To get my 3 year old baptised in an attempt to get into a Catholic school

[nestisflown]

AIBU on two levels:

1. to want to baptise my 3 year old and start attending local mass weekly in order to get into one of the best schools in the area (and our closest school, although the next closest secular school is also an excellent one). Is this morally dubious? Or do lots of parents do the same?

1. to think that my transparent plan will work and help my child get a place even though we'll have been attending mass for less than a year by the time applications are made...and the applications want proof of "sustained weekly attendance". It doesnt define sustained though

My reasons for wanting my child to go to Catholic school are: (1.) It is a great school academically; (2) it's our closest school; (3) it's the only good faith school close to us (there's a CofE school but it's doesn't perform well academically), and as a non-Catholic but practising Christian, I'd quite like to see faith incorporated into my child's school day...even in a different denomination.

Has anyone done this? Has anyone succeeded?

Funnily enough Muslims and jews are allowed much more respect but Christians are fair game.

I was mulling on this earlier, because you often hear this complaint on threads like this and it makes me sad, as someone who believes in true secularism.

I reflected on my own (religiously segregated) education. There were three kinds of schools: Catholic, Protestant (various flavours) and state. The Protestant schools mixed with the Protestant schools, the Catholics with the Catholics and each of us would sometimes mix with the state schools but never with each other. I was left with the distinct impression that Catholics were other, and that they were definitely wrong and misguided. They felt the same about us. We rarely even met each other.

I do wonder if we’re being naive to expect complete understanding and integration and mutual respect if we segregate children by religion at the time of their lives they are most exposed to and expected to mix with people of different backgrounds and faiths. Your comment about Muslim children reminded me of what I was thinking earlier. Impossible to say if there’s a link, of course, and what the teacher was saying was indefensible (and i maintain should be reported).

I don’t know enough about Islam or Judaism to make informed criticism or challenge. I just know that Like any other faith I do not want them to impose on my life in any way. Which they largely don’t. It is not the same for Christianity. So if that’s what you mean by Christianity being fair game....

just know that Like any other faith I do not want them to impose on my life in any way. Which they largely don’t. It is not the same for Christianity.

How does Christianity impose on your life?
Not being goady,genuine question.

All state funded schools in the U.K are to a greater or lesser extent religious. Christians have a block vote in the House of Lords which has a direct influence on law marking. Christianity controls when shops and offices open and when many holidays happen. For a start.
Incidentally- it’s odd that you can ask that question after reading this thread!

Just wondering, because most of those things don't bother me and despite having a child in a Catholic school religion doesn't really affect my life.It's Holy Communion season atm so I'm more involved by usual but that's because I choose to be.

The only big change in my life has been stopping killing spiders because DD would freak out "they're God's creatures mummy!".

See- I don’t want my child saying that to me!
I want my child not to kill spiders because they are living things and part of nature.
Incidentally- people of faith have a choice of 30% fewer state funded schools than people without faith.....

^How does Christianity impose on your life?
Not being goady,genuine question.^

I can’t answer for Bert but mine are mostly but not all about education.

My son attends a Church of England school. This was not my choice, and I’m not thrilled about him being taught Christianity as fact and having to hide my own views so I’m not undermining the school to him. But it’s in the state sector, funded by the state, and it is the school allocated to me in the admissions process. I obviously applied to but did not get into any of the non-faith schools. This is largely because the number of faith schools taking children from further away has shrunk the non-faith catchments to a ludicrous extent, so that school provision where I live does not really match up to the number of children there are locally. We are actually really lucky to be where we are, I know people allocated to (failing undersubscribed faith) schools 30-40 minutes drive away in peak hour.

I also live in a community. I would like that community to be as cohesive and mutually tolerant as possible. I don’t believe widespread segregation by faith, relative income, ability or other social or medical characteristics contributed to that; I think it detracts from it.

I also object to clergy having seats reserved for them in the legislature, more so that the seats are reserved for clergy from one religion only.

So yes, Christianity imposes on the life of me and of my family in a way no other religion does, because it gets preferential treatment in state institutions. I have no problem with Christianity itself. I have huge issues where it is given a privileged position in state institutions over other faiths and no faith.

Yes- it’s not Christianity- it’s Christian privilege.
Which many Christians are oblivious to- and consider themselves a persecuted minority!

Entirely fair enough to both of you.
Situations and circumstances differ from one catchment area to the next, as do values,principles and opinions.

I do have to put my hand up though and admit that my views are massively influenced by the fact that my situation works for me(despite ending up in it by sheer luck) and more importantly to my daughter. That's something I need to work on.

Actually I was untruthful just there. I should have said I have no problem with other people being Christian, if they want to. As someone who used to be Christian, and now is not, I do obviously have a problem with Christianity.

And as a parent it bugs me that I do not have the option to have my son educated outside a faith that I find personally so negative, no matter how lovely and nurturing the school is otherwise (and it is a lovely school.)

“Situations and circumstances differ from one catchment area to the next”

Individual’s situations and circumstances might. The system doesn’t.

It was more in reference to Jassy's son attending a faith school when she'd rather he didn't but she doesn't have a choice.

It's not often you hear that side of the coin.

I don’t think it’s that unusual, on every thread where someone moans ‘why did you send your child to a Christian school then, just send them somewhere else!’ a number of people explain that for many, choice does not exist. Whether you’re in a village where the only school is CofE, or somewhere where there is such a concentration of faith schools that catchments become doubly screwed and some parents end up with the double whammy of being allocated a school that is both poor/unpopular and religious, despite wanting neither of those things.

It does make me very angry when people talk about their ‘right’ for the state to pay for their child to be educated in their faith and bandying about the idea of ‘choice’. Because neither of those things are available to all.

I have not read all of this thread.I did read the previous posters wh said you have to be catholic yourself, or the other parent has, before the Catholic Church will baptise your child.
This is happening more and more now as people realise that catholic schools have such good a reputation.The problem is that once the school place is obtained a great majority of these children and their parents are never seen in church again.
The reason the church insists on at least one parent being catholic is because they have to throughly understand what it is to be a catholic, not just getting into a catholic school.

Something seems to happen to Christians when they start talking about education. Previously lovely, kind, empathetic people suddenly change personality. Happens in RL as well.

Because neither of those things are available to all.

I suppose "choice" only becomes one when you have the benefit of other (good)options.

I guess I have to bow out now as my last remaining argument basically amounts to "I'm all right Jack" and it's making me pissed off ..at myself.

I guess I have to bow out now as my last remaining argument basically amounts to "I'm all right Jack" and it's making me pissed off ..at myself.

Self-awareness isn’t a bad start. It’s pretty rare on this subject.

I taught in a catholic school and you’ll have to be prepared for (obviously) an intense focus on Catholicism. Where I was we started everyday with morning prayer, had hymns etc and prayer in assembly, certain things we couldn’t teach or mention eg no mention of ghosts (eg no creative writing about certain content), some lessons geared around faith and obviously the assumption every student believes completely in God, Jesus Christ the Saviour etc.

You’ll need to expect your child to not only be a full part of that faith but not mind that sort of ‘conditioning’. Also, we were obliged to take a certain percent outside the faith and they were always outsiders. No one ever appreciated that odd child in class who scoffed at the faith when 24 other children believed completely.

Just be aware that you’re not only depriving someone who would appreciate that space due to their faith, but that you’re enrolling your child in a way of life.

Nothing wrong with cheating a system that's unfair.

I taught in a catholic school and you’ll have to be prepared for (obviously) an intense focus on Catholicism. Where I was we started everyday with morning prayer, had hymns etc and prayer in assembly, certain things we couldn’t teach or mention eg no mention of ghosts (eg no creative writing about certain content), some lessons geared around faith and obviously the assumption every student believes completely in God, Jesus Christ the Saviour etc.

I went to Catholic school - a Convent actually, decided in my early teens I was atheist and my decision was fully accepted by the school - they waited patiently for my return to the faith we had a quick prayer before each lesson - which I stood silently for, service maybe once a year with hymns - again I stood silently - I took no part. No lessons around faith - RE was more life skills philosophy, when it wasn't I went to the head of RE and requested a change of class and it was granted - as it was Ireland obviously ghosts were a very normal thing to discuss and obsess about, with priests too funnily enough especially around Halloween. At the state school my kids attended in England however any talk of Halloween was banned!