...to think she shouldn't be leaving her kids?

[Biiscuits]

I have a friend, who has a boy and a girl aged 9 and 12. The girl has learning difficulties.

She's a single mum, no dad, and works full time- proper full time- out the house 8-6. She's leaving the kids home alone these holidays every day.

I think they're far too young and not remotely sensible enough.

AIBU?

Is your neighbour from Eastern Europe?

You what, @Hollyhobbi?

I'm not judging- I'm worried sick!

If she can't afford childcare what are her options?

If it's not illegal then I think it should be. A 12 year-old isn't responsible enough yet to be left alone with a 9 yo.

The mum needs to contact social services to ask about support. She could be entitled to direct payments to cover childcare costs because of special needs.

Some 12 yd olds are very sensible and certainly capable of watching younger siblings. My almost 13 yr old frequently looks after my 5&3 yr olds while I'm at work and she is in very high demand for babysitting in our neighborhood. I expect this mum has weighed up the risks & made a decision based on knowing her kids better than you do.

She does have to work to keep a roof over their heads, I appreciate that.

So do I. My DC go to summer camp! I can't offer to help unfortunately but I would if I could.

Are you in the same position as her though? Do you have a partner, or support from your children’s father if you’re separated? Do you have a better paid job?

If she’s single and in a minimum wage job with no support from family she’s in a totally different position to someone in a two income family and a good wage. Just because Summer Camp is affordable for you doesn’t mean it is for her.

Alexa, do you have any experience of direct payments? In my profession I support people receiving DP and I’ve never come across anyone receiving them to pay for childcare, even if the client has disabilities? This would amount to a 50 hour a week package based on the OP describing the full time hours mum works and for me would be absolutely unheard of? Just wondering if it’s different for your LA?

Your 12 yr old is a babysitter???

My almost 13 yr old frequently looks after my 5&3 yr olds

And just out of interest what would your 12 year old do if one of the little ones was choking?

Wow, instead of judging and sneering at a lone parent who works and may not be able to afford childcare or a fucking Summer camp why not seek out ways to help her?

She would use the first aid shes been taught & call an ambulance. Lots of the babysitter's where I live around 12 and 13 years old. I'm not in the UK. Once they get to 11 they can do a babysitting course & a Home Alone course. She's also learning to be a lifeguard so she's pretty confident with CPR

Bloody hell - I probably wouldn't trust a UK 12yr old with my dog!

I was a baby sitter regularly when I was 12. I had one job where my moms friend paid me £20 a week to pick up her 5 year old and 8 year old from school and look after them till she was home from work (about 5:30pm).
This was in the early 1990s. I guess times have changed. I obviously don’t know the needs of the 9 year old or how sensible the 12 year old is but it sounds ok. Mind you saying that a whole day is different to a couple of hours. It’s a difficult one. I’m sure this mum wouldn’t do it if she had other choices.

fornerbabe Need-to-know: is my child ready to be left alone?
There is no legal age at which children may be left home alone, but parents can be prosecuted for neglect if it puts them at risk of injury or suffering.
from NSPCC.
And yes- btw I have also worked for last 20 years with CIN and this is not an obvious case.
There are other families that need a whole lot more help than this mother providing for her children.

There are many ways to raise kids, some better than others, some more ideal than others. When you actually think about it, there’s really no reason 2 kids of that age can’t learn to be ok without a parent minding them. I used to head off down the fields for hours without parents from about age 7 and would have been very insulted to have been told I was too young to mind myself. What actually are 9 and 12 yr olds incapable of doing? They can feed themselves, work the TV, use a phone, clean and tidy, sort their own arguments, use appliances. Someone’s going to start going on about sense and safety etc but kids are capable of a lot if they’d be let.

I think that family could be managing just fine. If they are loved and happy, maybe those kids are doing excellently in their daytime roles. It’s not beyond the realms of possibility.

My almost 13 yr old frequently looks after my 5&3 yr olds while I'm at work and she is in very high demand for babysitting in our neighborhood.

She's too young to be doing that and it's unfair on her. Pay for proper childcare and stop taking advantage of extensive free childcare from your older child.

My parents did this. I cared for my younger sister all day from when she was five and I was nine, all day and most weekend nights too - how about that for the pp who doesn't believe this can happen? I resent them for it. It wasn't right. Then there's the fact that they took years of free childcare from me and then whinged like fuck if I ever asked them to babysit for my kids.

Children should not be providing extensive childcare for younger children.

Society has to decide whether to assist parents to work by providing affordable childcare, or stop forcing them to work when there isn't any affordable childcare by supporting them.

We live in the 7th wealthiest nation on Earth. Women shouldn't have to choose between being homeless or leaving their kids while they work.

Maybe she can't afford childcare but has to work to keep a roof over their heads

I'm glad you said that.

Way back in the dark ages, my 11-year-old brother looked after me all summer long while our mother was at work, and he had a broken arm at the time.

I think people severely underestimate the abilities of children and needs of lone parents.

So the 9 year old is with a 12 year old with learning difficulties ?

My almost 13 yr old frequently looks after my 5&3 yr olds while I'm at work and she is in very high demand for babysitting in our neighborhood

For a whole day or a couple of hours?

@formerbabe

I think 12 is on the cusp of being fine.

She has learning difficulties, of course it's not fine.

My almost 13 yr old frequently looks after my 5&3 yr olds while I'm at work

The reality is her situation doesn't matter if her children are in danger. SS aren't going to go 'oh well you're struggling so let's forget about the kids' also OP isn't responsible for her situation. She is morally responsible for reporting or flagging a situation which could endanger children. She doesn't need to offer this woman a solution. She's got her own kids to deal with.