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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that No Deal Brexit is the only option now

493 replies

Bearbehind · 25/08/2019 09:21

I’m a staunch Remainer, I think Brexit is absolute madness but I can’t see any way out of this mess except No Deal now - the division is too great and views are too entrenched

Leavers insist it will all be fine so the
only option is to do it and see what happens

The way I see it, anything less will just lead to the uprise of the Brexit Party until we ‘leave properly’ anyway.

We might as well just jump of the cliff now. If it’s all rosey then great.

If it’s not at least we can start to repair the damage sooner rather than later

OP posts:
bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 17:27

Don't order me to "move on". Live with a different opinion.

DarkAtEndOfUK · 27/08/2019 17:29

Starmer today is reported as saying that Labour is a Remain Party. Again. Waiting for Barry Gardiner to pop up and correct him.

I contacted my MP recently over Brexit and was told exactly the same thing: Labour are now pro-Remain: pro a second Referendum, and if they secure one, they would campaign on Remain.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 17:35

How's the "arbitration" thread going?

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 18:22

So watching the news over the weekend it seems that the Boris strategy is starting to get the EU back to the negotiation table. The more we get ready for a no deal the more chance we have of a last minute deal.

On the opposition front today they seem to have dumped the idea of a vonc and a gnu. So their strategy is to pass legislation to ask for an extension? to stop Boris, which he can probably just ignore. But maybe it will throw a spanner in the works of any last minute deal and force us out empty handed.

So ironic that remainers could be the cause of a no deal.

Thymeout · 27/08/2019 18:23

Dark Corbyn still hasn't said that he'd campaign to remain on ANY deal. Only in a referendum on a bad deal. If Labour won a GE, Corbyn said there would still be Brexit and he would take his deal to the EU. There would obviously be no point in campaigning against his own deal.

If he had said it, it would be banner headlines. Starmer's statement today is repeating what he's been saying for months, but the words just seem to stick in Corbyn's mouth. He's heavily influenced by Labour Leaver MPs.

I'd guess your MP is in the Starmer/Watson camp, which represents the majority of the PLP and the Membership.

The party is split with the Leadership inner circle on the opposite side from everyone else.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 18:31

This may well cue up Johnson to deliver an NI only backstop Deal to Parliament and to say "you lot didn't want No Deal, here's a Deal". And see how many of them would be willing to support it.
The Cabinet Office just said that the only bit of WA that Johnson didn't support was the backstop. Rebrand the backstop to be an NI only backstop and put it back to Parliament.

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 18:35

Rebrand the backstop to be an NI only backstop and put it back to Parliament

Did you just see that unicorn running past the window? 👀

banana64 · 27/08/2019 18:39

dont get why the EU is insisting on an 'insurance policy' for Ireland which might never be needed

Because the English cant be trusted.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 18:46

Don't give a shit newstart1337 . I despise Brexit but I would rather a crock of orderly shite to No Deal.

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 18:54

I despise Brexit but I would rather a crock of orderly shite to No Deal

Its not even a crock of orderly shite, the Conservative & Unionist party would never cut N.Ireland loose, MPs would never vote for it, and it would destroy the Tories. Boris might be many things but he wants to be PM not hang himself.

Havanananana · 27/08/2019 18:54

So watching the news over the weekend it seems that the Boris strategy is starting to get the EU back to the negotiation table. The more we get ready for a no deal the more chance we have of a last minute deal.

This may be the impression you get from Sky News, the Mail, Telegraph and other Brexit-promoting media, but this is not true.

It is Johnson who refuses to go to the negotiating table without the pre-condition of the removal of the Backstop. The EU has always been prepared to give the new PM the courtesy of listening to his proposals, but as yet 1) he's refused to meet them and 2) he hasn't got any new proposals - they've all been rejected or debunked already.

As for last-minute deals, the EU has been ready for the UK leaving without a deal since March. Their world has moved on. They are busy signing new deals with Japan and Mercosur. When Johnson has a quiet chat with Merkel or Macron, he's not talking to the EU, whose delegated negotiator is Barnier. Merkel, Tusk and Macron have all told him that negotiations are over unless he comes up with something new. All of his public blustering, wiff-waff and piffle-paffle is intended for the Brexit supporters as he attempts to put the blame for the impending disaster on the EU, Remoaners, Gloomsters, Doomsters, Irish, Civil Servants, and anyone else he can think of as he prepares for a General Election.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 27/08/2019 18:57

How's the "arbitration" thread going?

I think people are bored of it 😂

OP posts:
bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 18:59

Interesting you think people prefer NI over Brexit when all the recent polls show the opposite to be the case.

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 18:59

This may be the impression you get from Sky News, the Mail, Telegraph and other Brexit-promoting media, but this is not true.
So why is David Frost going over to the EU tomorrow to negotiate an alternative to the back stop?

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 19:02

Interesting you think people prefer NI over Brexit
Its not a choice between the two. When you force people to choose between two things they want that doesn't mean they dont want the other. aka how to spin news.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 19:03

Another No Dealer, then.

newstart1337 · 27/08/2019 19:18

Another No Dealer, then
Nope, I would have been fine if remain had won the referendum but they didn't. I would have been fine with the WA but Parliament didn't want a deal. I will probably be ok with a Boris deal. I will live with 'no deal' if it comes to that. But this has gone on for to long we do need to leave the EU and move on to repair (or not) whatever needs to be repaired.

The idea from the opposition to just extend again is ridiculous. Madness is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Just pull the plaster off and get on with it.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 19:23

"Just pull the plaster off and get on with it."
And fuck NI?

chomalungma · 27/08/2019 19:23

But this has gone on for to long we do need to leave the EU and move on to repair (or not) whatever needs to be repaired

But Northern Ireland.

That's the 'elephant in the room".

We want to take back control of our borders - but we don't want a border between the UK and the EU..

That is a mutually incompatible statement - and one that I have not seen any person sensibly answer.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 27/08/2019 19:24

bellini in the interests of sensible, civil discussion and putting what you’d like to happen aside, where do you see us going from here?

The Tories have a barely (if at all) workable majority but they don’t want to lose power.

The BP have pledged to support them in a GE if they go with no deal.

Corbyn is too power hungry to realise the Labour Party can’t win because of him.

The obvious route is no deal then a GE with a a Tory win (because NF will realise too late no one needs him and his BP by then)

I know you’ll disagree on principle - so where does this go?

OP posts:
Original poster
Bearbehind · 27/08/2019 19:25

Madness is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Totally agree

OP posts:
bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 19:32

I have an Irish born Mum. I will never do anything to support No Deal because of what it would do to GFA. And while you have made your peace with it for reasons of your own, I never will. If it happens, I couldn't look at myself in the mirror knowing I had embraced it.
So I will support any hair brained attempt to stop it.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 27/08/2019 19:36

So I will support any hair brained attempt to stop it.

Ok, so now we’ve established that you’re happy with plans with no basis in reality I know it’s pointless trying to discuss only actual feasible options with you.

I understand your rationale, I just think it’s an unrealistic stance to take.

OP posts:
Doubletrouble99 · 27/08/2019 19:38

Tymeout - Alister Jack was born in Dumfries as far as I know, he's no English man!
Havana - BJ was in talks with Tusk at the weekend, he has also talked to Barnier today and as has been said he is sending a negotiator over to Brussels this week.
Belinni - It's not a matter of being a 'no dealer' it's what is very likely to happen so all the businesses and governmentt depts. should be ready for it. Grant Shaps the new Transport Sec. was very positive about all the detail being worked out on a daily basis when he was interviewed on Sunday.

bellinisurge · 27/08/2019 19:38

Understanding my rationale is an improvement on ordering me to agree with you and putting your caps lock on.