How does Jeremy Corbin justify knowing that people will never vote for his party as long as he’s heading it… but he will never leave?

[iwunderwhy]

I’m not debating whether people are right to dislike him or not BUT fairly or not he is pretty universally loathed which makes him a bit like being a 3 legged horse at the Derby.

If you're running a party, company, or country people have got to like you or at least deeply respect your talents and if neither is there surely the decent thing is to step aside.

For the life of me I can’t get my head around how anyone could keep doing this to a country they say they love. AIBU?

SummerWhisper

You can resort to the "troll" // Daily Mail allegation all you like but it's genuine question and clearly I'm not the only asking it.

Regardless of party, if you love this country any fool can see we really need viable alternatives now. The question is if he cannot win another election then why won't he step aside??

If you're so outraged or afraid of the question then feel free to jump off the thread.

The Conservatives introduced scores of socially positive policies for example by ending ‘no fault’ evictions and focusing the police on domestic abuse, that was straight from May but of course that’s not what they’re known for on here.

Maybe that’s because many of their other policies have caused untold suffering. Principally punitive and cruel cuts to welfare and the way these have been managed, and Windrush.

But for Brexit they have found billions.

Comparing Corbyn’s role to mo Mowlams and bill Clinton’s in the peace process is one of the most profoundly offensive statements I have read here.
Disgusting. Do you think this persuades anyone? No, it just makes me think again how loathesome labour and its followers have become.

As an aside, I have just found this article on Mo Mowlam and how little credit she receives.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/12/good-friday-agreement-mo-mowlam

I will vote for him and so will all of my friends and family. You’re ignorant if you believe the Tory rags.

I think he could win a general election. Last time around his Labour Party slashed the Tory majority.

Why do you think he could win an election when at his absolute peak of popularity, he lost by a significant number? I have to say, I didn’t hear a single person singing that Godawful ohhhhh Jeremy Corbyn song at Glastonbury this year and that was a massive contrast to 2017 when it was everywhere. Corbyn has peaked, he had his shot, his inaction on racism and Brexit is his legacy and no, he can’t win an election. He needs to recognise this and stand down for the sake of the party and the country.

Maybe that’s because many of their other policies have caused untold suffering

What should they have done in 2010 then, when they came to power and there was a deficit of nearly £1 trillion which had now almost been cut to zero? Carried on borrowing even more and spending it on things we can’t afford? Whilst I have great sympathy for those genuine cases of people affected by these necessary spending cuts, there were also 900,000 people who were registered as disabled who are now fit to work with resulting record employment. Labour made it far too easy for the lazy to choose a lifestyle of dependency on the state. Was it done perfectly? No. Was the situation perfect before? No!

McDonnel states that austerity was a political choice not a necessity, it shows how economically incompetent and dangerous he is. Austerity is one of the most unpopular political actions in living memory and caused Tory support to drop significantly especially for the 2017 snap election. Why on earth would anyone choose to do that if they didn’t need to there was no benefit other than to reduce the defecit they inherited from Labour. If they hadn’t needed to do austerity Corbyn would have lost 2017 by even more.

It's not enough to be loved by a proportion of his own party. He needs to be seen as a viable choice to those who might vote Labour for the first time. And there is absolutely nothing about him that will draw people who are potential swing voters.

Labour needs a leader who acts like a leader and gives people hope.

he's shockingly bad at reaching out to people who aren't already his core supporters. He's not bringing the party together but making it more cliquey.

@TigerSnooze made my point better

“You’re ignorant if you believe the Tory rags”
Behold another genius of persuasion at work.
They’re not terribly likeable these people, are they? The thought of living next door to one - yuk. Thank god I live in a solid Tory area.

@TheBigBallOfOil nice work!
Unfortunately we do live in a very Tory dominated area. Bleugh!

Thank god I live in a solid Tory area

I'd second that it's a likely a true blessing from the Gods that we don't live next to each other.

people will never vote for his party as long as he’s heading it

It’s like the last GE never happened. Biggest gain in vote share for decades... but apparently people won’t vote for Corbyn’s labour. Do you not remember election night, or the shocked commentary the following day?

Some people have very short memories.

Plus the fact you can criticise Corbyn while our country is being run by Boris fucking Johnson is outright insane.

Thank god I live in a solid Tory area.

Oh yes, Tory voting is the preserve of the sort of kind, empathetic, decent selfless people one wants to be around.

🙄

DH is fairly left wing and was delighted when Corbyn became leader.. He's become disenchanted since then and now said he wouldn't vote in a GE. DH thinks Mcdonnell is truly dangerous with his Communist outlook and would wreck the economy.

I'm more middle of the road, I didn't like Blair or Brown and I'm not sure about Corbyn. I find most politicians are duplicitous and are in it for their own benefit.

The leader of the opposition isn't just about the party policies. If you're the leader of the opposition, you're potentially the next Prime Minister. The UK's representative on the international stage, the "face" of the country.

Corbyn - whatever you think of his policies - comes across as dithery, unprofessional, no leadership qualities, just a bit of a shambles really.

Hes's dithered over the anti-semitism stuff and his words don't match his actions. "we won't tolerate...." yet then when something emerges, he ignores it.

And as for John McDonnel's statements this week on a potential further independence referendum for Scotland totally undermining Scottish Labour - the lot of them couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery never mind run the country.

And agree about Mo Mowlam. That woman was a force of nature and her loss is very strongly felt - whatever party you vote for.

It's no good harking back to 2017. A LOT has happened in the last 2 years. Even then, Labour did better than expected because they picked off the low-hanging fruit, mainly in university towns where students were attracted by the promise to abolish tuition fees - and the suggestion that Lab would 'look into' cancelling student debt. And many Remainers voted Labour because they thought Labour would keep us in a customs union with a close relationship to the single market.

We didn't win. We even lost seats in the midlands. The seats we need to win will be much more difficult. Tories will have to vote Labour. Fat chance of that with Corbyn, McDonnell etc at the helm.

And we now know much more about Corbyn. His incompetence. The anti-semitism scandal. His reactions to the Skripal poisoning, the Russian involvement in the bombing of the UN aid convoy and his silence when Assad was using chemical warfare on his own people.

46% of those who voted Labour In 2017 won't do it again. Nearly half of his members think he's doing a crap job. Think about those figures.

He's been a part-time Leader of the Opposition at best. There's no way he could put in the hours that Theresa May did. He's bad enough asking questions at PMQs - reading from a script written by someone else. Just imagine how he'd flounder if he were on the other side of the aisle and had to answer them.

Sorry - but as Attlee would have said, 'Not up to the job'.

He's very marmite - people either love him or hate him.

Unfortunately what those that love him fail to see is that he won't win a General Election with only their support.

Which makes Labour's policies totally pointless - you can have the most fantastic left wing manifesto the world has ever seen, but if you're not in Government none of it will ever come to pass.

His supporters go back to the 2017 GE as evidence of wider support - however they don't seem to understand that public opinion has shifted quite a lot since then. It's like the Tories thinking Boris has wide appeal because he won the London mayoral elections - opinion has shifted on Boris too. This is the problem when people are in bubbles - they miss these big shifts.

You would think that a terrible opposition would be something to rejoice in,yet it almost seems like they are worried about him getting into power. What with him leading the largest political party in Europe. No matter how many MN trolls post anti-JC/Labour posts he will be the PM. Suck it up trolls.

^ Case in point. MN is generally left leaning on average. Probably centre-left if we took a poll across everyone. Yet anyone who disagrees with Corbyn being leader is a 'troll' or a 'Tory'.

Despite all polls showing that there isn't a cat in hell's chance of JC being PM his supporters live in a bubble of delusion.

There's more chance of Labour becoming the UK's 3rd party after the Lib Dem's than winning a GE IMO.

It's a very weird time in British political history at the moment - the time of the cults - Brexit and Corbyn. Facts don't apply.

...one last thing. As it happens I'm on forums for all the main parties on Facebook.

In the Tory forums they are willing JC to stay in because he is doing them a favour. They're more focused on the Lib Dem's stealing seats from them now.

In Labour's forums hardly any decent discussion takes place because almost every post ends up in a scrum between #JC4PM and Blairites/centre left/Tom Watson supporters.

That's not how it works. Labour members can get rid of him themselves, they don't have to wait for him to step down. He's not Jeremy Stalin.

Personally i feel hugely betrayed by him pushing genderism and magical thinking on AWS as well as failing to address antisemitism at all. Can't understand why he hasn't faced a recent leadership challenge. He only survived the first two due to the shine not having rubbed off so early on.

I agree with you OP. I'm a lifelong Labour voter but won't vote for them in the next GA because of Corbyn and Momentum. Anti-semitic, anti-women - no thank you.

@SummerWhisper

You would think that a terrible opposition would be something to rejoice in, yet it almost seems like they are worried about him getting into power. What with him leading the largest political party in Europe. No matter how many MN trolls post anti-JC/Labour posts he will be the PM. Suck it up trolls.

An't gonna happen. Corbyn will NEVER be PM.

NEVER.

@SummerWhisper

I always suspect threads like this are trolls or are paid for surveys. However, just to correct you, Jeremy Corbyn is not universally loathed. He is, however, loathed by people who want to keep offshoring their taxes while benefitting from the public services that our taxes pay for. He is loathed by people who don't believe in public ownership of assets such as health, education, transport and utilities, likely because they have stakeholder shares in them. He is loathed by people who don't believe in community wealth building, likely because they are profiteering and exploitative business owners, landowners or landlords. Frankly, if you are not in the 1% of rising millionaires, billionaires and trillionaires who loathe him because he is out to put an end to their corrupt, imperialist, money laundering offshore activities that detract from society rather than add to it, as the 99% of us do through our taxes,, then you are a tool. And one more thing: so often people complain that "politicians are all the same, they are corrupt, they lie, they cheat their expenses, they steal, they can't be trusted" and along comes the most genuine, kind-hearted, community-focused, most honest politician who wants everybody to have a share of the wealth that we produce through our own labour and the froth brigade are like "oh he's loathesome isn't he?". Wake up.

@Alltheprettyseahorses

Yeah, SummerWhisper. Corbyn is genuine and honest - except for all the times he lies and breaks promises. He's kind-hearted - except for all the times he's lunged at female journos or uses racist slurs against Jewish people. Community minded - if there's a good photo-op in it, otherwise he is invisible. What a joke!

What I really don't get is all the 'I luffs Corbyn' that (very, very few) people spout. He's just some grubby old career politician who's had his snout in the trough for nearly 40 years with nothing to show for it except a significantly lower than average voting attendance and a now almost non-existent constituent response rate and a significantly higher than average expenses claim record, as shown on 'they work for you' etc. Why would you love him? That's a bit weird. And no, he isn't loved in Liverpool.

I will say that no, I don't hate him. I just find him pathetic. Often it's like he's trolling us. Look at the other week when there were questions about how compos mentis he is and what does he do? He locks his wife in the porch! He just needs to go. What a disappointment.

@Shortstuff99

SummerWhisper, could you write a more ‘student politics’ cliches divisive load of old rubbish if you tried?

Corbyn is a joke, he is hated by the rich and the poor alike, as a result of being a racist, terrorist sympathiser who hates things like the monarchy and has shown support for the IRA. If it’s only the 1% who fear him then what’s the problem, everyone over 18 can vote in this country.

It’s the mark of the weakness of your position that you accuse those who dare disagree with you of being trolls. Corbyn is the troll, he is an disruptive agitator who has never achieved anything other than voting with the Tories 650 times, wrecking labour and allowing it to be infiltrated by ineffective Marxist wannabes, allowing a likely hard Brexit by refusing to back the least bad option, allowing blatant racism to fester in his party, losing a general election, and allowing the worst Tory leadership/ government ever to stay in office.

Great posts 'Shortstuff' and 'alltheseahorses.' Agree with all of this.

Corbyn has you suitably brainwashed @SummerWhisper How sad for you. Also quite disturbing, because you do really actually totally believe the crap you are spouting don't you???

I loathe Corbyn SO much, that I would vote for Boris Johnson in the next election, rather than Corbyn.

Corbyn has always hated the EU, but now he is saying he loves them - because he thinks that will garner support and votes for him. And that is just one of MANY negatives about the man, that have been mentioned throughout the thread. Horrible, disingenuous, fake, narcissistic, vile little oik he is. And those are his GOOD points.

As someone said upthread, is Corbyn the best thing to happen to Labour party? NO. But he is definitely the best thing to happen to the Conservative party. They must be pissing themselves laughing at Corbyn being the leader, and refusing to budge. Conservatives will stay in power, as long as Labour have Corbyn as leader. That's for sure.

So all of you people who think Corbyn walks on water, I hope you're proud of yourselves. You supporting Corbyn is killing the Labour party, and keeping the Conservatives in power.

The Corbynites are like a cult. They are batshit, they believe their own bullshit, and they call anyone who doesn't think like them a bigot, a racist, a troll, stupid, thick, daily mail reader... the list goes on.

Corbynites are so out of touch with reality, and spout SO much shit, that I think they are beyond help. We should pity them really. Corbyn has them under his spell. It's quite terrifying really.