Children should be locked up and never heard

[LittleBlueBag]

I'm a single mother and today went to a large out of town store with my toddler twins who are almost 3. Too old for the pram and eager to explore.
I was paying for an item at the till and one of the twins was looking at a mug. He touched it but it remained on the hook. The other twin was happy playing with a car from the store.
They were being loud but were excited. A staff member who must of just finished her shift and was behind me waiting to pay for an item told me the children were very naughty and we should not be allowed out in public if I can't control them. She said they're behaviour is awful and just made me feel really shitty about myself.
They are a handful and can be naughty but just normal toddler behaviour.
I must of turned my back on them for a split second. It's impossible to carry them both.
So wise mumnetters? Are my children really that bad?
I did complain to the manager but I was so ashamed.

I wish I was as good a mother as all the posters on here!

what's stopping you?

Sounds pretty normal toddler behaviour and the woman sounds rather intolerant. I think some people don't understand the dynamics of twins. It's not like having two siblings. There are studies that show they fight more because they are equal and therefore constantly push the boundaries. They also egg each other on. What you accept from them is probably a justifiable adaptation. I know there are many things I wouldn't tolerate with my first which if I had policed with my second the whole family would have had a miserable time.

Forget the judgemental, mean woman and carry on as you are.

The store person was rude but it sounds like your children need a little more control if you find it difficult when out alone with them. They need to go in a buggy really while at the shops or maybe on a harness

*I wish I was as good a mother as all the posters on here!

what's stopping you?*

Could there actually be an arsier post? What has happened to this site?

I’m a single mum to 3 year twins and a 6 year old... and shopping is a pain (for my sanity I mainly do on line shopping - but sometimes you just need one item so going to the supermarket is a necessary evil) and I have every sympathy for you OP!

I try to mainly use a double trolley when we go in - but they are often in use or the stores don’t even have any so we often have to walk while I get my couple of things. 90% of the time they are great and we have no problems, 5% they start to act up and they behave once I’ve spoken to them and the other 5% of the time they act up and don’t listen to me.

The last 5% is the times I hate shopping. Sometimes they just don’t listen! Everyone saying OP should parent better: did your children do everything you told them to first time? They have to learn, which unfortunately means there were times when my children we’re badly behaved in supermarkets regardless of what I did. And I always assumed people were judging me during these times - and now this thread has proved my assumptions to be correct.

Threads like this make me feel like a terrible mother 🙄

The thing is, it all depends on how you define bad behaviour. There are some things that are universally agreed on, sure, but there is clearly a grey area too, I always try to make sure my kids behave well... according to my definition of good behaviour. But my definition of bad behaviour does not include touching a mug or making a bit of excited noise in a shop, or even playing a bit with an unpackaged toy. So I wouldn't tell them off and I wouldn't care about someone judging me for that. Just like you wouldn't tell a child off for many normal things or care if somebody with strangely high standards was judging you.

Anyone that gets annoyed at a small child being happy is a miserable sod

No one is annoyed at a small child being happy. No one.

People are annoyed at parents who have such little consideration for others, that they either look on adoringly at, or don't address their children shrieking, being too loud, yelling, grabbing, touching things they shouldn't, climbing about, in places that it is not acceptable to act this way. That's not "being happy" either. No one is angry at the child. It's not the child's job to teach itself how to behave appropriately.

Again, it's not "what children do." It's what children are allowed to do, when their parents have no respect or consideration for where they are, or the other people there.

I work in a tiny fabric shop and sometimes we do get parents who come through the door and immediately allow their children free range to touch, pick up, open every drawer and cupboard... whilst they stand feet away with their backs turned doing nothing. Only once have I ever gently asked a mother of she wouldn't mind not letting her child open the doors of our storage cupboards which he was banging loudly. It can be tiring and wearing but I'd never tell another mother how to discipline her children or that their behaviour was awful. I do, however, frequently have to ask adults if they wouldn't mind putting their take-away coffee cups on the counter whilst they are browsing the fabrics...I sympathise OP, I have children and they are grown up now. I never had to struggle with tantrums or embarrassment in shops but when I see a struggling mother I try to put myself in her shoes and be helpful. I'm sorry you had to deal with someone making you feel small. Some people just have to be nasty because it makes then feel better, really it takes so little effort to be kind.

Why would you assume a mother is "struggling" just because she is out alone with her kids?
I've been a single mum for 5 years. It's always been just me out with my kids. I'm not struggling. I'm perfectly capable of going shopping with my 2 children.

Again, it's not "what children do." It's what children are allowed to do, when their parents have no respect or consideration for where they are, or the other people there.

Given that we are talking about twins with developmental delays, which you’re well aware of since you’ve been having a go at OP for days, this is a spectacularly ignorant and nasty thing to say.

I would love to see the people who spout this shit trying to exist in the world while parenting my twins.

I don't think touching a mug/playing with a car is particularly serous in the scheme of things. Running around with a trolley and knocking over an elderly or otherwise vulnerable person with it would be. Or scooting around the supermarket which seems to be perfectly acceptable to a lot of parents.

What actually hurts someone and what is mildly annoying? Get a sense of perspective.

I am not massively tolerant of loud badly behaved kids and realise that shop staff often finish every day with a raging headache due to screaming kids. But in this case it sounds like the woman was a judgmental know-it-all.

Children can have plenty of opportunity to be silly, loud and run about but not in a shop imo. If your kids are going nuts, leave the shop!

I've got a 3 and 4 year old who will be holding my hands in a shop, not wandering about, mostly because I'm worried they could wander out of the shop or get injured! I've read many stories of children being hurt by shop fixtures or wandering out of the shop altogether, so that is my primary concern. As for being loud and excitable, they'd be told to calm down or we'd leave the shop. I've only ever had to do it twice and now just the warning is enough

Either people haven't read my posts or they have no empathy or understanding of children with additional needs.
It's amazing that children will hold hands but mine wouldn't understand that concept.
I didn't say they were going nuts.
Do people completely twist everything?

All I said was they were excited by laughing, squealing and hugging me, grabbing me.

I'm also a mother to a much older child. No additional needs and she was a breeze.
Only compliments from her school and people.

So please can people stop with the judgmental, my children never misbehave bollocks.

Lulualla if I see a mum (or dad, for that matter) with pushchair, shopping, and a child who doesn't want to be there, I'd give her/him a bit of space and a bit of sympathy and not judge or make nasty comments. I certainly don't make judgments about whether she (or he) is capable or not! I've been on my own for long periods of time with two little ones whilst my husband was away working and it wasn't easy. So I might not be a single parent but I've had to deal with stuff alone as well. Some of it much more difficult and stressful than shopping. It's not about judging whether someone is "capable", it's about being kind.

Who the fuck comments on other people's children in shops? The woman was weird to comment whether your kids were behaving or not. I'd have told her to mind her own business.

Sorry op it's your job to make sure your children are behaving. Kids shouldn't be allowed to run around in shops without supervision. Being a single parent isn't a great excuse. Its your responsibility to socialise your children.

Sorry op it's your job to make sure your children are behaving. Kids shouldn't be allowed to run around in shops without supervision

She was, and they weren't.

No judgment here OP. Sounds like you are doing a stellar job. Your kids sound HAPPY - shock horror.

My two cents on why we seem to rush to judgment when parenting styles differ? Parenting is bloody hard, relentless and very very important. I find it that way with one, a hands on husband and no additional needs. I think we are all jst trying our best. When we see parents who do things differently to us, we immediately want to reassure ourselves we are doing it right, and they are wrong. Personally, i find it really sad that some kids are kept on a tight leash and walk on egg shells so that no bystander would ever be annoyed by their laughing, playing, even god forbid tantruming. In my opinion these behaviours are so normal. Should we hide kids away, lest they irritate someone in waitrose? But lots on here would find my parenting style grating. And they d think my kid badly behaved, no doubt.
The truth is, i want to raise a kid that is kind, respectful, happy and confident. To me that does mean trying to guide him towards understanding his actions have consequences for others. I want him to have consideration for others. But that does not mean him being constantly rebuked becuase his voice is too loud or he is laughing too much. He should have consideration for adults, but equally they should have consideration for him. He has just as much right to be in the world as they (we) do. Moreover, adults should have a fully developed sense of respect and considerantion and sympathy - that means realising a 3 yr old is still developing these skills. And it means cutting them some slack. That woman didn't show any consideration to your twins. Shame on her.

@MrsNotNice Haven't RTFT but what you said to @Leighhalfpennysthigh was absolutely disgraceful.

If you want to play the "look what happened on another thread game", I'd like to point out that you shouted at a bunch of people for objecting to you allowing your toddler to stand on café tables, so I'm not convinced that you're the beacon of parenting that you think you are.

OP - I do have sympathy for what you're going through. No doubt preemie twins causes additional issues that many people won't be aware of when they see two toddlers (in their eyes) acting up. Nobody is perfect and I don't think you're trying to justify what happened. I don't know whether the lady said everything that she said, but it sounds like she may have been going through some stuff that you weren't aware of, too, to be that vocal. Best to try and let it go.

@GibbonLover ha! Sorry, had totally forgotten about that saying, used to get told "look with your eyes, not your hands" when I was little
Yeah, sounds like they were being pains (I have had two toddlers, they used to want to play about when out too so get it.
If they were being loud, running about and touching stuff I can see why she said that tbh (although you think it was a bit rude)
What did she exactly say and what were your kids doing?
I feel like your Op only tells half a story lol

Either people haven't read my posts or they have no empathy or understanding of children with additional needs.
It's amazing that children will hold hands but mine wouldn't understand that concept.

Thing is, you seem to want strangers around you that have no idea of this to give you extra consideration. But what's really quite hypocritical is you absolutely knowing they require extra/different care and attention, but then not applying that in this particular scenario. Then complaining because as a result, you got a grumpy shop assistant point that out. We all have off days, we don't have ten pairs of arms and eyes in the back of your head, but if you're going to take the stance "me and children should have extra understanding" then you need to take accountability needing to be extra vigilent. And you weren't. And to repeat, I'm a mum to a SN DS, so this comes from direct experience, not unfounded opinion.

So please can people stop with the judgmental, my children never misbehave bollocks.

Literally no one has said that. And this is why everyone feels you're giving half a story. You're far too defensive, and seem to think whilst you had your back turned on two toddlers misbehaving, it's the fault of those around you for noticing that you'd done that, and then having no appreciation that they were SN, although you were quite happy to not watch them whilst chatting to another assistant.

Our children do misbehave. Often. We do something about it. My SN son has pulled some corkers in his time. I didn't flounce and complain to shop managers because I wasn't supervising him properly, because its fine that he's got SN and I'm not watching him properly, but those strangers (who would, if anything, assume he's not SN or I would be watching him properly) should have guessed he has additional needs so I'll be hugely offended by that and announce that I clearly can't go to the shops again

Courtney555 If I did flounce because someone told me and my children we shouldn't be allowed out in public then I would bloody well do it again.

I don't want Special consideration from anyone. I just don't want people to be rude and nasty when it's uncalled for.
And as I've said numerous times, I would of done something about it. I didn't have the chance too.

I wasn't happily chatting away but I was not going to ignore someone.
Aren't we trying to instil these behaviours to our children after all?
That's also hypercritical from you.

It took a spilt second for him to touch the mug.
Have I not already explained this? Have I not already explained that I constantly try to teach my children right from wrong?

Have I not already explained that I constantly try to teach my children right from wrong?

OP, I would seriously stop trying to justify yourself or your children. Kids touch stuff in shops and they make noise. The person in the shop who commented was being a grumpy arse. I don't know anyone in real life who would comment on it.

This thread is a shining example of what a hostile and hideous place mumsnet can be sometimes.

OP the woman was rude to you. Simple. It takes a village....

@FrauHaribo

‘I wish I was as good a mother as all the posters on here!

what's stopping you?’

Jesus! What a delight you are! I’m so enthralled to see what some of you are like in real life. I would pay good money to match up these arsey comments to real life people. You must be a troll, no ones that much of a arrogant un-empathetic delight surely?

flobonobo
chill out will you. You might believe in the "kids will be kids" nonsense, but if you send digs at people, don't moan about them replying to you.

When you read a poster explaining that because of the huge shop markups, the goods are fair play for their kids.. yes, I am prtty un-empathetic.

I would also like to see these people in real life, who have to shout "trolls" every time someone disagree with them. I don't know if it's a sign of arrogance or a massive chip on their shoulder?