To keep on punishing my 5 year old for being silly at school

[Sunlight82]

I am an ex primary school teacher, now university in lecturer. I thought I would have this while parenting lark sewn up but I have come to the realisation that I don’t and am really floundering at the moment.

I have a 7 year old DD who is that perfect child at school - good at everything, never been in any trouble, chosen for everything, very mature etc. So I have never faced this situation before.

I also have a 5 year old DS. He is an absolutely lovely little boy in many ways. He is funny, has a great sense of humour, clever, thirsty for knowledge, kind and knows so much about the world. However, he is constantly getting into trouble at school for his silliness.

He lost so many sanctions in Reception for things like running down corridors, spinning in Hymn practice, gambolling in the middle of assembly, playing rough with the boys at playtime. Nothing malicious, all just over the top and silly.

At home he is loving, funny, gets in well with his sister. They never fight and he can play for hours with his lego without a murmur. He can sit down when I ask to practice handwriting etc. And does it beautifully.

We had big talks about it over the summer. Practiced keeping calm and not getting over excited and how he had to try really hard in Year 1.

Well things are exactly the same if not worse. We have now been summoned to see the class teacher tomorrow as he lost 10 sanctions last week. Some seem quite harsh (picking his nose) and others justified (accidentally kicking a girl up the bottom whilst pretending to be a bucking bronco).

We have been punishing him at home for losing sanction but at this point he has lost everything - no TV, no toys, dinner on his own each night, straight to bed at 6, no treats, nothing. He has nothing left to lose. We never shout and in desperation we shouted at him over the weekend. He cried himself to sleep curled up in a tiny ball. When he woke up he came into me and said ‘I’m so sorry mummy. I try to be good for you but my body just does things and I can’t stop.’

He went to school today trying so hard to be good and ended up losing another sanction. He was devastated when I picked him up and kept apologising. I really don’t know what to do. I feel so sad for him. He is not ready for the formality of school. He is still so lively and silly and immature in many ways. I have cried buckets for days as I feel like I am breaking his little spirit and I hate myself for it. But equally I don’t want him marked as the naughty boy at school who has a difficult life there and never gets chosen for anything.

In desperation I have considered home schooling him and asked him if he would prefer that tonight. But he said he loves school and would miss playing with his friends.

His dad and I have no idea what we should be doing in this situation. Please help.

Gosh the school are micro managing arent they? My ILs and to an extent DH are prone to this and TBH I find it stressful so it must make a child anxious. Nose picking! How on earth do they have time to be so petty?!
I agree with others, your DS needs to be crazy, my DD isn’t unlike this but I think she holds it in so far at school. A bit like a dog needing to be run. Set up some messy play opportunities (lots of pages on FB with ideas eg Imagination Tree, Loose Parts Play) where he can just wallow in the sheer shambolism of it all

You lost me at dinner on his own OP. Stop. For a start, he sounds like a hoot! A spirited little lad. Home should be the safe place, the place where everyone thinks you're ace and you can be yourself and let go. He can't do that at home because he feels like shit then he feels like shut at school when he makes a mistake. Massive praise for a good day, consequence story boards with crayons and hot milk to talk out the not so good ones. He's a baby.

He is already being punished at school. Stop punishments at home.
Reward him for good days. Make it ridiculously easy at first. Reward even small improvements in behavior. Don’t require perfect reports from school.

So glad you are going to try a different approach with your DS op, I understand he has to learn how to behave in a classroom and what is and isn't acceptable but he's just five
I'm another who agrees if he's punished in school for behaviour whilst there then please don't punish him at home also and eating alone is something I've never heard any parent say they do as a form of punishment for anything even teenagers
Maybe his silliness could be done at home more often as a family instead of such a grim regime and he won't feel he only has friends to be silly with whilst in school let him have half hour silly play with you guys
Maybe more fun activities after school too to get him all tired out that lets him be the five year old he is
Your DD sounds so much like my DD11 who I'm so proud of for all she achieves and works hard for and everyone refers to her as such a good girl and your DS sounds so much like my DD5 who often gets referred by others as 'the second child oh they the ones sent to test us' and ' little madam' I hear quite often but to me well she amazes me everyday with her mind and strong will and her love for life and I encourage it to no end with silly play and non conforming to how it's suppose to be done or made etc
As for the school at the end of last years assembly each child had a certificate for something or another and her award was most creative I cried the rain with joy and I love her school for encouraging her 'creativeness' 'imagination' they let her take it as far as her mind will go for some activities they are also quite lenient on how they teach her things as we find that the way the rest of the class is learning isn't necessarily the best way for DD5 some things she gets just like that where it's suppose to take days for the class to cover but she learns it and remembers it in a hour somethings she just doesn't grasp the way it's being taught so I find alternative ways for her and her teacher even finds new things for her to try and she produces amazing artwork and drawings let along the fact she's five and the school sees this too and have put her drawings up in their reception and encourage her with this 'talent' so maybe the school your DS attends really isn't the best for him and a new school would really do him a million favours

I read this in disbelief, I'd hate to be excluded from dinner with the family and I'm an adult.
There was a character in Hairspray called Penny whose mother made her wear a 'P' on her jumper so everyone would know she was 'permanently punished' which it sounds like this child is.

Glad to hear the draconian punishments at home will stop, please also advocate for him at school.

Ah poor thing. Agree you need to let school punish him & have home as his happy place.
Could he do with more exercise to run off some energy? Perhaps scoot into school last part of journey so he's had some fresh air?
It's a UK problem. In Europe they don't start formal learning until 6:7. Much better system.

‘Nothing left to lose’

Your poor little lad OP have you read your own post it’s one of the saddest things I’ve read on Mumsnet. Stop punishing him for a start.

Can people read the response from the OP before continuing to comment the same thing over and over. She said she has taken on board the first twenty odd comments advising to stop punishing him so she doesn't need a hundred more telling her how harsh it is. OP must be feeling bad enough as it is!

You need to apply the same change in thinking to yourself, too.
You thought you were doing the right thing, and now see differently. Focus on what you are going to change in the future, don’t beat yourself up about the past. It’s done. You won’t do it again.
Between you this will sort.

It sounds like he has no safe space to just be silly. So its boiling up inside and he obviously cant control it as hes so little. Take him to the park after school, chase him up round the field, laugh with him and ALLOW that silliness to flow out. He needs to Express himself, and negativity breeds more negativity. Why not ask him how he feels his day went rather than backing the teachers? Give him his safe space to just be him. I read something recently about how important it is for children to decompress after school. How they are emotional beings and are urged to control it at school hence needing to let it all out in their own space at home. Just let him be 5 and listen to him.

Your punishing a 5 year old? My god thats awful. He sounds like a normal 5 year old, please stop punishing him, absolutely shocking.

I'm glad you've seen the light so to speak but even so, you should be looking at those punishments.

They are incredibly draconian and I wouldn't use some of them on a much older child for a far worse offence than any your DS has committed.

Eating on his own?? Where on earth did you get these from? Never, ever use that one again!

I know you feel bad, but We never shout and in desperation we shouted at him over the weekend. He cried himself to sleep curled up in a tiny ball. When he woke up he came into me and said ‘I’m so sorry mummy. I try to be good for you but my body just does things and I can’t stop.’

And you didn't break then??

Yeah, keep on punishing him. It's fixed the behaviour so well, so far.

Or maybe try barking up a different tree. You're supposed to be an expert so surely you have other tools up your sleeve?

OP, you've had some very harsh comments on here, especially from all those posters who haven't bothered to RTFT.

Some of your punishments were unnecessarily draconian, but it's so obvious that you and your dh love your son and that the way you have treated him may have been misjudged but has been a result of the worry that you have felt.

As (another) primary school teacher I'd say that it's good to back up a school by talking to our dc about what has gone wrong at school, why the choices they made were poor, what they could have done instead etc.

But I would only ever punish at home for serious and intentional misbehaviour such as deliberately hurting another child.
I wouldn't punish at home for silliness. It sounds like your ds is a lovely little boy who just finds it hard to control himself. Unfortunately our stupid school system doesn't really allow children to be children.

So I’m kinda torn. OP - You sounds like you love your ds v much and are trying to do your best for him.

I would punish an older kid at home if they were disrupting other kids learning at school, because that’s selfish and damaging other kids’ futures.

A younger kid may not understand the impact they have on others. I’ve found their concentration span naturally increases as they grow. I have to work on impulse control with mine. Perhaps practice trying to calm down quickly at home when he is getting hyper would help? Breathing exercises? Perhaps explain that although hurting someone was accidental, it could be avoided by following advice not to run at high speeds with people nearby. He has to try and remember this when he plays - like he has to be careful when he is at the roadside. Maybe do little reminders about this regularly so he knows why people tell him to ‘slow down’ or stop moving immediately.

I don't think making him have his dinner on his own is an acceptable punishment. Stop doing that :(

You can RTFT and still be moved by this OP. if people have read it then they will comment.

Yes the OP has acknowledged that they were harsh and will change, but it doesn't erase that this was ever considered acceptable punishment in the first place by 2 adults.

When you look in to your young child's eyes, when they say how much they are desperately trying to please you, but they aren't good enough inside, you break then.

Not when a bunch of internet strangers tell you to get a grip of yourself.

Tomorrow morning take a pen and draw a smiling face or a heart or a star on his hand.

Tell him that whenever he sees it to remember how much you love him.

Kiss him

Kiss the picture

Send him to school with a reminder of mummy

Out of interest - how would people react if their 12 year old was doing stuff like this? I just wondered because people mentioned that they wouldn’t punish their kid at home for stuff done at school.

We have been punishing him at home for losing sanction but at this point he has lost everything - no TV, no toys, dinner on his own each night, straight to bed at 6, no treats, nothing. He has nothing left to lose. We never shout and in desperation we shouted at him over the weekend. He cried himself to sleep curled up in a tiny ball. When he woke up he came into me and said ‘I’m so sorry mummy. I try to be good for you but my body just does things and I can’t stop.’

This is one of the saddest things I've read on here. Glad you're seeing sense.

I can not believe that u were a school teacher. U are coming down far to harsh on him as is the class teacher for basically being 5. He isnt designed to sit still and pay constant attention. He clearly isnt ready to do that. At this age they still very much want to/naturally work on their gross motor skills. That's what their body tells them to do. It impulsive. Not planned deliberate disobedience. Whilst u can encourage paying attention if the intensjon span just isnt there yet u cant punish it into him. U are going to break his spirit. He will believe he is what u tell he is (a naughty boy who doesn't even deserve to with his family). What's happening here is down right cruel. He needs to go out into the world believing his mummy thinks he is great. Where is he self confidence going to be with constant rejection (ie u cant eat with me) and punishment. U/nor his current class teacher would not be the teacher for my DC. I would move schools based on your post if your little boy was mine. Teach so he can learn dont make him learn how u teacher. He clearly needs to move and be more active whilst he is so young. U need to get off his back. Your post made difficult reading. There is a good book called raising boys that explains well about confidence and gross versus fine motor skills in young boys.

How can you treat a 5 year old child this way? Shocking. If he breaks school rules let school punish, but in this case I'd say school is over the top. If this had been my child I'd have been considering whether the school was appropriate for him, no way punishing on top. Just awful. Poor, poor little boy.

He is five, jesus christ on a bike.

What the hell are you doing to him? Why are you sending him to that school?

Stop punishing him at home, what happens in school, stays in school. School aren't any better, they are punishing him for being an ordinary young boy who hasn't been at school very long. He needs nurturing & encouragement, not punishment, between you & school he is going to be turned in to a robot if you don't do something soon. Either look for a different school where he can be himself or keep on at the school he is at to change their attitudes & teaching methods. Not one size fits all children, he may find the noise in the classroom overwhelming, the number of children, bright lights, smells, his senses are working overtime, it's like a bottle of pop, keep shaking it & the top will fly off. He may be better in a different setting, smaller classes, more learning through play, more time outdoors, you say he is bright & intelligent, maybe he is too advanced for the class he is in & may benefit being in a split year class with older children. You need to find out now otherwise you could put him off learning for life.

It sounds like the school isn't the right fit for him. He'll be a lot happier when he isn't in a school bring run by control freaks.