OP. It's a big deal in the community and it's hard work going against it.

Your son is two!? Christ how do you even begin to explain that to them? At two!? Or do you just take them and have it done without explaining and leave them terrified and confused, in pain and wondering what they did wrong?

Myimaginarycathasfleas

Posters have said that if its medical fine, but frankly if its cultural or religious then its barbaric.

If they posters don't like being called barbaric they shouldn't have done it.

I agree the practice is barbaric.

I don't agree that a child who has been circumcised should be labelled as mutilated.

Absolutely no way would I have my son subject to that procedure to appease my family on the basis of cultural norms.

My DS is almost 2 and I know without a shadow of a doubt that he would be utterly inconsolable and frightened waking up confused and in pain.

It's illegal to smack a child's bum in this country (rightly so may I add) but it's legal to cut parts off their body without their consent and understanding.

It's an evil practice.

Thank you and to the others who have some understanding of the pressure and have shared your own experiences- it’s been nice to read posts from members of the Jewish and Muslim faith who have bucked the trend - I didn’t think you existed!

Admittedly I’m not from a religious background but I have a baby boy and I cannot fathom how mothers can watch their babies being hurt and sliced intentionally. Even if I was persuaded to go ahead with it, when it came to it I think you’d have to hold me back from assaulting whoever was holding the blade.

I wonder if doctors in the US would be so pro circumcision if they weren't able to charge for it..........

You have to pay in the UK too, there’s no way the NHS will cover the cost of a non-medical circumcision these days

A party to celebrate cutting off a piece of your sons genitals......

Trust your instincts OP

It's even worse than that when you look at the facts. It's a group of mature adults making plans between themselves to offer to pay a significant amount of money in exchange for the fulfillment of their deep-seated desire for a vulnerable toddler to have his genitals permanently damaged. In the expectation that they will be successful in their attempts to coerce and gaslight the child's parents into making their proposed transaction a reality, once the deed has been confirmed (maybe proven, I don't know), this will make them so very happy that they're intending to throw a party to celebrate it.

Somebody will be on here soon to call me ridiculous and describing this as absurd hyperbole, but if you read it through and actually think about it logically....

We grew up in a country where it was common. My mum worked as a midwife and had to help out with newborn circumcisions. I know it’s different everywhere but this was a private hospitals where the babies were taken away and then returned once they’d been calmed down and dressed. It still haunts her, she says every parent should have been made to watch.

My husband was done (routine in Australia in the 70s) and there was never a question of our sons going through it unless medically necessary.

Things don’t change unless we change them. I know it’s hard and you’ll feel the pressure from family and friends. The difference is that it’s not your responsibility to protect them from anything (feeling sad etc). It is your job to protect your son. Nothing would get in the way of me fulfilling that. I wish you luck, whatever you decide and congratulations!

Historically, in China (it may still happen, for all we know), there was a widespread belief that women's feet should be tightly bound in order to look 'pretty, and not 'too big' or 'unfeminine'.

Practitioners would start young, so as to be able to manipulate the developing foot into growing into the required deformity and to make sure that a natural foot size and shape wouldn't be allowed to develop.

On the negative side, this invariably caused lifelong pain and serious health issues for the woman, frequently including the inability to walk without great pain and difficulty if able to walk at all.

On the 'positive' side, it meant that all of the women had similar-looking feet (and the same disabilities), so everybody could console themselves with the fact that they wouldn't stand out or look 'odd' when compared to the rest.

Strangely enough, it wasn't the practice to perform this service on boys/men, because, erm, er, well,,,, maybe deformed, rolled-up, ingrown feet only looked pretty on women, eh?

Not wanting to suggest that we be intolerant of sincerely-regarded cultural practices, though....

Definition:

Mutilation or maiming (from the Latin: mutilus) is cutting off or injury to a body part of a person so that the part of the body is permanently damaged, detached or disfigured.[1]

Sounds pretty accurate to me 🤔

are you going to go in and get your genitals mutilated at the same time?

Or shall we ask someone else to make that decision for you as that's good enough for your son, right?

I feel so strongly about this. The mutilation of any child's generals regardless of culture or tradition is wrong. It's about time laws changed. A Male friend was circumcised in adulthood and said the pain was immense with pain peeing afterward. Why oh why on Gods green earth would even consider it ?

I totally agree with those who have said this is wrong other than for medical reasons.

Assuming you won't have it done in a hospital under anaesthetic have you even considered how incredibly traumatic this will be to your child, and how difficult he'll find it to ever trust you again when you've willingly handed him over to have this done??

Can we also just recognise that a medical circumcision is procedurally very different from a religious one. My in laws booked a man to come to my house and perform this “operation” in my own kitchen. As I’ve said before I did not give in. The whole process contributed to my postpartum depression as they insisted he should be 5 weeks old. He hadn’t gained back his birth weight by that point, I am pretty sure the shock (or the potential sepsis) would have killed my son.

A medical procedure is entirely different and handled by professionals in a sterile environment where they are considerate of the child’s dignity and pain.

That is why the world multilation is being used. A medical circumcision is a necessary operation and no one should feel shame for it. Chopping off part of your child in the kitchen because your family told you to... well you have to look hard af yourself if you allow that.

Why would you butcher your son and risk death, infection or malformation?

Babies bleed out. Babies have extra pieces accidentally sliced off which effect sexual function.

It's primitive and vile. Would you perform FGM on your daughter? That's what you're considering.

Dry strange that your family is so interested in your babies penis

Its amazing how all the Jewish families I work with are all pro and it doesnt matter how liberal they are. Its very rare in my work that they will name the boy before the seven days. Out of at least one hundred Id be hard pushed to hear on one or two that arent following tradition and revealing the name. Even paediatricians are having their sons done on day 7.

Yeah, im thinking of the conversation with a small boy that goes like this...

Parent: Hey son, so you need to know that your genitals are yours and no one can touch them or do anything to them without your consent, not for any reason at all.

Son: Ok...

Son: 'Why don't I have a foreskin, my friend has a foreskin?.

Parent: Yeah, when you were too little to consent or understand, we had a guy chop that off because some religious book says so.

Son: ... the fuck?

Leave it alone, if he wants to cut his foreskin off he can decide to do that later.

I've been in a similar position OP, after a traumatic birth... Ultimately I went against tradition and didn't have it done, my then husband and extended family have never forgiven me. However, I couldn't bear to put my child through any unnecessary pain.

My son at 4 is still too young to understand but I suspect he is not going to be pleased later on in life when he has to deal with the impact of my decision and how it makes him different from every other male in his ethnic group.

Hope you make a decision you (and your son) don't regret.

I'm Jewish so understand your dilemma. I was going to say that it depends how religious you are. However, I have just noticed that your son is two. He will know exactly what is happening. I think that would be very traumatic for him so I definitely would not at this stage.

There is absolutely no medical reason to circumcise a little boy unless he has a tight foreskin. My husband was circumcised as a baby and when I asked him why he said his parents did it because it was the fashion! He is in his sixties now and sometimes his penis gets sore (don't ask me why because I can't say on here) When my son was born he suggested we got him circumcised ...well I nearly hit the roof! and nearly walked out on him clutching my baby boy! Most of the men in the USA are circumcised some because of religious beliefs and others because they think it is more hygienic and looks neater. I personally would never do this to a little boy.

What a pp said
*You can be part of the problem or part of the solution.
*
These sorts of cultural practices need abolishing. Its mutilation! Damn cruel and vile of parents to do this to a baby, without their consent and causing unnecessary pain!!