driving someone who says they may become unconscious

[Alwaysannoyingsomeonesmomehow]

Situation is an urgent need to relocate someone and their vehicle that they can't drive, their several children and nine animals, (half are bigger ones) and possessions, from where they are now, to where they 'absolutely have to be on x date' on a very low budget.

They insist they cant fly, or split up animals and people.
Not all animals and children are expected to travel well and all will be packed into tight space. (one animal to be drugged with possible breathing side effects)
The journey they need to undertake is a minimum of 9 hours, easily up to 12.

Physical end of driving isn't an issue. (am experienced long term commercial driver and know my stuff and how to do it.)

Adult has various conditions, mainly undiagnosed, but no question that some very serious stuff seems to be happening to them.

Long history of them apparently losing consciousness and then ending up comatose from hours to days. They're saying it's normal and likely to happen at any point on this journey and all fine, the kids are used to them being unconscious (not asleep) for hours on end.

I and another driver were both originally fine to take (and care for) animals and stuff when people were all flying, but then got 'people now must travel in vehicle too' sprung on us.

We think the normalizing of someone being unconscious (and in front of the children) and being expected to say 'oh well' and carry on if that happens, is dangerous, irresponsible, and beyond acceptable.

But as a result, this (much loved) person will now turn to a non commercial driver who they don't know, who says they'll do it, and place everyone's lives in random hands.

Adult is saying being unconscious for all or part of the journey isn't life threatening, it's just how their life is, welcome to the choices they have to make all the time, and we're making too big a deal out of it. The children are all so used to it all etc. However these are the same children who can't be split from their parent,each other, or animals for the journey because of anxiety.

I get it, and bodily autonomy, but it feels like being made to accept the unacceptable because otherwise the situation may get worse.

We're now second guessing ourselves. I think we're NBU, but are we making to much out of it?

Lucyfox that's the stance we took on the unconsciousness stuff, couldn't put the children into care.

jimmyhill not intentionally, though thanks for pointing out I'm saying more than I intended.

Thank you all for confirming that this is so far off the scale of acceptable that I shouldn't even need to ask.

What started as just a need for someone who could safely drive animals/stuff for a long time and provide care, turned into worrying implications for one animal when I started organizing details, then into people have to travel to, medical dramas to be ignored, and no alternative solution i came up with do-able for one or another reason.

I've been down where they currently are staying, and freaked out about the way they and others round them have taken all this stuff as fine and dandy and being effectively laughed at as not getting their reality post austerity cuts etc.

Helping them move was initially a bit of an ask but would help get them to where they'd potentially get support etc, then came all the rest of it and I reacted with 'hell no' but with so many around them seeing no problem, got to the point where I started thinking maybe I'm the one being histrionic.

I doubt any border control would let you through with a completely unconscious adult.. imagine how easy traffickers would have it, drug victim.. “aw she’s sleeping can’t wake her.” “no problem off you go”

And imagine the reaction to oh it’s a medical condition where they fall into a coma for a couple days no worries.. wtf.

What does “laughed at as not getting their reality post austerity cuts” mean?

I’m a fainter too so I’m also less outraged by it. When I was pregnant with my daughter I had pregnancy induced narcolepsy and there was no issue with me being unconscious, I was just left to it until I came round.

Are these people travellers, op?

to be honest, I would be tempted to take the stuff the animals and kids and leave the adult with problems.

I don't mean abandon them, but on their own I assume they can continue to stay with someone and continue with diagnosis? Or at least be admitted to hospital if unconscious?

The whole situation is a mess because of the number of things involved, but actually it is that one person at the centre who needs care, the rest could easily be transported safely.

Could one relative stay with/travel with/ look after the one adult, while you do the commercial driving side of things with everythign else?

There does come a point where family need to put their foot down and say no.

No way would I take responsibility for transporting an unconscious person without medical aid. If they died you could well be in serious trouble for not having sought medical assistance.

Sedated aninals etc I would, but i would have a knowledgeable about animals, sedation and animal first aid person with me, but that's heavily influenced by me being at a good level of animal husbandry knowledge myself.

I wouldn't transport a sedated horse without a vet/vet nurse - way too much risk to the horse and to whoever is nearby if they overpower it (which is common, particularly in animals who need to be sedated in the first place...) ... horses need to be awake to be able to balance on the road and on a ferry anyway, and can get breathing infections from being tied up on transport for hours... Transporting livestock may also involve permits and movement documentation etc. Even a sedated dog needs personal and constant surveillance.

No. I would offer to take the healthy non sedated animals and family members if I had the knowledge and experience and assistance to do it, I wouldn't touch the rest no matter what they threatened or how close family they are.

What happens to (possibly) unconscious person on the ferry? I suppose you have to all leave the car during the ferry trip.

wth

Surely someone who could become unconscious at any point should travel in an ambulance.social services and hospital should know how to arrange this plus it's not safe to leave children or animals in the care of someone with this condition.At what point does unconscious become a coma or death and who could live with that outcome.

No ferry company would accept an unconscious animal, let alone an unconscious person.

No registered vet would make a horse unconscious for 12 hours to travel and expect to keep their licence. Breathing problems are not the only risk, it wont be able to regulate its temperature. You'll be carrying a dead horse, and the driver is responsible for the cargo.

I couldn't possibly allow myself to be involved in this level of potential disaster.

I would reiterate my offer to move the animals and stuff, (if one of the large animals need sedating, i would talk to the vet to check this was acceptable, if it's not approved by the vet, i wouldn't do it).

I would offer support to help find solutions to moving the people, but no way could i be responsible for driving an unconscious person across country.

The only other solution i would offer, is that if the person does become unconscious, i would drive them to the nearest hospital and then continue on with the others, assuming i knew for sure, there was a responsible adult willing to assume responsibility the other end.

The person needs to understand what they are asking of you and be willing to compromise.

I would also be seriously considering involving social services, but that would depend on the situation they are moving to. If the person with the medical condition and the children will be fully supported then i may not involve ss.

I think if you row across with the chicken first, you can leave the Fox with the grain and work back from there.

At least that's what I think the question was.

I really don't think that someone would be undiagnosed if they suffered long period of unconsciousness - there would be a reason and they would have sought help. This seems a more, shall we say, chosen response to stress and if you drive them I would expect them to deploy it at some point. So don't drive them.

Their inability to organise themselves does not make it your emergency. You don't have to attend every performance a drama-llama puts on and I would certainly skip this one!

I think this may all be exaggerated in a effort to lower the costs of the trip into one vehicle and if there is any truth in it I would seriously consider alerting the appropriate authorities about the children because it would be the cause of their anxieties. What happens about school pickup, caring for the animals, etc?

The other thing I'd do is make the non-commercial driver aware of the potential risks. Surely no one in their right mind would undertake this level of irresponsibility.

Since the adult will not be paying airfare, they can afford to see a doctor and get assessed to see if they are fit to travel.
I’d be worried they’d have an attack and not wake up but die while you are driving them.

I’d also consider putting my foot down in regards to the animals. They need to rehome at least half of them.

Oh come on. If this situation is as you describe it, you need to call Social Services asap.

I agree with @NorthEndGal - use the arm drop test. Spend a day or two with them and wait for them to “lose consiouness” then do it. The reason they do it In hospitals is because people pretend to faint/ fit so frequently.

There Is a huge difference between being asleep because you’re unwell and being unconscious for hours on end. I could well believe the former.

I would actually spend enough time with them to witness it, to satisfy my own mind

OP i'm with the others, this is a terrifying mess and you do not want to be the one left holding the pieces when (not if) something goes awfully wrong.

I would really be thinking about calling in social services and the RSPCA.

To clear up a few things:

When i said big animals I was talking about them saying they could fit all in one vehicle. I was trying to say half not being guinea pig etc sized- I meant cat dog sized not horse cow size.

Not from traveling community - no horses involved.
No borders involved - but ferry is more than 30 mins, and time consuming.

The receiving end person doesn't have any money either.

I do end up wondering about the extent of the medical stuff, but then feel pretty guilty, especially after seeing radical change.

To all who've said about SS etc. There has been past involvement and questions about ability to cope, when younger assistance to cope with parenting because of medical needs, was given, that's all gone.
Aside from the chaos and the emotional effect living with it all surely must have, the children are actually very visibly clean, loved, and happy and get on well. You wouldn't think they came from a dysfunctioning life.

People asking about insurance/is it profit making etc - no- it's loved family members not managing, or there'd never have been any question. The idea of relocating is because they would get a lot more help than where they are.

I won't be driving them. Laiste got it right with why I was even giving it any consideration. Sadly someone else probably will which is where I started doubting my decision.

If it is the sort of ferry that you all need to vacate cars for they are going to run into issues if the adult is unconscious.

On the animal front, is it perhaps a mild sedation to keep them calm?
I’m struggling to figure out how other people think you’re being a drama llama and this lifestyle is normal?
SS should be aware of how these kids are living and also this person/weirdy doesn’t sound capable of looking after the animals.
I’d be calling relevant authorities and getting this shitshow sorted.

The belongings and animals (in travelling crates with water bowls) aren't an issue, the human with the medical needs should have a medical transportation vehicle with transfer nurse/paramedic. The other humans are not a problem either.