To feel ashamed of wanting a baby so young?

[Shamedchange]

I'm 23 and fully aware that lots of women have had their DC at my age and younger (including my own DM). My partner of 6 years thinks having DC is something older people do, and has said he wants at least two but not until I'm over 30 as he doesnt think we'll be financially ready (he makes over 30k, I'm on minimum wage) or done doing stuff just the two of us until then. My parents meanwhile mention grandchildren wistfully in passing then panic that they're encouraging me to have DC young and give me a lecture on doing more with my life than they did first. Add to that the whole "children ruin your life" "women are trapped by children" narrative and I just feel stuck. Most of my friends from my home city have children, but none of my university friends that i live near now do so I'd expect judgement from my immediate circle as well.

I just feel like that's the next step in life I want to take. I've wanted DC for years, I have dreams where I'm pregnant or chasing a toddler or dropping off a teenager at school. I really want that life but it feels so unattainable right now. I know all I have to do is wait, but what am I waiting for? It seems such a waste to count the years down doing nothing purposeful with my life until its finally okay.

Ive lived with my partner for two years already. Ideally I'd like to be married first as well, which we've already spoken about and agree on more or less everything, though when I jokingly brought up proposing myself he shot me down and said he really wanted to do it as soon as he got a better paid job (which he has now, as of a few months ago) so I guess I'm waiting for that too.

I just feel so stuck in limbo and like I cant do anything or suggest anything without it being the wrong path in life to take. Aibu to feel this way?

You earn a pittance, your partner's on a low wage only on MN is "over 30k" a low wage.

OP I'd concentrate onn getting married for now. On minimum wage it's unlikely you'll be affording full time child care so you either need a higher wage or more security.

Age itself isn't such a big issue, but you do BOTH need to be ready

It depends on your childcare plans - if you’ve got family willing to do it for free, great. £30,000 plus what may end up part time minimum wage to cover childminder/nursery costs may be more of a struggle.

Obviously no one can tell you what to do it make this decision for you, however speaking as someone who had a baby at 20 I really really regret it. I’m now pushing 30 and only just going to uni which I always wanted to do, I’ve never done uni or the lifelong friendships thatbusualyy come with it, I always wanted to move away and work abroad, girls holidays I never got the chance, spontaneous dating or dating whatsoever was out of the question, travelling, saving money, drinks after work, nice possessions etc.

In hindsight I missed out on so many rights of passage for young women, so many experiences I had to sacrifice. If I could turn back time I’d have my twenties child free and think about children in my 30’s. It was hard as well so bloody hard, sleepless nights and trudging out for nappies working any dead end job to pay the ever increasing bills. Unbelievably lonely as well, I was the only one with a child so I quickly lost touch with people who very quickly couldn’t relate to me anymore.

Personally I would wait, live life a little more. Improve your earning abilities, make sure the prospective dad is the right man for you. Have some once in a lifetime experiences before you settle down to children.

I worked in retail for 7 years before deciding to TTC with DH.
I thought I was good at my job, always did the overtime, took on extra responsibility for no pay, I was passed up for promotions time and again for the bosses cousin, daughter, girlfriend, etc. I wouldn't even call it a career, it was a job.
I met DH when we were both17, he was ready for kids at 20!
I said no, we travelled first, we both learned to drive, we get married, etc.
I'm now 27, been married for 6 years, seen a few beautiful countries, both drive and have got our no claims down so insurance is more affordable on his shit wage, and we have 2 beautiful boys!
One is 2 and one is 5mo.
We're done now and DH has had a vasectomy.
It's worked for us, we've never had a good wage and we are used to living frugally because of that.
Not really much point talking to the internet about it though, you need to have a serious talk with DP. What if you wait 5 or 10 years and he either decides he doesn't actually want kids? Or you break up after waiting?
It was easier for me because DH was ready before me, so as soon as I was ready we went for it!

I don’t think OP is ever coming back, but I do resent the suggestion that planning for a child financially and practically is a ‘middle class’ thing, as if the working class just pop kids out randomly whenever the urge takes them. My upbringing was as working class as you can get (brought up in a council house on an estate, neither parent had any education beyond school), my parents did their best and I’m enormously grateful to them but it was difficult seeing them financially struggle and being raised in a home with a constant sense of gnawing tension around money, knowing I wouldn’t be able to go on paid school trips, knowing that when we went grocery shopping fruit was out of the question as it was seen as unaffordable. As an adult buying orange juice and strawberries/grapes other than as a rare treat still seems the height of luxury to me as those were things we’d never have been able to justify buying other than once per year or so!

And they both encouraged me to wait to have kids until I was older, more established, had a career, went through further education, attained an income solid enough that if I had to be a single parent I could afford to provide on my own.

OH and I waited until I was 31 and he was 27 to TTC. Both in solid professions with a good household income, house purchased (mortgage, on our own), some savings in the bank. So we can provide for more than our child’s basic needs, give them opportunities, pay for music lessons. All the stuff that isn’t technically necessary but is enriching and can open many doors. If I’d had kids eight years ago when like OP I was earning minimum wage, unmarried, reluctant partner, I know I’d have been having a child for my own desires not because I could provide for them in the way that they deserve.

I don’t think I’ve somehow become middle class in the span of a few years, that’s not how class works. OH isn’t MC either, born to two immigrant parents who worked in a corner shop. It’s actually pretty insulting to WC folk to suggest that careful planning and waiting until you’re in a stable secure position before having kids is the preserve of the middle class.

You’re 23.... why would you want to trap yourself with a child when you’re only earning minimum wage?!

why would you want to trap yourself with a child

how is having a child being trapped?

god youd think your life ends as soon as you leave the hospital if you believed everything you read on MN.

What’s the point of being a ‘young mum’ if you need benefits to raise your kids? I think you need to start applying for different jobs / upskill to increase your earning potential - raising kids / managing childcare on a 60-80k joint family income is far, far easier than on a 30k income.

You’re a geriatric Mother from the age of 35, just to clear that one up.

Your OH sounds rather sensible although it is absolutely fine for you to feel this way too. Personally, I think you should maximise your earning potential first before children. I had my first three DC during my uni years, it was the toughest time of my life. I survived but obviously wish I’d waited until after uni to have them.

There’s nothing wrong with being a younger Mother and it does have a few benefits (more energy for start) but it’s always best to wait until you’re at least financially stable.

What’s the point of being a ‘young mum’ if you need benefits to raise your kids

being a young mum and getting benefits are not exclusive to each other you know. Anyone can end up on benefits ffs.

This thread is so bloody judgemental!

oh and a household income of 60-80k a year is totally unattainable for some people, especially if you live up north.

We do and our joint income is about 47k a year.

We are fine, pay for one child FT in nursery, maintenance for another (and dp earns more than me so its a fair whack) and still have money for nice things / holidays / whatever else and we don't get any benefits other than child benefit.

oh and even though this poor little girl left school at 17 and has no degree I work FT in a decent job and bought my first house at 19, and my second at 23.

why are we all pretending that you cant further your career (if you want to! many don't!) after you have a baby?

Maybe it varies by trust but where I live they have changed 'geriatric mother' to 40. It was previously 35 (and before that it was 30, my mother was classed as geriatric when she had me at 30 a long time ago!)

I asked the midwife because I was 37 when I had my second and I knew that geriatric mothers were not allowed to give birth on the MLU etc. She laughed at me and said it wasnt considered old in our area and confirmed the current off had been raised to 40 as so many 35 - 40 were having babies without any issues.

It depends on where you live and what your outgoings are whether £30k + NMW is viable. Here you would be considered quite well off on that income, certainly comfortable. I suspect in London you'd be struggling. Same with age. I had DS2 at 34 and felt like an old lady at baby groups, nearly everyone else was late teens/early 20's. Other areas 34 would be normal or even young. There are too many variables to make a blanket rule about when is the right time.

@Shamedchange op your not to young if you feel ready but it really does tar a lot of work raising a little one , it’s really important the father of the child is on board.

Discuss a timeline, get a financial plan in place ... and an order of priorities.

If you want to get married first start saving book the wedding... if you want to get a better salary or better maternity package get job hunting.

Can you live on one salary? If not you
May need a better paid job nursery is between £47-£56 a day. All concerns I am sure ... if you think you are financially ready pitch it to him.

X

I feel for your situation. I ahd 4 children by the time i was 30 and loved it. Todays pressures ae different. Do you want to tays at home for a while with a child? The marriage thing is actually a much bigger issue that it is pc to admit. A statement of total committment ( bizarrely men seem more willing to commit to the bigger one of babies) a legal contract which finacially protects you and your child. But for me here is the biggest, such a big committment between two people should be discuseed and agreed together. This whole proposal thing is an archaic concept of male power. Its not romantic in any way. It should not be down to the man, it should be a joint declaration of love and committment. Because most people live together first, which is a good thing in alll aspects than this, many men dont see what they have to gain by marriage until they do it. and then most wonder what they were most afraid of

I had my first at 24. It was planned I was married and owned my home had a decent income etc

I look back and wish I had waited, I gave up a lot of experiences to be a mum. Things that I didn't get to catch up on yet.

I'm now 37 and expecting my second. I feel much more equipped and ready to be a mum. I managed with my first baby but I wasn't confident, I wasn't secure, and I didn't know who I was outside of being a mother.

Focus on growing your life experiences first would be my advice.

As for

30 is when you're classed as an older mother, need more care and monitoring as it because more and more unsafe and unlikely you'll convince.

Did you get that off the back of the daily mail or something? Absolute rubbish. You're about a decade off 😂 I'm not even considered an older mum at 37 and am low risk across the board.

I feel much more equipped and ready to be a mum. I managed with my first baby but I wasn't confident, I wasn't secure

Of course you feel more equipped with your second child! who doesn't!

I don't think you felt more equipped because of your age! surely its because you've done it all before?

I am not sure any first time mother feels 100% confident no matter what their age!

Fwiw I don’t think the ops household income is the problem. Just the fact it’s mainly dps wage, which means a) her career/ earning ability is the one likely to be sacrificed in the early years, and b) she’s fucked if they split up.

In addition, I genuinely don’t care whether people are younger or older mothers, they both have their own advantages and disadvantages. But can we stop misrepresenting facts.

From a purely physical point of view late teens/ early 20’s is the prime age for conception, pregnancy and birth. Nobody would be jumping on someone planning to leave it to late 30’s and calling them irresponsible to take the greater risk of needing the tax payer to fund fertility issues, pregnancy difficulties, a birth with greater intervention etc. So it’s hypocritical to jump on a young mother with the same judgments about benefits. If someone needs several £k of public funding to have dc I fail to see why there’s any moral difference between that being from the welfare system or the nhs.

Not to mention that an older parent, especially one that feels secure enough to jack in their career to be a sahm is just as much at risk of poverty & claiming benefits if the relationship ends.

Unless you’re enough of a twat to make assumptions and judge the older group then nobody should be doing the same to the younger group.

I can't stop laughing at the poster who said 30 is considered an older mother 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

What’s the point of being a ‘young mum’ if you need benefits to raise your kids? I think you need to start applying for different jobs / upskill to increase your earning potential - raising kids / managing childcare on a 60-80k joint family income is far, far easier than on a 30k income.

Yes that's idea to have a high salary but how ridiculous to say you'll struggle without £60k. No you absolutely won't, it depends on where you live and people on low incomes get subsidised childcare. (Students/people on UC get 85% paid for). I pay £100 a month. I'm willing to bet I have it easier than most people here.

I didn't have a child until my forties and mortgage free.
You should choose when it suits you to have a child but if you're wistfully looking at babies in prams, that phase goes very quickly.
They soon grow into demanding toddlers and if money's tight, it's really not much fun having a young child and no money for treats/days out, especially with more than one child.
You don't need to be wealthy but I wouldn't want to be struggling and having to say NO constantly.
It's too depressing.

thatflamingcandle yep, on a 47k joint salary we were paying 700-800 (using tax free childcare) for 1 child in FT nursery per month.

he gets his 30 hours now and with the tax free childcare we pay around 400pm.

we're ok though, and tbh we don't struggle at all!

We did for a couple of months when I was on mat leave, but I think everyone struggles then because its a huge adjustment!

If he's not ready, he's not ready.
That's it.
Unless you are prepared to split up and find someone else who does want kids, you have to wait. Strong-arming people into parenthood never works
It leads to resentment on a massive scale and would sound the death knell to your relationship
You have to wait.
But do be sure that he is saying, not yet, and not, not ever. Because if its not ever you have a right to know and make your choices accordingly

bizarrely men seem more willing to commit to the bigger one of babies

Because babies are a commitment to the child, not the mother. Similar to a mortgage. It’s a commitment to the house both parties enter into. Only marriage is a commitment directly to one another. People often get this mixed up I think.

Haven't read the full thread but your initial comment here stood out to me:
It seems such a waste to count the years down doing nothing purposeful with my life until its finally okay

• don't do that then! Of course that would be a waste! As pps have said, it sounds like you need to sort yourself out first anyway. Re-train, whatever, get yourself a career that's not NMW. You can't rely on your partners income (he may be made redundant, you may split up, he may fall ill etc) and his income isn't astoundingly high anyway to support a family for a prolonged period.

You need to decide what you both want to achieve with your lives (aside from having kids) and start to work on that. You've got bags of time and no reason to rush kids.

Plus your current friends will probably likely drift apart from you, for a few years at least - you'd be busy with kids and other young people probably don't want to sit around talking about cracked nipples and teething anyway. I found it hard to relate to friends with kids at that age and that seems to be fairly common. The mothers at NCT and mum social groups all tend to be at least 30 so you may also struggle there a little.

Aside from all that, he doesn't want kids now anyway so it's all a bit of a moot point.

OP seems to have lobbed her grenade and legged it! Not sure she's going to be back with us.

It's an interesting topic though. For me, the best way to phrase the money thing is not that low income people shouldn't have children. It's that having children on a low income throws up sufficient potential challenges, especially in the austerity climate, that if you have an option to make your situation less challenging, it's worth doing. As our definitely genuine OP is 23 and has a degree, that would suggest that even waiting a couple of years to better establish herself would probably be sensible, whereas if she were 37 and realistically was never going to earn much more, I'd probably say go for it.

It's not like the choices are baby at 23 on NMW or baby at 40 whilst a high paid CEO. You can have one at 26 having got some workplace qualifications under your belt and a couple of salary raises.