...to think that children should look after elderly parents?

[wheresmymojo]

It's not a TAAT but inspired by another thread.

It seems to be a general trend that people feel like they shouldn't have any duty/obligation to care for their elderly parents anymore.

Partly I recognise that this is because societal trends make it harder to do elder care than it used to be - it's quite common to have two full time workers, be living quite far from your parents, still have DC to care for at the same time due to later births, etc.

I find it odd though that anyone wouldn't want to care for their elderly parents and find a way to make it happen.

So for example, we have just moved to live near to DH's parents who are in their 70s as while they don't need any help now, we know they will at some point in the next 10yrs.

My DM is very young (56!) so definitely doesn't need any help. I live 200 miles away but have already had the discussion that when she is elderly I'd like her to come and live with us.

I feel like I'm in the minority though these days?

I realise there are of course exceptions - any parental abuse and there will always be people who have very complex situations that mean it isn't possible (e.g. can't afford to move, already have children of their own with special needs, etc).

But I think it's sad that the average person either (a) thinks of it as an obligation/burden that they don't want to do or (b) thinks they don't have any obligation at all.

Also @RosaWaiting, I think we have crossed wires, when I said 'we need to find solutions' I meant society as a whole needs to deal with the fact that we have an ageing population.... Have I misunderstood you?

And I strongly object to the perjorative term "left in" old people's homes.
My father is receiving palliative care in the most fabulous residential home ever. There is no way that we could provide the care he needs (although we tried to support him as much as we could a year ago, until it all became too much). He elected himself to move into a home, and has been very happy there. He has more visitors than anyone else in the place, and in the last 10 weeks or so, I have made a 5 hour round trip to see him every single weekend, along with 3 out of the last 5 weeks sitting by his bedside.
So, anyone who thinks I don't care because he's not living with me, can fuck right off.

Also I agree with frequency that carers should be better respected and paid in our society, they do such an important job.

Very much depends on the relationship with your parents.

Even 'general elder' care is more than just getting them up, washed and dressed and making sure they're fed and living in a clean environment.

Their balance is poor. They need someone with them or close by 24/7 in case they fall. How can a family of two working parents manage that? People who receive care in their own homes have a falls pendant which automatically dials a team of specially trained carers to come and pick them using specialist equipment if they fall. Equipment which costs thousands of pounds.

YABU for so many reasons that pp's have already stated. There are so many variables in each situation.

Mine and my husband's families live at pretty much opposite end of the country, so should we move near his or my parents?! At the moment we are in the middle, about 4 hours away from both. So that is too far for proper looking after of either, but we can visit. If we were to move closer to mine or his the other would be 8 hours away, which would mean less visits! You couldn't win.

I also despise the 'well our parents cared for us and gave up their lives' attitude. You choose to have children and you know that they are completely your responsibility. After all no one asks to be born. My parents were not the best carers as parents either so I think I would struggle to give them what I never received.
I hate the idea of my unborn child having to give up years of their life to look after me, that's not why I'm starting a family.

I have also read threads on here where the poster is so stressed and miserable looking after their parents that their own children's lives are suffering and being neglected.

Maybe it's easy for some people and maybe it'll work out for you, but don't assume the same for everyone- and don't assume it'll work out for you either.

I guess it depends on the family dynamic. For example I have been estranged from my parents for years, both for different reasons but generally it came down to abuse. I haven't been a part of my parents lives for many years, however my older sister is extremely close to my mum and will be responsible for her. I have made my peace with that, and in return I have no interest in her assets/will once the time does come. My dad will have one of his other many children, and again I won't be privy to any part of his estate (if there even is one).

On the flip side my OH's family are very close, and all will chip in to look after his mum (dad is already passed). She wouldn't want to go into a home, and we will all want to keep her in her own home as long as possible.

Not every family is loving, caring, supportive or even healthy.

I wasn't really thinking of the 24 hour care scenario. I agree at that stage most would need to be in a home as few would be able to cope with losing one full time wage.

I'm more talking about the following kind of things:

• My uncle who has already stated he won't be doing any caring at all for his mother

• Friend whose Nan with dementia was left in her own home 200 miles away despite being a danger to herself and others (kept leaving the gas on, had a kitchen fire). She didn't want to go into a home but no effort was put in to getting her sectioned and put into a home or moving her into the family home (both children were retired but still very fit with a large family home).

• My DH just wouldn't think about caring for his parents, he would happily emigrate now without giving a thought to how his parents might need us in a few years time

• General conversations with friends where they are clear they wouldn't consider having their parents living with them and see it as a burden.

These are all people I know well who have reasonable sized homes, no parental abuse (actually have perfectly decent parents), no complex situations (we're not talking about dementia or people with two lots of elderly parents at the same time).

My Mother lived healthy until her 80's and died quickly.

I've had health problems in my 50's and in my peer group we've had a range of health issues, including some deaths.

So how do you make decisions to devote time to one person, when things can change at any time? Especially without it being detrimental to your children?

Do you have children?

I don't expect my children to give up their freedom etc to provide care. We all did for the short time my Mother needed it, but she would ask us to back off, for the same unselfish reasons.

There comes a point, especially for Women when it becomes 'your time', because your life is all about the needs of others.

I don't understand some Grandparents attitude towards their Grandchildren, but it's ultimately up to them.

Whosorrynow apologies, cross posting everywhere.

My colleague's mother died about 2 years after my colleague started doing care.

I worry that I will end up in a similar situation tbh. I think the parent at 80 is a lot different than even 75 and if they are widowed, even worse. I absolutely adore my mother and - apologies if this makes anyone barf - even after about 3 days of not seeing her, I'm like "ooh I need a mummy cuddle". But I wouldn't wish old age on anyone. My father's last few weeks of life were appalling, but at least he didn't have to see old age and got the most out of life before falling ill.

If a parent sells up & puts the money towards a bigger house with one of the kids, what then happens if care is needed?

I think most people would want to provide care for their elderly parents. The reality is it can be bloody impossible. I, and my siblings, have cared for two parents with dementia for as long as we could at different times. It has torn the family apart.

You think raising babies to teens is exhausting? You know nothing until you have to care for an elderly person with dementia/alzheimers.

Do you know what it takes to actually take care of an elderly and unwell person?

So, yes, in a normal family you should feel responsible and try to help. However, many MN are in favour of kicking kids out at 16 and no longer giving them a penny to teach them independence, so I am guessing they won't get much help back later

Practically, it's very difficult or near impossible.

People don't want to move when they are still able, and why should they.
Once someone is genuinely unable to live alone, it's not that easy to put the need of your kids behind.

It is very difficult, I don't think it's practical for many people nowadays, but I agree, family should help each other but only as much as possible.

And as for this - really? Do you honestly think everyone can afford to move house just in case their parents need help in ten years time?

I specifically said in my OP that I'm not talking about situations where there are complicating factors and mentioned, for instance, not being able to afford to move.

It depends on what level of care you are talking about. I’m happy to take my mum to appts, sort out her shopping and finances and phone and visit several times a week. I wouldn’t be willing or able to give up my job to become a full time carer though. If she had dementia I would carefully choose a nursing home close to my home and visit her regularly but I wouldn’t move her in with me. I couldn’t cope and it would be bad for both of us.

And yes people are kept alive as long as possible, because they are cash cows being milked by nursing homes in some cases
that frail elderly person functions as an appliance which serves to liquidize assets and funnel them into the coffers of the nursing home

Yabu.

Not everyone has nice old dears for parents.

Not everyone lives near their parents.

And by "family" you mean "women".

I think you have a very simplistic view of what caring for an elderly relative can entail and hope that you never have to find out what it generally actually entails.

Practically, it's unlikely I'd be able to, given the ages of my DCs, that they will both still be at school if my Mum needs care at the age her mum needed care (both my brother and I had left Uni and left home by then, and both my parents were working only part time on a wind down towards retirement).

Having seen how hard it was mentally, not just physically, for my parents to look after my grandmother who was healthy in herself, but had dementia, and then the high quality of care she got in the home she went in when it got too much for my parents, I'm not sure I would take that step lightly.

It was like having a pre-schooler, that had to be constantly watched, monitored, could never be left and yet you couldn't hire a babysitter for a night out or send them to a nursery. She would talk constantly like a toddler, was too big to just pick up for she decided to throw a tantrum (again, like a small child), would go round switching on fires and cookers or unplugging the freezer...

It was mentally draining for them, and I'm not sure I could cope (they didnt very well and should have given in and used a home earlier), and there's no way I'd put my DCs through living with someone with dementia.

When people blithly say they'd look after elderly relatives, the assumption seems to be doing their gardening, cleaning and the big shop for them, or helping them in and out of the bath, taking to appointments etc.

Not hiding the car keys so they won't take the car out and smash it again (driving licence long gone, but so was the memory that the driving licence was gone...). Or having to rehome the cat as Nana's decided it's a pest and has taken to throwing things at it and won't be told it's their cat. Or having to install fire doors and locks on the cooker. Or getting your gas fire disconnected to make the whole house safer as she won't be told not to mess with it. Or walking into the kitchen to find every single cupboard has been emptied, but Nana hasn't a clue why she did it.

It's constant, and can be a decade or more of care. And unlike a small child, it just gets harder, not easier as time passes.

So no, I won't move my or DH's parents in. I will get them good care, and will look after their finances and visit, but not take them in.

When My DPs were in their 70s, I talked to DH about how we would have my DM living with us when DF passed away as he is older. Thankfully they are both still pretty well and are respectively 80 and 85. I have to say I'd be extremely reluctant to have DM living with us full time - for one thing she may not want to either. But other reasons are I'm nearly 50 and juggling work/peri menopause/teenager and ddog that DH decided was a good addition to the family . I'm already tired and looking forward to getting a bit of time to ourselves when DS is grown and we retire - hopefully early 60s.

Gawd help me I find my parents tiring to spend lots of time with - it's not their fault they have attitudes and opinions that were more acceptable a number of years ago and are accentuated by the papers they choose to read.

I love them and we see them regularly, and I would absolutely do everything I can to support them, but to me this would be helping to source care for them rather than physically delivering it myself.

"I wasn't really thinking of the 24 hour care scenario. I agree at that stage most would need to be in a home as few would be able to cope with losing one full time wage."

It's not just about losing a wage, it's about the level of care required. You sound naive.

OP "Friend whose Nan with dementia was left in her own home 200 miles away despite being a danger to herself and others (kept leaving the gas on, had a kitchen fire). She didn't want to go into a home but no effort was put in to getting her sectioned and put into a home or moving her into the family home (both children were retired but still very fit with a large family home)"

yes, I don't think you've got any idea how this really works. Good luck to you, hope you never find out.

gamer I do all of that too.

But I promised my mother that if she needed nursing care that I would put her in a home.

She took on the care of my gm - her mil - and it gave her mh issues thst have plagued her all her life.

I just want to point out OP that things are not always what they seem; just because your friends parents seem 'perfectly nice' doesn't mean you know the full story. My grandfather was emotionally abusive to both his sons but I'm sure all his neighbours and other people think he's 'perfectly nice' as they don't see what he's really like (and people won't necessarily tell you about bad relationships with parents because people can be so judgmental IME).

I agree with you in theory. But it really isn't as simple as that, is it? There are many factors in play that may make things difficult. For example:

• Social mobility means that many people don't live in close proximity to their parents.

• Finances. Who would pay my bills and fund my lifestyle if I had to give up work and care for my parents?

And, although not directly relevant .... who the hell do you suppose is going to care for me when I'm older