Am I missing something? Its the EU that don't want to do a deal, not the UK so why all the flack to Boris?

[QuiQuaiQuod]

Am I naïve? Am I interpreting this right? I'm so sick and tired of the whole thing, but isn't it the EU that are playing silly buggers in their petulance? Boris is trying to do a deal.

Yet everyone is blasting HIM.

BTW I voted remain but accepted the result and just want it all over and done with, plus the attitude of Brussels and remOANERS,- not Remainers who accept result -has been abysmal .

I am not a fan of Boris BTW but he seems to know what to do. Or have I had my head stuck in the sand for the last 3 years?

Please be gentle, no bun fights, a sensible discussion please,

I don't think the EU massively care about Ireland

This is the opposite of everything the EU reps have said over the last few years. They will not allow the UK to cause trouble in an EU country (Ireland). Even though it seems to be an afterthought by the British, the Anglo-Irish border was one of the highest priorities for the EU negotiators.

The EU is a trading organisation. It should always have built exit strategies into its membership. The fact that it didn't is a failing.

Then it was a UK failing. Article 50 was written by the UK MEP wasn't it?

EU have said they would put up a hard border if we didnt in the case of no deal etc which shows peace is really only important to them when they can use it as a bargaining point.
How do you work that out, @VolcanionSteamArtillery?
If we are no longer part of the EU, or of the customs union, there has to be a border. That’s basic political/economic sense. I mean, we’re doing all this to protect our borders, right? They are trying to offer ways to avoid the border as that will (illegally) contravene a peace treaty. It’s not political bargaining, it's reality. And the leave campaign knew it all along - or you would hope they did.

See all i hear is how the EU is protecting peace in Ireland. Yet the EU are the only side saying they actively would put up and enforce a hard border when UK unilaterally said whatever happened they wouldnt.

Thats not caring about peace, or being reasonable about a deal. Its negotiating hard and using Irish peace as a pawn

SO where would the border go volcano?

Why? Why does there have to be boarder enforcement there?

I get my passport checked by French customs on English soil on the Eurostar, doesnt mean ive suddenly entered France. Principle is the same.

Why? Why does there have to be boarder enforcement there?

Because you voted for hard borders?

It shows how degraded the Conservative Party has become that the current incumbents casually disdain Ireland and the peace agreement that their wiser, braver predecessors worked so hard and risked so much to make.

Because you voted for hard borders?

I personally voted for independence from EU.

I get my passport checked by French customs on English soil on the Eurostar, doesnt mean ive suddenly entered France. Principle is the same

No it is absolutely not the same.

The UK and France are both in the EU.

If we leave, there will need to be a border between the EU country (ROI) and the non-EU country (UK).

You voted for that. You voted to control our borders.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with whether you've technically entered France or not on the bloody Eurostar.

Full independence == hard borders.

I personally voted for independence from EU.

Yes, that's what I said. Did you think you would get open borders with it? Cake cake cake

Honestly this whole process has been a farce.

The transition agreement that was arrived at was based on the type of brexit requested by Theresa May based on issues like immigration freedom of movement etc.

The backstop was designed by the EU to meet its obligation of the good friday agreement (via ireland)) given the red lines the uk asked for. To date the uk has not proposed any workable alternative and honestly it seems like the aim is to ignore it/ throw northern ireland under the bus under the rationale it is undemocratic make the pretence we have tried really hard to sort it via lots of ridiculous outlandish claims/laughable analogies/ when it appears the aim is to to keep this up until 31 october with increasing posturing / media statements from all and sundry about doing a deal whilst actually wanting to leave without any deal at all. This will be blamed on eu intransigence remoaner sabotage etc Bj heroic moral courage to deliver on the will of the people

Regardless of whar happens in the next 6 weeks we have decades of this farce still ahead of us. With such a slight margin to leave brexit was always going to be an omnishambles and i personally feel sad this debacle will leave us much diminished in reputation and likely economically. Honestly i think in 20 years it may be a positive thing but it seems more likely it will end badly like a past it sportsman hoping for one last great bow out but ending up looking past it and tarnishing memories of heroic deeds that came before

Independence from the EU = closed borders = hard border between NI and Republic

That's what you voted for.

Own it, ffs.

1)We have already negotiated a deal. Now we have decided we don't want it.
2) The EU is not going to consider a deal which doesn't take into consideration the GFA.
3) Merkel asked Johnson if he could negotiate a deal which takes the GFA into account. He said he would. He hasn't.
Explain again why this is the EU's fault?

The EU have been working with remain MPs to stop us leaving the EU. The WA May put forward was a red herring as the EU knew it would never pass and even if it did would keep us trapped in the SM+CU indefinitely.

Boris is currently getting a lot of flak because remainers actually believe he will take us out of the EU this time and they are hyperventilating in attempts to stop him. Ironically Boris seems to be increasing in approval in the polls.

Boris is not trying to do a deal. The EU have bent over backwards to accomodate the UK by actually agreeing to a deal with the UK government under May then by giving extensions several times, when that deal wasn't acceptable to parliament, the EU also asked for sensible alternatives to the backstop to keep the Good Friday agreement but there haven't been any, the EU alps agree the backstop could be UK wide when the DUP wouldn't accept one that just affected Northern Ireland etc.
This issue was startec by the UK and its the UK who should sort it. It really is not the fault of the EU.

There was years of negotiation and the withdrawal agreement was agreed.

With Teresa May's ridiculous red lines. But our Parliament meaning us, (here in the UK) would not agree it.

So we are the ones agreeing to our side and its not the EU who is looking stupid to the rest if the world.

Well, given that the current level of analysis from Johnson supporters seems to be 'funny man lololol Hulk smash'...

A border is only as hard or soft as you choose to make it, all around the world there are borders with no noticeable sign of a boarder. Then there are Korean style borders. Having control of your boarders does also mean you can choose how and where to enforce it.

Its only the EU that have actively said they would enforce a border.

The ops question is the reason that the UK populace, should never have been asked the question in a referendum. Too many people do not understand even the most basic parts of this whole mess.

What right do you have to demand that “reMOANERS” are gentle with you, when you call them stupid, insulting names?

all around the world there are borders with no noticeable sign of a boarder

Examples please, of borders that would satisfy the international peace treaty that is the GFA.

Boris is not trying to do a deal.

The simple truth is theres no deal to be done.

EU wont agree any deal that can get through parliment. Theres no incentive for them to either now no deals off the table.

There needs to be a general election. But thats been blocked too.

So we're all left arguing about something that neither side can do anything about.