To get my 3 year old baptised in an attempt to get into a Catholic school

[nestisflown]

AIBU on two levels:

1. to want to baptise my 3 year old and start attending local mass weekly in order to get into one of the best schools in the area (and our closest school, although the next closest secular school is also an excellent one). Is this morally dubious? Or do lots of parents do the same?

1. to think that my transparent plan will work and help my child get a place even though we'll have been attending mass for less than a year by the time applications are made...and the applications want proof of "sustained weekly attendance". It doesnt define sustained though

My reasons for wanting my child to go to Catholic school are: (1.) It is a great school academically; (2) it's our closest school; (3) it's the only good faith school close to us (there's a CofE school but it's doesn't perform well academically), and as a non-Catholic but practising Christian, I'd quite like to see faith incorporated into my child's school day...even in a different denomination.

Has anyone done this? Has anyone succeeded?

Do it, I can never understand why religious discrimination is legal in this country. I APPLAUD you in undermining it.

No idea but for goodness sake don't have your child baptised unless you believe in baptism, that would be so hypocritical. Most Catholic schools take non Catholic children including Muslims and Hindus, they have to take a proportion from the wider population.

@MileyWiley why should Christians get a better education?? Are you ok??

I can’t say my children were ever traumatised by gory details. Far more bring in a tin of beans for Harvest Festival and singing ‘I’m special’.
Mine went to,the Catholic youth club just once and decided against it.
No more extracurricular stuff than other schools- Carol concert and the odd Mass but mainly teaching the National Curriculum.
Parents and children can usually choose to make their FHC in about year three. When ours did it, non Catholic friends came along and joined in the breakfast with new dresses etc.

I suspect you have no idea what a catholic school is

@DtPeabodysLoosePants I only ever went to Catholic school. I don't know what secular school is like which is why I would be amenable to Catholic school because I agree with the ethos (from my experience).

I don't have experience of an academically competitive Catholic school...mine were a bit shit on that front so all faiths were welcome.

@Derbee but you think RELIGIOUS DISCRIMINATION IS OK? You think faith kids should get access to better schools?

One of my friends neighbours baptised his son (11yrs old!) as he wanted him to go to the local RC secondary school as it’s an excellent school.

His son didn’t get offered a place.

The schools are not dumb!

[Edited by MNHQ at posters request]

My child was given a place at a catholic school despite not being baptised and we were outside the catchment area. This was due to our 3 choices being full. I'd never been to look at the school, so it was a bit of a surprise. I put her on the list to move, but after almost a year we were no further forward so I decided to keep her where she is. She is now in year 6.

Whilst I have nothing against a catholic school and should stress that this might not happen in all schools, I have to say that my child will emerge from school very narrow minded. It is a 3-18 school so she will automatically transfer into secondary there, but I I will be moving her.

My daughter has not interacted with any other races at school other than white. Other faiths are taught very quickly, almost a page on each topic and then they move on. Sex Ed is taught in science and is enough to scare anyone to death. Evolution is brushed over because god created humans. I've noticed certain elements of history, such as the Black Death, were taught solely on the basis that this happened due to god punishing people, not through the spread of diseases. The school is still trying to delay the teaching of homosexual, transgenders etc. Any teenagers in secondary who become pregnant are immediately removed from the school.

This is a top performing school in the area, and academically she has thrived. But it's been a very sheltered environment. No Halloween discos, easter is crazy with lessons being missed due to mass etc. So it might be good, but I wouldn't say it's been the best path for my child.

*You can’t just pay this lip service, it’s full on Catholicism right from the start, gory details of the crucifixion, prayers, confessions and mass plus all the associated thingS that go along with church clubs - cub leader for you etc etc?

Is this really the case? When I went to Catholic school I only went to mass during school times and never got baptised or did confirmation. I also decided not to say the prayers when I was old enough...but I loved the hymns and ceremony. Do Catholic schools expect all that extra curricular stuff these days? Don't think I could commit to that extent if that's the case.*

Yes, in my experience. Demand is very high for a good education so they expect you to toe the line and take part in everything; attending mass is recorded, expected to get confirmed, observing lent. If you aren’t committed then they will see through you, they don’t allow themselves to be ‘used’ by people ‘pretending’, they want to be able to take their pick of the genuine catholics.

I would advise against. I sent my kids to a catholic school because it was close and it was supposedly good. Kids already baptised C of E and we were church goers so it wasn't hypocritical. However I hadn't realised how narrow minded some Catholics can be. It was very full on Catholic. Very cliquey and I felt like a total outsider. Ended up being quite agnostic and the kids - now 13 and 15 -refuse to set foot in any church. Go for the secular. Wish we had!!

Half the reason Catholic schools are so good is because they are full of the DC of families that are organised enough to do stuff like the OP.

Luckily (for actual Catholics like me) the parish priests I've known are nice and do stuff like remind the congregation to get DC baptised before 6m (otherwise people might wait till overseas relatives can come) and will sign forms if you haven't been coming to mass because you've changed to weekend work shifts.

Practising Christian is taken into consideration but you’ll come lower down the tiers than Catholics.

My children go to a Catholic school and church. Their father is Catholic, I am not. If you’re going to do this you need to be aware that Catholicism will become part of your child’s everyday life. In many ways this is incredibly positive, children are taught to care about the less advantaged across the world and not just in a superficial way. There are also usually Christian refugees from Iraq, Syria and the rest of the ME. I know it sounds totally trite but they do enrich the school.

I’m not going to judge you (cos I’m a Christian ), we all do the best we can for our kids, but please make sure you’re happy with the ethos before doing.

I quite firmly believe that children with involved parents will do well wherever they go and raise standards. But my kids are at Catholic school so I have no right to tell anyone else they shouldn’t aspire to the same my kids have.

@Derbee but in what way would they be lying? I said I'm happy to attend church regularly and nod and smile. And I'm happy for them to be indoctrinated by an excellent but Catholic school, as I'd be teaching them at home to constantly question the beliefs in order to determine their own moral compass (which I think all parents should do regardless of faith background).

Calm down @Grobagsforever. Where did I say religious discrimination is ok? That’s right, I didn’t. I detest all religion and think it’s all a load of bollocks.

But if religious parents want their children to have a strong religious element to their children’s education then that’s fair enough. Pretending to be a Catholic to go to a good school, and pretending to believe in what they’re teaching your children is wrong.

I’d sooner have no religious element to any part of education, but with the current system as it is, I see nothing wrong with Catholic parents sending their children to Catholic schools.

But that’s not religious discrimination in my book, and it doesn’t offend me.

The history of catholic schools is pretty interesting. Remeber there are considerably more CofE schools

1. Is this morally dubious?. Do you really need to ask?

as a non-Catholic but practising Christian. Not sure that phrase means what you think it means.

1. to think that my transparent plan will work. I don't think most Catholic schools are as strict as gaudy's experience, but given you aren't Catholic I think it's a bit obvious.

What's this about me having to get baptised too?

Not baptised (presuming you already are), but genuinely investigating conversion would solve your issues. Plus you've never had a Eucharist if you haven't had a Catholic Eucharist- it's like full cream milk after skimmed.

alwayscauseastir it’s interesting your DD hasnt has much diversity. My DSs have classmates from a real mix of backgrounds - lots of Europeans, some Irish Traveller, and quite a lot of Muslim kids whose parents prefer a faith school to non-faith.
The Catholic schools round here can be more diverse in some ways as it’s a more ‘international‘ faith.

They would be part of a lie by only being baptised to trick the school into allowing them to attend.

Also by knowing that they suddenly starting attending church regularly purely because it served a selfish purpose to attend a school of your choice.

None of this would’ve happened if you weren’t judging by ofsted ratings, so you are creating a lie to serve yourself, and dragging your children into it

My parents lied a lot to get me into the CofE Primary school in the village 25 years ago! (best for miles around). I only got in because my Grandparents were Religious and helped a lot with the Chruch and they easily got an application sorted for me. Wow though, it was an amazing school, great memories from there. I just played along with all the religious stuff, thinking they were all made up stories.

I have my own kids now and I've heard that a huge amount of kids at that CofE school have been Christened and taken to Church and had their application signed by the Priest all for a place. I expect the same happens everywhere. That school is "Outstanding", all the results are off the charts. Apparently. I've also been told by a retired teacher not to read too much into the Ofsted ratings, so, who knows.

I didn't want my boys to go to a religious school, so they go to the next best one in the area and I'm really really happy with it, they're thriving.

Not all catholic schools Are good and the bad ones are easy to get into but OP has an excellent one so it’s going to be tough

My DS goes to a c of e school which is amazing but I am a Christian. Baffling how many parents complain about them praying or going to church I mean really!? Did consider a local Catholic school for Secondary but we are Christians.
I get it totally wanting the best for your child but paying lip service won't get you anywhere.

oh dear God in definitely not going to be running Sunday school...I disagree with lots of the Catholic beliefs and practises  I am happy to show my face and nod and smile but couldn't actively participate in the indoctrination of children in beliefs I only 50% hold.

I cannot understand how you can say this and still want to [lie and cheat to] send your child to a Catholic school.

Crack on, see where you get with it. I dont think much of your plan to undermine their belief. Sounds like you will confuse your poor kids.

Catholic school doesn't do "gory details of the crucifixion". Why do people dream this shit up?

and will sign forms if you haven't been coming to mass because you've changed to weekend work shifts.

That’s interesting. The OP isn’t actually planning on breaking the law whereas by the sound of things your priests might actually be breaking it.

@deepflatflyer and @alwayscauseastir thanks for that perspective that is really really eye opening. I guess I see Catholic education through rose tinted glasses since I was raised in fairly relaxed and inclusive Catholic schools (though the sex ed was atrocious). I would not want to inflict the experiences you both describe on my child. I'll have to visit the school and really think this through...especially since my next closest school is 0.5 miles away, also Ofsted Outstanding, and performs just well academically (so I'm lucky to have a great backup).