To think that social skills need to be given more emphasis at school?

[HennyPennyHorror]

I don't mean just teaching children about kindness and good manners but more than that.

I've been lucky and both of my DDs have been naturally good at socialising but a number of my friends have children who struggle. Not due to spectrum disorders but they're just not naturally socially skilled.

That tricky line between knowing how and when to approach other children, how to relate well...I strongly believe that some people are born with an innate skill in this area and others are not...I wasn't. I've always struggled...my DH is skilled socially...I can see the difference.

I think that lunchtime supervisors should be more qualified and that they should be paid more.

There should be way more emphasis on it in general...I'm not sure HOW it can be taught but feel that it could be.

I can see where my friends DC struggle...I see what they do wrong...but only because I'm an adult now. As a child I was probably similar...this came up in my mind because yesterday my friend was in tears in my kitchen over her DD who has no friends despite being a very sweet and caring little girl she's always rejected by her peers.

Surely this could be fixed? I see it with another friend and her DS and my niece...am I being silly?

Is it a problem though? Really?

No, I don’t think it is, but the OP clearly thinks so.

We teach the children in our school how to be a good friend, despite how other children might behave towards them. In this way there’s more chance other children will want to be friends with them.

It's a parent's job, obviously, but I hear that schools are now being asked to help children to brush their teeth.

Weird times we live in.

Ha ha ha funny isn't it that every time someone mentions Home Education everyone screams 'But what about the social skills??? they can never learn them if they do not go to school'

I'm going to keep this thread and repost it every time I hear the socialization issue mention about HE.

It was secondary school that ruined my social skills. I was very social at primary school, talked/played with anyone, always out at the village playground or cycling around the village with whoever else was cycling around.

It all came to an abrupt halt at the crap comp I went to.

Bullying started on day 1 and never relented. Made worse by the games/pe lessons which were a bullies paradise if you're not sporty. Then all the "group" class activities where the teachers forced me to sit with my worst bullies, meaning I just withdrew and sat mute whilst they did all the work. Over my secondary school years, I developed social anxiety. I lost the friends I made at primary because I was so used to being bullied, I couldn't trust anyone - even people who were nice to me, I assumed had an agenda. It was a living hell.

That was because of school. Because the teachers didn't give a shit. They were so hung up on team building, group activities etc., they had no empathy for those who weren't getting on with our peer group. I felt physically sick waiting outside lessons where I knew we'd have to do social/group activities.

It's not about teachers doing more - it's about teachers actually understanding the effects of bullying and social anxiety - my experience was that most teachers were blind to it and their "team" mentality made things worse not better.

Ted bless you

Patronising or what, OP

Ted was making the same point just about everyone else has on this thread. i.e. YABU. It;'s down to the parent, not the school.

base

I expect there are far more opportunities for better connections and positive social skills for kids who are home schooled.

You can take trips to places where there is stuff your kid is really interested in, join groups of like minded children and you wont have to skip it some weeks because "homework" and you haven't had to spend the day being called names and hiding .

Win win.

Sure more kids who have the more positive experiences will be more inclined to attempt to learn social skills

Ted was making the same point just about everyone else has on this thread. i.e. YABU. It;'s down to the parent, not the school. What about the children of parents who don't have these skills themselves and are therefore unable to teach them?

It;'s down to the parent, not the school.

Except when school/teachers are making the situation worse, i.e. the wait of shame in Games lessons, forcing group/team activities on children who are uncomfortable doing them, forcing kids to sing/play an instrument/act in front of others, etc. Social anxiety isn't something that can be "cured" just by making the poor kid do things - it's usually made worse.

I DO think schools have a duty of care towards children....not to teach the basics but to underpin what's been learned at home before the age of 5....FIVE! It's very, very young and prior to that, some will have been in nurseries and with babysitters...of course parents usually teach their children social skills but then, after 5, the majority of a child's social time is IN SCHOOL.

In the care of teachers.

So schools have to do something don't they?

henny

But the trouble with that is that often they make things a million times worse.

They send the message that your whole personality is some problem.to overcome.

Its the old saying - something designed fo do everything doesn't do anything particularly well.

The more we pile on schools the worse the standard of the other stuff they do gets.

No one benefits.

My sons had support at school. One was a late August born who was in a nurture group in Reception and they worked in social skills. The other had social speech therapy to support classroom situations. He was fine in the playground but wouldn't put his name up, talk in group work situation etc

They are both popular and benefitted from support.

A lot of people are right about appreciating who the child is inately. I had an extrovert mother who pushed for me to be like her but I'm happy in my own company doing solo activities like reading. The UK education is biased towards the extrovert because of it's tick box assessment style and ignores the positives that quiet children bring like not disrupting other children and the teacher. In other cultures being quiet in class is seen as a sign of respect for the teacher. Is it possible that your friend is stressing that her dd is not like her? She might want to google positive qualities of introverts and remind herself that her quiet dd may be more thoughtful than her peers for instance.

I think it is the parent’s responsibility to do the spadework on social skills, but a good primary makes a huge contribution.
My DC attended a small state primary (only 100 kids in total), and the headmistress was excellent.
Every child had to do regular public speaking at assemblies, held daily, and perform in plays and concerts at the end of term.
There was a strong Christian ethos, with regular input from the parish minister and school services at the church across the road. This attitude pervaded the school, with a list of rules on how to treat other people, and acceptable behaviour etc.
It was noticeable when you entered the school door, a pupil would always come over and ask if they could help, and direct you to the head’s office. When DD1 was 5 and had performed well in a school play, several 10 year old boys cycling past on their way home, shouted “Well done, (DD name) that was ace!” at her.
I was impressed that they bothered to praise a much younger kid.
Pupils with special needs were paired up with a child mentor who helped them fit in socially. It benefited both, as the mentor learned kindness, patience and tolerance of difference.
The odd rare bit of bullying (10 year olds girls getting bitchy) was dealt with immediately and effectively by the class teacher.
I think it helped too that all the parents in our small village were in agreement about behaviour. If a child was naughty or rude out of school, they were sent round to your house to apologise. I always made a point of praising the miscreant for having the guts to say sorry, and shaking hands with them to confirm it was all forgotten. It’s very true that it takes a village to raise a child- we all reinforce normal social behaviour, between school, church, home, friends and neighbours.

I've always struggled...my DH is skilled socially...I can see the difference.

This is me and my husband. I'm nearly 100% sure that's down to my home life rather than school life.

Although schools should and do encourage good manners etc it really is down to the parents.
DS has a few close friends from Arabic and Pakistani backgrounds and the difference between them and his British heritage friends is marked.
When I went to his Libyan friends house to drop him off for the first time all the dc came to say hello and greeted me very formally and respectfully and if they come here they are the usual lively 9/10 year olds but incredibly polite and well behaved and tidy up after eating etc (and they usually bring something delicious their mum has baked). Another friend always brings brownies or flapjacks he has made himself - we sometimes swap recipes! Another one brings me a box of chocolates when he comes
DS friends from a purely white British background are lovely too and I can’t say that they are rude or anything but they don’t have the same social skills when engaging with adults as a general rule.
Interestingly ( and I know this won’t be a popular view) I also find that in general and purely in my own experience DD’s friends who go to Private school have better social skills than her friends who don’t. The are of course exceptions before anyone starts with the “ my child goes to a very tough inner city comp and has great social skills” or “ my nephew goes to Eton and is very rude” malarkey

Every child had to do regular public speaking at assemblies, held daily, and perform in plays and concerts at the end of term

Why would you push that when there are roles back stage. This would terrify some kids.

I always made a point of praising the miscreant for having the guts to say sorry, and shaking hands with them to confirm it was all forgotten

Great so now if they are still upset or dont want to accept the apology they have to fake it for the parents , pretend all is ok or they lool like the unreasonable one. Plus they know where you live now .

Seems to me.theres this quest for the perfect child and anyone who doesn't fall into this needs fixing somehow

@HennyPennyHorror

"the majority of a child's social time is IN SCHOOL.

In the care of teachers.

So schools have to do something don't they?"

No, they don't. They're already very busy teaching a class of 30 the curriculum.

Just because the child is "in school" doesn't mean that teachers are there to take on more and more of the parental responsibilities.

That's for you to do, at home.

Bloody hell. Anything else you want teachers to do because the child is in "their care"?

I'm sure they're not in school for the majority of the time...

9-3 = 6, that's only a quarter of their day. If they sleep about 11/12 hours, they still have 6 hours with carers.

Does your friends DD do any extracurricular? I find that really helps. I've always encouraged (forced ) my DC to participate in quite a bit of extracurricular. Watching my DD doing one of her sports last night, she's 11 but was at ease speaking to older children (up to the age of 18 or so) and her male coach. This means she started secondary not really being afraid to ask older students for help when she was lost. Schools I think can be limited in building social skills as you only really mix with your own age group (and level of social skill/maturity) whereas in the real world, we have to work and mix with all ages.

My boys attend an all boys public school. Their social skills are excellent, as are their peers. They are well mannered, charming and will chat and be engaged with anyone, in any circumstance. (Apart from to me at home often but thats teens for you). I don't know what the school does differently though, I just know I wanted them to go there partly because of how public school kids turn out, full of confidence and at ease with themselves i suppose. (I know you'll all flame me, but its true).

"the majority of a child's social time is IN SCHOOL.

Playtime plus lunch is 1.5 hours tops? My kids spend more time with their siblings and I after school than that.

Every child had to do regular public speaking at assemblies, held daily, and perform in plays and concerts at the end of term

Why would you push that when there are roles back stage. This would terrify some kids.
^
Our school did this too. The very shy children pre-recorded their section and that recording was shown on the projector behind the performance. Or they'd be playing the percussion instruments to accompany the story.

I've been pleasantly surprised to see my kids perform much better than I imagined them performing.^

@Babdoc

The key there was "a small state primary (only 100 kids in total)"

That's great, I attended something similar at primary - 12 in a class. Sadly that's not the case for the majority of schools, where class sizes are around 30.

What about the children of parents who don't have these skills themselves and are therefore unable to teach them?
And that is the problem. Is it an increase in such parental failure or is it a higher social responsibility for these children? Problem is that by introducing more responsibility on school, we are also encouraging more parents to devolve their responsibilities even when they are capable for delivering them but find it easier to let others do it.

@swingofthings

Exactly!

There are all kinds of things that happen in schools that are not consciously taught social skills, but are in fact, just that.

There are, or were, formal programmes, such as Circle Time and Circle of Friends, which were prioritised too. I don’t know whether that still happens as a specific lesson. Possibly not, because the pressure on core subjects, monitoring, recording, reviewing and so on, means that the time for softer subjects is reduced.

Being a socially confident child is obviously desirable, but it does start long before school, with groups and activities and parental influence.

DD’s friends who go to Private school have better social skills than her friends who don’t. Presumably because the private schools are nurturing social skills.

And yet for some reason the majority on this thread are against extending these benefits to state-educated children.