AIBU to be pissed off with these school mums?

[Akiddleydiveytoo]

DD1 is in yr8 and about 3 weeks before the end of last term a letter was sent home to inform parents that, as a result of uniform standards dropping over the last few years they were going to start enforce the uniform rules more vigorously in the new school year. As part of this we were told that jeans, leggings, jeggings and skinny trousers were no longer going to tolerated and anyone in breach of these dress codes would be placed in isolation until the acceptable uniform was brought into school to change into. As well as the letter home this message was subsequently emailed to parents, put on Facebook and Twitter so people could not fail to see it in one form or another. It was made VERY clear that only tailored trousers (or skirts) would be allowed.

Over the school holidays there were a number of posts on the parent's Facebook page asking for recommendations on where to get trousers from. Lots of parents responded with links to skinny trousers. I (and some other parents) pointed out that these were no longer allowed but the responses were always 'well my older DD always wore them and she's never been told off' or 'DD will only wear skinny trousers' or 'the tailored trousers just don't look right on DD, she's too skinny' etc.

Anyway, first day back today and, as predicted, a LOT of warnings were given out to girls in skinny trousers/leggings. Instead of going straight to isolation, however, as the letter said, they were given a yellow slip to take home to their parents and given until Monday to sort out the correct uniform.

Cue a torrent of outrage on the parents Facebook page. Emails, letters, phone calls to the school to say how outrageous it was and how they'd spent a fortune on these trousers and how they weren't prepared to buy anymore. Giving any excuse under the sun why their DDs can't possibly be expected to wear proper tailored trousers etc.

AIBU to be really pissed off with these parents? They were given at least 9 weeks notice of this and the consequences for not conforming were made very clear, they just didn't feel as though the rules applied to them. OK, they might not feel as though uniform is all that important for learning but if the school imposes a (reasonable) rule you follow it right? It would have cost them just as much to buy tailored trousers as it would skinny. What example are they setting their DC if they're teaching them they can just ignore rules that they don't like?

What does putting into isolation mean, well I know what it means of course, but is it like a prison in schools these days.

YABU because this is none of your concern how other parents dress their kids!

@wibbletooth

Her initial pair were within school guidlines. Her thighs slightly bigger due to sports activities. And definitely no heels.

Just the showing of ankle when seated. Gobsmacked when received call.

And really on the floor for second call after going out purchasing new.

I'm all for keeping in lines with school wear, and I know girls will roll up i did secondary but she's always been inline with uniform, prefect ect.

I'm tempted email the head over this, but will probably suck up and buy my new as to my daughter would be embarrassing

@WineOclock2019 I would go back in hard on this as you bought the trousers at the regulation place and two of the styles were partially suitable but not obviously wrong when standing.

I would play them at their own game and put in a formal safeguarding complaint if they are not able to protect your dd from other staff or pupils who will be distracted by a glimpse of ankle because that is seriously odd in this day and age. Not least because what happens if she goes in on a different day wearing a skirt and socks and so her ankle is actually on display. Or what happens if she has a growth spurt and suddenly her trousers show an extra cm of leg?

Also do the uniform requirements stipulate the need for the ankle to be covered at all times even whens sitting? Does the official supplier put a reminder on to this end on their website or tell people if they shop there in person? Are there any other unwritten requirements that you should know about that you haven't been told about and yet the dc are being judged on?

Has your dd been able to look at others sitting in the classes she is in or at lunch etc to see how many people are flashing their ankles? And then you need to ask how many of them have been sent to buy new trousers...

You would hope that most staff are able to identify the good kids, the troublemakers, the ones that always want to bend the uniform rules to make it their own style, the ones with poor parents that can't afford to buy new uniform the moment it's needed but have to wear it for as long as possible, the ones that are sporty or a bit chubbier than they should be and so on - and should be able to apply common sense to work out who is abusing the uniform rules and who isn't.

But please, please, put your complaint in as a safeguarding complaint before you buy any more trousers because they can't ignore it - they have a legal obligation to formally deal with it and its one of the things that they are monitored on so OFSTED will get to see it too. It will reflect so badly on the school that they are saying that an ankle glimpse is distracting to males and that it's the females that need to change but they're not doing anything to rectify the situation with regard to the male behaviour - it might just give them the right push to make them realise how bonkers they are being.

Well it doesn’t affect their learning
No it doesn't but it reflects badly on the School's image. A uniform and students are a representation of the school. Parents ignoring school rules and policy shows their poor judgement, bad example to their DC and a distinct lack of respect to those in authority. If you do those things in a company, you would receive a warning and disciplinary action.

Maybe schools should stop worrying about their image and worry more about kids’ learning. Cos certainly when they go to uni, and possibly when they get a job, no one will be worried about how skinny their trousers are or if they are showing a cm of ankle when they sit down.

I think it is particularly awful to be picking on girls’ trousers. A healthy active mid teen girl is probably going to have a waist hip ratio that looks provocative even in frumpy school trousers, without her even trying. Certainly my DD (skinny but generous of bum) ended up in the trouser equivalent of a potato sack trying to avoid the Not Tight rule. And they don’t even put belt loops on the things.

@wibbletooth

Yes both pairs trousers brought from suggested places, unfortunate to DD when she sits ankles and not suitable .

Definitely odd in this day and age safeguarding issue for pupils/staff due to ankle revealing and slightly tighter round thigh/buttocks area.

Like I said prior, she is in GCSE PE, as well as her outside sport activities, growing, thighs mainly atm. Nearly 14 so all this been major hormonal disaster for her.

I will ask her her tomorrow to let me know of ankle showing between other students. They presented her will longer socks from there supply, as she had trainer type on fitting with her school shoes to hide ankles.

No mention to ankles need to be hidden when sitting/standing.

She is (and definitely not a stealth boast but model student) Always top set above average, and would do everything please her teachers, held her own (which she was allowed leave early for from secondary) after school sports class at primary school for few last years. My boys however (primary age) are completely different. most loving boys but academically below average (which I'm fine with. All learn at own pace) , so could understand if people thought was being precious....I'm not.
Just putting that for comparison.

I hate the fact DD feeling low over showing ankle when always strived to please and do well.

As well as thinking that she should take this feeling of dressing through college/uni/work. When teachers are telling you cover up ankles

Wow, where does your DD go to school, Wine, 1837?

If the poor delicate males in the school can not cope with - gasp- a glimpse of ankle (Quelle horreur!!), there has to be something seriously wrong with the school’s culture. I think the suggestion of mooting a safeguarding complaint is an excellent one. Should nip any further nuisance calls firmly in the bud.

As far as the OP goes, YABU to be ‘furious’ about what other parents do or don’t do, regarding uniform. I’m somebody who thinks uniform is ridiculous, particularly when a school decides to waste lots of staff time in enforcing it to the nth level of pettiness. I cannot for the life of me see what the problem with skinny trousers is. It just seems that schools try their hardest to ensure their pupils aren’t wearing anything fashionable, whatever that fashion currently is. If baggy trousers were currently in, you can bet your bottom dollar they would be busting a gut to eliminate them instead. It’s all so silly, and a real distraction from teaching.

I don’t buy the argument that uniform is a leveller, because in my experience it just isn’t- kids find other things to bully about, and it is very obvious where kids sit in the social pecking order once play dates come about. It’s just an expensive ball-ache for parents on top of the other 997 things we have to juggle every day.

Wineoclock you have got to take it to the logical conclusion. My guys don't wear any uniform, they have discipline and participate in education. If anything the girls and boys are more friends and more respectful of each other. And pervy teachers would be given hell.

This is why my kids will be attending the local uniform-free high school. Let them wear what they like and are comfortable in! FWIW I worked in a large accountancy firm and rebelled against their stupid suit and tie dress code. No, I would rather not wear a suit, skirt and tights and yes, they could reprimand me if they wanted (they didn’t). Now I work somewhere less ‘grey’ than my previous workplace. Most of my colleagues have phDs/masters degrees and are highly respected in our field. I’m looking around. One is wearing his gym clothes, most of us are comfortably dressed, none in suits. Because it makes fuck all difference to how we perform professionally.

I ignore stupid uniform rules
DD is only 9
Her school says no dyed hair, she has purple fading to pink.
They say no leggings, i tell dd to wear them if she likes as their reasoning is CRAP. It apparently comes down to they too form fitting and "distracting" to the boys.
I dont deem that a valid reason to say no leggings, thats blaming women and girls for a boy or mans urges and possible reactions. Teach the boys not to be lil perves a better way to go

Their stupid pointless rules can get fucked when they REFUSE to even fix a bloody door handle that allowed DD to be locked in a class for 20 minutes, the teacher didnt even notice she was missing.
In a loop hole in laws here a school built before a certain year dont have to comply to modern safety standards, or broken down, a kid in an older school isnt deemed worthy of the same safety standards as kids in a newer school. The school would rather hide behind this loop hole than fix the door handles and make the school safe

Love your username Fagashjackie!

Ha ha showing her ankles! That post HAS to be satire, surely?!!

@Kiwiinkits

I wish it was satire...I really do. Instead of a call to work from their welfare officer, saying they had resolved it for now. Provided her with some socks which went over the ankles. She had trainer socks at the time in line with their school shoe policy, brogues, no heels ect. But ankle present. Second purchase of trousers also didn't go down well

I hate people who think they are too special to follow the rules. It really annoys me.

The world is led by rule breakers and creative thinkers.

In that case wineoclock2018 I would seriously consider whether that petty, grey, straight line, factory culture is going to teach your daughter the right values to succeed in a world that requires pragmatism, creativity, adaptivity and collectivism.
The world has moved on. We don’t need schools to produce robots. We already have robots to do robot work.

I would play them at their own game and put in a formal safeguarding complaint if they are not able to protect your dd from other staff or pupils who will be distracted by a glimpse of ankle

Completely agree

Will definitely be putting a complaint in...and will not be purchasing a third set of trousers over weekend.

I could understand if it was skirt majorly short and then contacted, trousers and ankles though.

Definitely don't want to teach her that in our household. We're strict with certain limits school/homework. But each finding themselves if you know what I mean? For instance she has all the make up, but still doesnt wear it. She's academic enough to pursue any career, but I want her to pursue what ever makes her happy. Definitely don't need school being like robots...They're all for their own stats for next students. Schools need to start being more diverse. And especially uniform attire

They're not your rules OP therefore not your problem. Carry on doing what you're doing and let them do the same.
Not your problem.

If staff had noticed the trousers were too short then they are non regulation. Fashionable 7/8 length may flatter her thighs but they want everyone looking the same not dressing to their own style.
I’m sure the appreciate she is a model student but what’s that got to do with it . However it’s not fair if the model students get to wear modified uniform and the “horrible” kids get pulled up over theirs is it?

I think it does become the OP's problem when the school has to spend hours enforcing the uniform policy that could be spent on more productive things. I hope the school stands firm.

Our school when I was a
Child gave the parents nearly a years notice of changes, including only navy or black coats and jackets, particular style skirt from a school clothing shop etc - I don't think 9 weeks is enough personally, but the barrage of 'no fair' is a bit pathetic

I know of a family like this at DS school they "tweak" the school uniform so their DC are slightly trendier than the others. They also don't think the rules regarding the school carpark apply to them. The parents are lovely (and v laid back) but DC have seemed a bit entitled when i have met them (numerous occassions)
FWIW i do think some school rules are silly or pointless (like not being able to remove your blazer in hot weather, or having to wear the school branded skirt when m and s do a similar one for half the price) but some RL rules seem pointless as well but mostly w can pick and choose which ones we feel like, without consequence.

Oh ... and at my school there was still outrage - no time length is long enough I suspect, it's more about being 'told' what to do and not liking it

I stopped at traffic lights just outside a secondary school yesterday at going home time and genuinely didn’t notice what any of the pupils crossing (lots of them) were wearing, save for a general impression of navy