To wish we could stop the societal belief that women will/should have children

[SeeTe]

I've just been saying on another thread how I wish I'd been brought up to be more confident with a life without DC. It's practically embedded into society that women / girls WILL go onto have children, 'when you grow up and have children of your own' etc...

I had a lot of fertility issues when TTC and lost a lot of pregnancies and it got me thinking that the thing that affected me the most was that I had this belief that I wasn't a proper woman because this is what women should do and should be able to do and if I'd not grown in a society where everyone acted as though it was a given that this would happen then I may not have taken it so hard. I couldn't be satisfied with 'just' my life because I'd always thought it would involve children one day and it's just the way your life is supposed to go.

I'm not sure exactly what changes I'd like to make but being through what I have done, I don't want to encourage my child into the way of thinking that I grew up with, 'one day you'll be married and have kids etc.'

I don't even know if I'm making sense but I want my DC to be encouraged that there isn't this one perfect way of life that everyone should follow and if they can't then there's something wrong with them and they'll never have as good of a life without it.

I feel like far too many people take it as a given and pass that belief onto their children when in reality it really isn't guaranteed.

I think the notion that society pressures women into having children

It's not at all that I think the reason people have children is because of pressure from society. I just believe there definitely is an undercurrent in society that people will have children, especially women and are considered odd if they don't.

Of course, insulting children is going to get people's backs up but they do it anyway.

Did someone specifically name your children and attribute insults directly at them?

Or are you seriously Officially Offended because a random stranger on the internet made less than adoring and doting references to completely fictitious or otherwise unspecified children in general?

I can’t stand men wearing hats indoors. If you know a male who wears a hat indoors are you also mortally offended by that too?

I don’t know how you have the time or energy to get so worked up on behalf of a figment of someone’s imagination tbh.

I don't know why this discussion always gets so heated! It's personal choice - you either want children, or you don't. I wouldn't try to convince someone that didn't want children otherwise, and no one would have been able to convince me not to have children.

Have a thought for those struggling to conceive, or those who had children and regretted it instead of penalising people for a choice they are more than entitled to make/not make!

This thread threw insults on both sides quite early on but it is interesting reading.

The simple fact is that no one should be judging another person. The people who said those who had kids were unimaginative and unintelligent. Well that is an insult.
And the comments about bitch dragging a poor thing into her life!!!

Then the comments from the other side about being putting materialistic things first or don't know what they are missing or about maturity, are rude and misinformed.

Everyone needs to do their life their way. It's far better to be childfree then to regret having them. It is also better to be childfree than to have them, but to be materialistic and ignore them. Or to be a bad parent in the myriad of ways that it is possible to be a bad parent.

What I have learnt from this thread is to not say "when you have children" , I will now say "if you have children".

And I will not do the societal thing of assuming marriage means kids. I have been guilty of that in the past but yes it must really grate either way (childless or child free) to be asked these questions again and again.

I have kids and always wanted them. The majority of my friends have them and lots of them. However I do know a few women who do not have them or want them. For some circumstance and for some choice.

What needs to stop is the judgement on both sides.

You do not need to tall me about plastic tat, the environment and overpopulation and I do not need to tell you what you are missing and that kids bring pleasure, that you are materialistic or that you need to mature, blah blah blah.

It is just not necessary, nice or needed. Both sides need to grow up and stop judging.

It is just not necessary, nice or needed. Both sides need to grow up and stop judging.

I think the overall balance is weighted one way though (in society generally, not just MN) - to be pro-motherhood and anything else is a bit to one degree or another.

And I am one of many who is sick and tired of the dripdripdrip of being looked at like that so yeah its quite possible we will get our defences in first now, before we have the pitying looks and patronising comments.

BuzzShitbagBobbly

Random unspecified comments made about childless/free people seem to incite the same reaction, but presumably that's OK?

I'm not 'officially offended' as you put it, but people saying vile things about children (on other threads) on a parenting website, simply because they don't like or want children does upset me a little bit, yes.

But the feelings of embarrassment, guilt on my parents, like I was failing at this BIG thing in life that everyone else was doing, was definitely because it's what people expect from you and what you've been told to expect from being young.

I think the main problem that women have, in all areas of life, is the inability to be confident and assertive. Guilt is a completely wasted emotion. It serves no purpose except to cause issues for the person feeling it. And that's mostly women.

Personally I never feel guilty or embarrassed. I don't care what other people's expectations are of me and am more than happy to tell them to mind their own business if necessary.

The sooner women ditch these negative feelings from their lives the happier they will be. The only person who can make you feel bad is you.

@flirtygirl - A very sensible post.

Brilliant post flirtygirl

@MagicKingdomDizzy are you named after the game? If so, legendary!

#offthread