AIBU to be pissed off with these school mums?

[Akiddleydiveytoo]

DD1 is in yr8 and about 3 weeks before the end of last term a letter was sent home to inform parents that, as a result of uniform standards dropping over the last few years they were going to start enforce the uniform rules more vigorously in the new school year. As part of this we were told that jeans, leggings, jeggings and skinny trousers were no longer going to tolerated and anyone in breach of these dress codes would be placed in isolation until the acceptable uniform was brought into school to change into. As well as the letter home this message was subsequently emailed to parents, put on Facebook and Twitter so people could not fail to see it in one form or another. It was made VERY clear that only tailored trousers (or skirts) would be allowed.

Over the school holidays there were a number of posts on the parent's Facebook page asking for recommendations on where to get trousers from. Lots of parents responded with links to skinny trousers. I (and some other parents) pointed out that these were no longer allowed but the responses were always 'well my older DD always wore them and she's never been told off' or 'DD will only wear skinny trousers' or 'the tailored trousers just don't look right on DD, she's too skinny' etc.

Anyway, first day back today and, as predicted, a LOT of warnings were given out to girls in skinny trousers/leggings. Instead of going straight to isolation, however, as the letter said, they were given a yellow slip to take home to their parents and given until Monday to sort out the correct uniform.

Cue a torrent of outrage on the parents Facebook page. Emails, letters, phone calls to the school to say how outrageous it was and how they'd spent a fortune on these trousers and how they weren't prepared to buy anymore. Giving any excuse under the sun why their DDs can't possibly be expected to wear proper tailored trousers etc.

AIBU to be really pissed off with these parents? They were given at least 9 weeks notice of this and the consequences for not conforming were made very clear, they just didn't feel as though the rules applied to them. OK, they might not feel as though uniform is all that important for learning but if the school imposes a (reasonable) rule you follow it right? It would have cost them just as much to buy tailored trousers as it would skinny. What example are they setting their DC if they're teaching them they can just ignore rules that they don't like?

I completely agree with the OP. I saw over 34 years of teaching that in most cases going against the uniform code was a strong indicator that the child would be the same in his or her attitude to learning for various reasons.

My advice is not to get too het up about it. The fact that other parents are acting like naughty children supporting their own offspring in rule infringements means the school and staff will look very favourably on those children and parents who support them. They are giving your DC a real advantage.

nuxe can you link to a source for that assertion?

The top performing girls school,which has been the top performing school for decades, St Paul’s, which has no uniform. If all these assertions about the effects of uniform are correct, then how can that possibly be?

nuxe if that was even remotely true, no students from any US high schools would ever succeed academically.

WTF planet do you have to be on to think you can just have some kind of black trainer thang and be fine?

Both my ds's now go to school in black trainers, because the last time I turned up at school half an hour early for pick up, they had my youngests class out doing the mile run in their school uniform and leather shoes. I wouldn't go for a run in a pair of leather shoes, why would I expect my 5 year old to? The school have never asked for trainers to be sent in for this activity, and I'm guessing they can't wear their gym shoes because they aren't allowed outdoor shoes in the gym hall, even although that's where the kids who have a packed lunch eat, that's where they hold every assembly and school fayre .

I saw over 34 years of teaching that in most cases going against the uniform code was a strong indicator that the child would be the same in his or her attitude to learning for various reasons.

And the response to the issue of lack of engagement with school is what - to double down on uniform rules and enforcement?

Or should it involve getting to the bottom of the issue instead of believing in the magic powers of coloured fabric?

YANBU. Those parents sounds really entitled.

When uniform rules start to become lax you often get a resultant drop in good behaviour

Is it the case, in your experience, that the only thing the school got lax on was uniform, while maintaining a strict line on everything else? So we know it must be the uniform, because that’s the only thing that changed at that time? I would personally find that unlikely, and would suspect that the diminished zeal about uniform enforcement would reflect a general slackening of standards, including enforcing behavioural requirements.

Like math I would be interested in seeing any stats that back up your observations.

Perhaps the OP just feels sorry for the staff in terms of what it has to do with them.

As pointed out however, we all know ‘these’ parents and if I’m accused of being judgmental so be it. I’m not a snob, I went to a comp and lived on a council estate with a single mum. But she made sure I wore the uniform. Not black trainers. Not jeans instead of trousers. And it wasn’t a fixed uniform where you had to buy the school gear so could be bought cheaply from BHS etc so there was no argument to saving money by not doing so. Some people just think they can say fuck it and let them wear leggings etc instead. As a Geordie these are what we called charvers but are called chavs nationally.

An fuck you Owen Jones it’s not a demonisation of the working classes. It’s the working classes themselves who have to live next door to these people who despair. Fuck off to anyone calling me stuck up for taking the piss out of these people and their names.

Would be funny to see the names of the uniforms objectors. Probably loads of Demis, Jayden’s and the like

I love rules and they'll have to follow them in life so if they can't follow them now they don't stand a chance.

It would annoy me too and the parents need to grow the hell up. They're wasting the staffs time with all this malarkey.

For anybody who says what kids are wearing won't hurt anyone. Well wearing their correct uniform won't hurt them then.

Might be time to withdraw and unfollow them

YABU to be pissed off because it's not your business. However, they are idiots who clearly lack basic comprehension skills so personally I would sit back and smile at the consequences and complaints they will make about it when it is clearly their own faults.

It's not a good idea to teach DC that rules are for 'other' people - what we need to teach them is how to get a stupid rule overturned, because the people with power are often wrong. And, in many cases (school uniform being one) collective action is what will work, and it's really good for DC to learn to plan, work together etc. And seeing petty authority and stupid, generally bad rules done away with is so encouraging.

I understand SGBs attitude with regard to ‘resisting authority’ with regard to petty rules but that is only good if the parents are otherwise good people. Unfortunately this resistance goes beyond stupid rules for the type of people i was brought up about and in practice means resisting any basic law or moral code such as not stealing, not being violent, not spitting or dumping all your rubbish on the street etc etc

I'd find it annoying if a mum/dad was moaning to or going on about it all being so unfair about the uniform...if they don't listen to what is being said by the school then that's up to them.

I think I'd view them as not particularly intelligent if they cannot follow guidance/advice from the school

School uniforms has to be standardised especially when it's been 'interpreted' to the extreme.

Reminds me of secondary school where there were girls with properly indecent mini skirts and those goth types with the ones scraping along the floor!

Correlation does not imply causation. Shame that doesn't ever seen to get through to those in education that think that wearing the wrong trousers causes children to be naughty and justifies excluding them from mainstream education for a period of time. I personally see it as just part of this nasty authoritarian streak we have in this country that is doing so much damage at the moment.

Amazing how other countries manage behaviour perfectly well without uniforms at all.

I know people say that 'oh, it doesn't affect their learning' etc what they are wearing, but personally I think they are missing the point

For me, wearing correct school uniform helps build a sense of belonging to something bigger than you as an individual.

What's the problem with just getting the regulation uniform...why the skinny jeans/trousers or leggings? it's clearly school uniform so what do these stupid parents expect??

My step daughters mum is like that, but it’s her child who gets punished. Even when we go out and buy her the correct uniform it’ll never come back and her mum will always put her in incorrect uniform. My step daughter doesn’t like the comments teacher make about her (her mums) disregard for the rules.

Parents are twats but sadly it’s the children that suffer.

Yanbu op. Parents like this drive me insane!

What on earth does it have to do with you? I can't see why it upsets you so much. It's bizarre.

It has everything to do with others ! We had the same problem at our school and now have total branded uniform so there are no discrepancies.
It now means the price of uniform has nearly quadrupled so unfair.

*it's clearly NOT school uniform!

I should say that I've seen so many academies implement grammar school - style uniform policies in some misguided belief that it is their uniforms that make them good schools that it just grates. I'm all for sensible rules but when we have ridiculous stories each year of tens of pupils being isolated for minor uniform infractions such as not wearing approved trousers with purple piping on the pockets it massively undermines any credibility head teachers who implement these policies had.

For me, wearing correct school uniform helps build a sense of belonging to something bigger than you as an individual.

Well you are of course entitled to your opinion. I'm just not sure what it really has to do with education though, which to the students is very much an individual activity.

I’m pretty certain other countries or schools here can manage without a school uniform but I’m making my own assumptions now about these parents and it really isn’t in my mind solely about school uniforms. It could be about anything really. If it wasn’t uniforms it would be about turning up on time, or about why homework needs completing or about why their kids shouldn’t be told off for misbehaving. I’d just try to stay clear of these people as a parent although could be difficult depending on how much of the overall make up of the school they constitute. It’s why some rich people or even less rich people scrimp to send their kids private. Comps are fine when the parents are fine but you get people like a PP vehemently against fee paying schools when they live in ‘nice’ areas with ‘nice’ parents which has the same effect where you have to be well off to fall within the catchment

And good point moreofas. If people respected the basic rules then like the school I went to parents could shop around at cheap places like Primark etc and see badages on but when people take the piss schools find it easier to enforce an even stricter rule when everyone has to buy official rip off merchant four times more expensive kit from the schools exclusive supliert

my dd's school has the same rules i did buy her slim trousers from m&s but these do pass uniform rules as do her skirts (pencil skirt with a tiny split at the back look exactly the same as the official uniform shop sells) i dont know why leggings would be part of a childs school uniform anyway or jeans for that matter

Lots of typos but I’m sure people get the gist. It’s going back some time now but as long as parents stuck up to defined spec they were entitled to shop at BHS, M&S, C&A or whatever. Think only the jumpers were official in order not to be different shades of whatever the school colour was and these were handed down for years between siblings or could be acquired second hand